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novicius
November 8th, 2017, 07:42 AM
Much to the hate of KillerB & most folks here :D Honda quietly pushed their Honda Sports EV Concept out of a trailer and into the SEMA show:

http://gtxforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=2717&stc=1

http://gtxforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=2718&stc=1

http://gtxforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=2719&stc=1


The Sports EV doesn't have an interior yet it was a quicker six-month project compared with the 12 months dedicated to the Urban EV and very little has been revealed about its underpinnings, other than that it will "combine EV performance and artificial intelligence inside a compact body with the aim to realize the joy of driving with a sense of unity with the car."

The concept's grille can also send out messages to other road users via digital word displays to reassure them of its intentions.
Obviously I'm onboard the all-electric train. Looking forward to seeing how Honda makes the 100% torque/no gearing/low range model work. :lol: :up:

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 08:09 AM
Ha. They won't.

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 09:27 AM
:lol: #hater

185 kW motor + beefy six-speed trans + some crazy-high 5.66 final drive? It's gonna have an uber-low CG from the get-go.

If ANY electric car builder has small-form low-power sports car pretensions, they gotta have super-steep gears to justify a six-speed transmission. #justsayin

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 09:38 AM
I love everything about the concept and the specs... what I doubt is Honda's ability to execute. That thing is going to end up with an 85kw motor, a 20kwh battery, six front grills, a third row seat, a hatchback, and right hand drive. And I don't mean the steering wheel will be on the right side, I mean only the right side wheels will be driven. It's going to be the CR-Z all over again. A spiritual successor to the CRX as viewed by a time traveler from a dystopian future where everything sucks.

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 09:40 AM
Those specs are not official, they were mine -- pulled straight out of my wittle heart's secret desires.

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 09:46 AM
I know, but mine weren't. I read Honda's mind. They're already working on the chrome for the 4th grille. Two more to go.

Crazed_Insanity
November 8th, 2017, 09:49 AM
Looks good.

I remember CRZ looked good as a concept, but in reality it wasn't that attractive and pretty average in performance.

Let's see what they can do with this...

Low range really is a non-issue for me. Clarity EV's 89 mile EPA range is quite sufficient for me. My longest round trip so far is from my house to UCI... about 90 miles round trip. I made that trip with the whole family with AC on and with a few % of charge to spare. I can easily cover the entire LA county with this range... and most likely you won't be going out of town with that 2 seater sports car...

So if it can be fun to drive and more efficient than the Clarity EV, I wouldn't mind getting one for my commute. Clarity EV is still a 4000+ lbs beast. Yeah, it's clean and more efficient than ICE, but for my personal commute, I should be driving something smaller...

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 09:53 AM
I know, but mine weren't.
Yeah but I really like the CR-Z, so... :) #badtaste

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 10:00 AM
Have you actually driven one, though?

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 10:04 AM
Nope, just watched vids -- but then I owned a heavy 180ish HP R53 MINI Cooper S with a very dead throttle-by-wire feel for six years so that's probably going to color my expectations, Mr. Swedepower. ;)

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 10:48 AM
Even the NA mini is spritely, and while the throttle "feel" kinda sucks the steering is spot on and there's a good sense of connection between driver and car. The CR-Z has no such redeeming quality - driving a CR-Z is like driving an RC car. You have steering and throttle, but zero feel. Worse is Honda's wretched IMA to mess with throttle transitions. The worst thing about IMA - IMHO - is that when brand new it seems really slick. Sometime later - by 30k for sure - engine starts are straight up jarring. I don't love Synergy, but IMA makes Synergy feel downright elegant.

Thing is, as an appliance I'm sure you get used to it and it's surely fine - like a Prius is fine - but any sort of spirited driving? It sucks. The CR-Z failed to nail subcompact commuter like and failed to nail almost sports car. While the CRX distanced itself positively from a Civic, the CRZ is just a Civic with less space.

I feel like that's Honda's sad modern story. Excluding the S2000, Honda's only real successful introduction of the last two decades is the CR-V. The Crosstour sucked. The CR-Z sucked. The Element started strong but ended weak. The (2nd gen) Insight was a straight up embarrassment. Honda has great ideas but, apparently, criminal execution. I just can't hold my breath for a right side drive Sports EV.

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 11:10 AM
I hear you AND I believe you -- but I also have zero feel. :lol: #stonehands

MR2 Fan
November 8th, 2017, 11:49 AM
The CR-Z also looked like it had Down syndrome

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 11:53 AM
People, the point isn't to bag the CR-Z, the point is to wildly WILDLY speculate on what the Sports EV Concept is gonna have! :lol:

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 12:06 PM
But, I already told you. Not enough power, not enough style, not enough fun, not even enough cute. It's going to ugly, overweight, underpowered, overpractical, underfun. It's the Honda way.

Crazed_Insanity
November 8th, 2017, 12:19 PM
Unfortunately I have neither driven the CRZ nor any of the Insights so I can't compare them to the Clarity EV...

However, I do have the S2000 and used to have a 1990 Civic Hatchback.... that's almost like the CRX! ;)

Like I've said in other threads, other than the fugly look, Clarity EV has exceeded all my expectations! Considering Clarity is a 3 in 1 platform that also need to accommodate to fuel cells and the plugin hybrid's ICE... Clarity EV is really a compromise. There's a huge empty volume in its engine compartment. The car could've been a lot smaller or more efficient...

If Honda builds a dedicated EV with short wheelbase, I think chances are good that they can execute decently this time... I think Honda is slowly turning the ship around... Anyway, all of my changed feelings are all based on my satisfaction with the Clarity EV. If only they could build a better looking car, I might even stop pining for the Model 3.

I give it better than 50/50 odds that this thing will turn out good, should they choose to turn it out!

novicius
November 8th, 2017, 12:25 PM
It's the Honda way.
:lol:

C'mon, the new Honda Civic Type-R was a finalist in Road & Track's 2018 Performance Car of the Year (http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a13132962/2018-performance-car-of-the-year/). The NSX is a monster and did the Accord ever go away? Honda is on a roll right now, sporty-car-wise.

The team that dusted off the CR-Z Concept and approved that car has long since been blown up and scattered. It's a fun punching bag but it's like making Ace Ventura jokes at a party -- just means you're old. ;)

TheBenior
November 8th, 2017, 12:36 PM
You're so excited about this that I can see you trading in both your Chevrolet Code 130R AND your Nissan IDX Nismo!

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 01:45 PM
:lol:

C'mon, the new Honda Civic Type-R was a finalist in Road & Track's 2018 Performance Car of the Year (http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a13132962/2018-performance-car-of-the-year/). The NSX is a monster and did the Accord ever go away? Honda is on a roll right now, sporty-car-wise.

Yeah, but those are all old nameplates, cars that have evolved over time, and generally in a positive direction. What new car has Honda made in the last two decades - S2000 excluded - that was actually worth a damn*? The Ridgeline? :lol:

I do agree Honda is aggressively trying to fix its shit as the Type R suggests (I hate it, but I won't argue its chops) and maybe the Clarity is the Prius competitor Honda has been trying to produce for 15 years, but I'm sure as hell not getting my hopes up. My best case is it's the 1.0 turbo S660 that was suggested but we never got. Maybe Japan will end up with a sweet Sports EV. Maybe. Us? No way. Not gonna happen! :P Our next Honda is going to be an electric HR-V.


The team that dusted off the CR-Z Concept and approved that car has long since been blown up and scattered. It's a fun punching bag but it's like making Ace Ventura jokes at a party -- just means you're old. ;)

I will happily punch at the Element, Ridgeline, Crosstour, Insight, or CR-Z. All horrible, in the end.

I sure hope the CR-Z team got scattered. What a craptastropiece.

* Edit: I forgot the Pilot. They seemed to get that generally right. Pretty good all said and done.

* Edit 2: Does the Fit count? I don't know when it came out... Y2K? Another good Honda. But the misses outweigh the hits. Or, alternately phrased, even a broken watch is right twice a day.

TheBenior
November 8th, 2017, 02:42 PM
The current gen, 2016+ Pilot is woefully behind the competition in handling, braking, and the 9 speed auto in higher trims is constantly hunting for gears.

It's not just auto journalists saying that either; my father criticised the sloppy handling and transmission and he hasn't driven a remotely sporty car in over a decade.

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 03:01 PM
Well, it started strong! How old is the current Pilot, and what is its current competition? I seriously have no idea where that thing even slots in anymore.

TheBenior
November 8th, 2017, 03:40 PM
2016 was the first model year for the current gen Pilot. Its competition is the long in the tooth but still better Toyota Highlander, the new VW Atlas, Ford Explorer, Chevy Traverse, Mazda CX-9, and something else that I'm sure that I'm forgetting.

Yw-slayer
November 8th, 2017, 04:31 PM
TSG. Nsx, bro.

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 06:34 PM
2016 was the first model year for the current gen Pilot. Its competition is the long in the tooth but still better Toyota Highlander, the new VW Atlas, Ford Explorer, Chevy Traverse, Mazda CX-9, and something else that I'm sure that I'm forgetting.

I did not realize it had gotten that big... I would have imagined more in some null space between Escape and Explorer. But, maybe that segment is just weird, because I'd never peg the Highlander as competition for the Traverse, so WTF do I know? :D

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 06:44 PM
TSG. Nsx, bro.

You lost me.

dodint
November 8th, 2017, 06:50 PM
Nope, just watched vids -- but then I owned a heavy 180ish HP R53 MINI Cooper S with a very dead throttle-by-wire feel for six years so that's probably going to color my expectations, Mr. Swedepower. ;)

What the ever loving fuck is this libelous dreck?

Blaspheme.

TheBenior
November 8th, 2017, 07:34 PM
I did not realize it had gotten that big... I would have imagined more in some null space between Escape and Explorer. But, maybe that segment is just weird, because I'd never peg the Highlander as competition for the Traverse, so WTF do I know? :D

Though it's grown over the years, the Pilot was always a big 3 row crossover. My father had a first gen 2005, but hasn't liked the subsequent redesigns.

thesameguy
November 8th, 2017, 07:55 PM
Yeah, I've only ever spent time in the 1st gen ones. I always felt they were smaller than the big crossovers like the Traverse, but that's just perception. Back in the aughts, the Pilot was quite a bit better than the Traverse and more crossover-y than the Explorer. Around the teens when the Explorer got fancy and the Traverse got fixed, the Pilot felt to me like it fell out of that class, but I do get it. I recall a coworker traded his '07 for a 1st year 2nd gen ('09?) and it did not feel like a step up. The styling I thought was quite appalling and I lost interest. He did too, apparently, because he dumped it quickly for a Jeep Commander Overland - which was kinda badass. :lol: I seriously didn't even know they still made the Pilot. I've never seen a 3rd gen.

dodint
November 8th, 2017, 08:16 PM
My Mom has one. I think she's had one of each gen, actually.

Phil_SS
November 9th, 2017, 04:40 AM
If they make it look like it does in the pictures (Not Carlo's 3D rendering, wtflolbbq!) then I am interested. :)

The Urban EV concept is pretty cool looking as well. :up:

Hopefully with the advent of electric the battery+electric motor combo will lend itself to better looking cars. Maybe they will have more freedom. :random:

novicius
November 9th, 2017, 05:29 AM
Sorry about that -- corrected! :up:

Ignoring all the blather about the Honda... Pilot :erm: I enjoy seeing more and more companies throw their hat into the attempt at making a battery-powered sports car. It is an effort to be cheered, not derided. :toast:

Yw-slayer
November 9th, 2017, 06:14 AM
You lost me.

You said Honda hasn't made anything worth of note over the last 2 decades, and you left out the new Nsx.

thesameguy
November 9th, 2017, 07:54 AM
You said Honda hasn't made anything worth of note over the last 2 decades, and you left out the new Nsx.

No, I said Honda hasn't introduced any worthwhile nameplates in two decades. The NSX is from the '90s IIRC. :P

dodint
November 9th, 2017, 08:22 AM
Has the new NSX been released? Must've missed it.

21Kid
November 9th, 2017, 08:22 AM
Yeah but I really like the CR-Z, so... :) #badtaste
The final CR-Z?!?!? :?:twitch:

MR2 Fan
November 9th, 2017, 08:48 AM
Has the new NSX been released? Must've missed it.

for a few months now, yep

dodint
November 9th, 2017, 08:49 AM
I went to PIAS last winter and literally walked right by that car without seeing it.

Crazed_Insanity
November 9th, 2017, 09:21 AM
It's that beautiful, heh?

TheBenior
November 9th, 2017, 11:28 AM
The final CR-Z?!?!? :?:twitch:
The only CR-Z.

I looked the styling on the CR-Z, but it couldn't out-autocross a Mazda2 and only got 3 mpg better.

novicius
November 9th, 2017, 11:42 AM
The final CR-Z?!?!? :?:twitch:
Yep. :)

Eh, there's too much car-shaming going on, I'm definitely sorry I took the bait.

thesameguy
November 9th, 2017, 03:01 PM
I couldn't out autocross a Mazda2 either. :(