2013 Malibu Rental Edition

[thesameguy]

I spent the last two days and 400 miles in a rental Malibu going back and forth to Tahoe. The only cars everything I needed would fit would have been the Suburban or the Saab, and the Suburban is No Fun and the Saab about two months overdue for an oil change, I used up some Hertz rewards points, got me a Malibu.

I've actually not driven these "new" Malibus, and I gotta say even the stripped rental car is pretty nice. I imagine people getting into the first Malibus thought the same thing - then everything went wrong. The '13 has nice fit & finish, quality-feeling materials, doors that open and close solidly. They look good on the outside, the inside seems to have taken cues from other GM cars, notably the wheel/cluster from the Camaro. Not exactly to my taste, but regardless nice looking. My parents have a '13 Fusion, and frankly I like it better - the Malibu is definitely flashier with a weird vent feature wrapping around the dashboard and various silver-painted plastics, but the Fusion feels more European - slightly understated and muted. I had no problem getting comfortable, and honestly the Malibu might be the more comfortable car - I felt the seats/wheel/pedals were impossibly spot-on for a big American sedan, which I've never quite felt in the Fusion. The Fusion is definitely more to my Mom's taste and sense of comfort, though, so I guess that's what counts! The seats themselves were comfortable even on two hour hustles and had just the right amount of lateral support - I wasn't going anywhere, but I could feel there was still room for a big lazy American. That said, they certainly felt a lot smaller than the seats in a Malibu of ten years ago. The cabin is whisper quiet, which seems to be a recent GM hallmark. Just the slightest tire noise and a little engine noise when pushed, but pretty darned quiet.

The 2.5l Ecotec is definitely peppier than the 2.3 Duratec, but maybe not in any sort of practical way. Neither car is fast, both are adequate. Throttle response was quite good for what I'm sure is a DBW configuration - possibly better than the Solstice was, although that might be related to the turbo. I had no problem passing on uphill grades with a little planning, but the giant heavy car and little motor were not a good combo for last minute decisions. The 6-speed auto is pretty badass, though, doing not only a good job of learning my driving quickly but also having a crazy-low 6th hear. 75mph is about 2k - 65mph is like 1700rpm! Driving through the mountains I was almost never in 6th, but getting to the mountains almost entirely. Seems fair! The manual mode is a joke - hugely delayed shifts and ergonomic issue (which I'll touch on it a second). As is common, I found about zero reason to use it anyway.

I was pretty impressed with the handling of the thing - acceptable understeer, very flat cornering (and I was frequenrtly pushing it), and surprising grip from whatever all-seasons+38psi were on the car. On a couple of the more "abrupt" corners (35mph-warned turns immediately at the end of a downhill passing lane...) I initially felt I was probably going into too fast, but no complaints or worry whatsoever. The ride was just the right amount of firm - broadly comfortable, and never wallowy. Overall, I'd say the Malibu compared pretty favorably to my friend's '11 528xi in the ride & handling department. Of course it's FWD and that must be accounted for, but I can't see anyone shopping this class of car being disappointed in it. Driving on the freeway - even not the smoothest freeway - felt a lot like driving on glass. Just smooth and quiet. Of course, the downside of that is there isn't much sensation to warn you you're going 90 and not 70. Heh.

I know 50 pretty well at this point so there really wasn't much opportunity to really hammer on the brakes. I was driving quickly, but not recklessly. The grades aren't steep enough where you really need brakes to control you, and even those abrupt turns I previously mentioned aren't that bad. As I used them, they slowed me down when I needed them to, so whatever.

Overall, I was impressed by the thing - but as always there are some areas were I feel GM just totally screwed the pooch. I'll mention my car was defective - the "Service Stabilitrak" warning kept popping up and disappearing, the speedometer flaked out a few times, at least four times I either lost power or the brakes applied momentarily... I *think* probably the brakes, as that would make sense in combination with the stability control and speedometer issue, but who knows? That stuff aside -

The park brake is electronic, like in many recent European cars. Except rather than tie the thing to the Park position, it's a button you push down or lift up. The button has shitty response, you can hear the brake apply and release, and it is not fast. I found the shift to drive, push the button, and wait for release to be very annoying. Nobody wants to wait for release. The shift position indicator is not spaced the same the as shifter - in indicated low, you're in neutral. I found that very distracting. The center console narrows and they ran out of room to make the indicator move in step, but they could have made the indicator narrower or removed it altogether and put a digital readout in the cluster. The solution is dumb. The ignition switch is impossibly close to the steering wheel for no good reason. The transmission manumatic mode is ridiculous - the shifter goes all the way back and then buttons on the top are up and down gears. There is no way any human could grasp the shifter and use his thumb for shifting because it's so far back and the center console is in the way. The only way to shift the thing is to poke the buttons with your index finger. This is easily Top 5 Dumbest Ergonomic Mistakes Ever. And, finally, the high beam switch is just a contact switch rather than a position switch and while it's push forward to engage, you can push or pull to clear. I imagine it's something you get used to, but I've always enjoyed in German cars you can immediately tell whether the high beams are on or off simply by feeling the position of the switch - but otherwise the push forward is annoying and awkward. Making the Malibu's switch an annoying push forward and then eliminating the fact that it's position has changed is a failure of logic. Derp.

All that said, I actually think I like the '13 Malibu better than the '13 Fusion. Kind of no surprise as the '13 Fusion is a much older car. However, the '13 Malibu is no comparison to the '14 Fusion which - IMHO - trumps it in every regard. Family sedan leapfrog at its finest!

[Yw-slayer]

None of them can even compare with the 2015 Legacy!

[thesameguy]

As far as I'm concerned, the Subaru Legacy died in 2009. The only thing 2010+ Legacys have in terms of fun are the F and the U. In 2015, the only non-premium midsized vehicles I'd consider are domestics. That's a whole lotta crazy!

[KillerB]

What about the Mazda6? It gets excellent reviews, though the lack of a premium engine option is a bummer.

[Yw-slayer]

I agree with you about the best Legacy having died in 2009, but then again, I'm slightly biased.

[thesameguy]

I haven't driven it, but it splits the cost of the Malibu and the Fusion, and I don't see how it could be a better value than the Malibu or a better car than the Fusion. Not to say it's a bad choice, only that given the other entries in the field, it doesn't bring enough special sauce to appeal to me. In an extreme sense, it might be a better drive, but not in any practical sense. Plus, I don't really care for how it looks.

[Yw-slayer]

4WD RALLY APPEAL BRA

But yeah, I can see what you mean. I do think it at least looks better than the last-gen Legacy (which is still being sold in Japan and overseas) aka "The Toad".

[CudaMan]

You know what rental really surprised/impressed me? The mechanically-updated Avenger. Good torque, power, and fuel economy, pretty good throttle/transmission calibration, excellent ergonomic decisions and good overall interior materials. The exterior still looked like already-dated American cobble-together styling, but under the skin there was some real thought and engineering put into that car. Unexpected. Ten thousand times better than the Camry for example.

[thesameguy]

I keep wanting to drive one of those. Somewhere I read a review that commented that if the Avenger got the Dart's styling treatment and the Dart got the Avenger's well-thought-outed-ness they'd both be really decent cars.

Back in the day you could always count on Budget to rent ChryCo products, but now all the agencies are all mercenary and you can't rely on any of them to rep a single brand's products. The "full size" I reserved at Hertz was either going to be the Malibu, an Altima, or a Camry. Three brand possibilities in one class at one location. Grrr. (I was actually trying to get a Focus for its hatchback - they had none)

I think I'll have another load of stuff going up in a couple weeks and need something that can carry a ~46" flat panel. This particular Hertz is two miles from my house so I'll probably rent a small SUV... although maybe I'll try for the Focus again. Ha... "try for a Focus." That just sounds silly.

[Random]

Are there any HHHRRRRRs left in the fleets?

[thesameguy]

Not that I've seen. I don't even know when the last one of those was made... '11?

[Random]

Probably not 46" between the towers, anyway.

Most minivans are, though, if you don't want to SUV it up the hill.

[CudaMan]

I wasn't impressed with the Focus 5-door I rented either. Granted it wasn't the ST but still, it was noisy, harsh, and not very pleasant in general.

Yeah, I'm that guy now who is picky about his rentals. :p

[Crazed_Insanity]

Never rented a Fusion nor Malibu. Have you driven the Altima? My recent rental was Nissan Altima and I don't particularly like its styling inside or out..., but it's mpg# is amazing to me. For such a huge car, it can do 36mpg on long trips. Even combining all the local surface street driving, I'm still averaging like 32mpg! It's handling is pretty decent too for a sedan. Just wondering how does it compare to other similar size sedans.

[thesameguy]

I wasn't impressed with the Focus 5-door I rented either. Granted it wasn't the ST but still, it was noisy, harsh, and not very pleasant in general.

Yeah, I'm that guy now who is picky about his rentals. :p

Meh, it's your money. I look at rentals as a way to get in touch with how the other half lives. Well, the other third anyway. Not the people driving Mercedes and not the people living their lives one (or 10) '80s cars at a time. The other people. If it wasn't for rentals, I'd literally have no idea how most people get around. :lol: I'd never own a Malibu, but hells yeah I'll rent one!

As for the Focus, I've driven a Titanium with a manual and an ST and I broadly liked them both. Well, I really liked the ST, but the Titanium was totally decent. I've not driven the shitty rental edition with the worst motor and the DSG. I'm assuming the drivetrain will be mostly like the Fiesta - which was that car's big letdown. But the Focus does have a hatch (:up:) and does get good mileage (:up:) so that's what I was going for. I am really liking the minivan idea though - I always forget about renting them... other cars I am totally happy to rent because I'd never own one. Last minivan I was in was in '05 - maybe it's time to revisit! :)


Never rented a Fusion nor Malibu. Have you driven the Altima? My recent rental was Nissan Altima and I don't particularly like its styling inside or out..., but it's mpg# is amazing to me. For such a huge car, it can do 36mpg on long trips. Even combining all the local surface street driving, I'm still averaging like 32mpg! It's handling is pretty decent too for a sedan. Just wondering how does it compare to other similar size sedans.

I had one for a couple days almost exactly a year ago, and one for a couple weeks in, what, '09? Basically the last two versions. I really liked the first one even with a four cylinder and CVT it was a very decent drive. The one I had last year looked at lot nicer, but I thought it was a terrible drive. Everything that was surprisingly ok about the first one (engine note, performance, transmission tuning) felt like it had gone horribly wrong. Based on reviews I've read I gotta believe my car was broken in some way - all the magazines love it. But mine seemed to always be doing the wrong thing and it was getting on my last nerve. It actually evoked an Altima I rented back in the '90s and drove up to Reno. I wanted to drive it off a cliff and report it stolen.

[neanderthal]

I rented a Chrysler 300 with the Pentastar V6 and ZF 8 speed transmission two years ago.

I was blown away.
I thought seriously about getting one. And I got 30mpg for my trip, without trying too hard.

[CudaMan]

Meh, it's your money.
Not usually. :) I tend to look at it as a chance to experiment - test drive a lot of different cars in the compact/midsize segment. When I start forming opinions and find something I like I tend to take that if it's available, rather than continue exploring. I'm generally not impressed by much actually. The Avenger is a standout.

New Corolla - pretty average and dated on many fronts, except the CVT tuning is really really good. Who knew.

[KillerB]

The Chrysler 300 with the Pentastar and TorqueFlite 8 is, IMO, the best rental car available in North America, bar none. Quick witted transmission, 300 hp, true 30 mpg capability, competent handling, and space for four six-footers and their luggage.

It's always my first choice when hitting the Emerald Aisle with National.

Second choice is a tie between the new Impala and the Chrysler Town and Country. The T&C is much better to drive than it has any right to be, and my positive experience with one on a 500 mile round trip is what caused me to encourage my parents to look at one for their new vehicle.

[neanderthal]

The Chrysler 300 with the Pentastar and TorqueFlite 8 is, IMO, the best rental car available in North America, bar none. Quick witted transmission, 300 hp, true 30 mpg capability, competent handling, and space for four six-footers and their luggage.

It's always my first choice when hitting the Emerald Aisle with National.

Second choice is a tie between the new Impala and the Chrysler Town and Country. The T&C is much better to drive than it has any right to be, and my positive experience with one on a 500 mile round trip is what caused me to encourage my parents to look at one for their new vehicle.

I agree about the 300.

The previous gen Caddy CTS was also hella good.


The Corolla shows that Toyota didn't even try...

[thesameguy]

And why should they? Their owners don't, either. :D

[Kchrpm]

Chrysler Town & Country :up:

Doing a road trip in a Toyota Sienna reminded me how much better the Chrysler options are, based on stuff like third row sleepability and 2nd/3rd row plugs (or lack there of on the Sienna)

[thesameguy]

I think the only fairly recent minivans I've been in anytime recently are a previous generation Odyssey and a first gen Kia Sedona. The Odyssey I was driven about 10 miles in. Seemed fine. The Kia I recharged the AC and pulled CEL code, didn't go anywhere in it. The downsized (looks like it, anyway) T&C has really intrigued me. Actually, I'd like to just check on the VW version to see how they German-ized it. ;)

[Leon]

And why should they? Their owners don't, either. :D

I nearly looped my Corolla on a roundabout last week. Hit diesel or oil, and had it in a 45 degree drift angle going around a roundabout leading into a motorway onramp.

Who needs an AE86 ....

[thesameguy]

People whose lives are so unfulfilling they need to pretend they're in a cartoon?

[neanderthal]

I think the only fairly recent minivans I've been in anytime recently are a previous generation Odyssey and a first gen Kia Sedona. The Odyssey I was driven about 10 miles in. Seemed fine. The Kia I recharged the AC and pulled CEL code, didn't go anywhere in it. The downsized (looks like it, anyway) T&C has really intrigued me. Actually, I'd like to just check on the VW version to see how they German-ized it. ;)

As far as I know they only updated the interior.

[Yw-slayer]

People whose lives are so unfulfilling they need to pretend they're in a cartoon?

You mean, cosplayers?

[thesameguy]

My "haul a bunch of AV gear to Tahoe" trip is on... time to start hunting minivans. Looks like I'm going to be taking a 55" TV, a ~46" TV, a Denon AV receiver, a couple Logitech remotes, a couple Samsung bluray players, and a mess of cables and tools. Ideally, I am also going to be taking the girl and the dog. Anyone know offhand if there are interior height differences between the current crop of minivans in rental fleets? If I could carry the TVs vertically, that'd be super!

Edit: Meh, the 55" TV is probably only 35" tall, any minivan should fit that. Shittily, minivans are apparently getting $150/day for rentals right now. Guess they're popular. How tall is a Focus inside?

[thesameguy]

WHY THE EFF DOES NOBODY PUBLISH TRUNK DIMENSIONS???????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????????

RAV4, Sante Fe, Escape, none of them!

[thesameguy]

Ford Fleet sort of publishes these specs - cargo opening dimensions:

2014 Explorer = 31" high and 46" wide
2014 Escape = 32" high and 42.5" wide
2014 Edge = 30" high and 42" wide

None are wide enough to put a 55" TV parallel with the tailgate. The Escape could *barely* stand one on edge, with seats down, parallel to the side of the car. I am going to assume (DOH!) that other midsize SUVs have similarly-sized openings.

I'm signing up an Explorer with Budget, and can maybe downgrade to an Edge if it makes more sense. It's $88 for two days, less than half of the cheapest Caravan for one day (by $0.50!)

[Yw-slayer]

Dude, why are you going to Tahoe and lugging a bunch of tech from home along??!!

[thesameguy]

I like to be cozy.

[Godson]

If that is what you call cozy, i wonder what the hell my living arrangment is. :/

[thesameguy]

Warm glowing warm glow.

[thesameguy]

I got hosed with a Chevy Traverse LT AWD. Really was hoping I'd get that Explorer, but whatever. The trunk opening is almost identical in size, and it'll hold what I need it to hold. The floor looking a little flimsy (I'm used to the Suburban, which is 100% metal) - that could be a problem when I put a 36" Trinitron (120lb I think) on it. Heh.

It's a '14, and the last one I had was an '07 or '08 in Saturn flavor. They definitely fixed some of my complaints, the big one being the huge gap between seats when folded down. There are still gaps, but they are much smaller. In a couple hours I am going to flog this thing up the mountain. We'll see how it does.

[TheBenior]

Flat or curved Trinitron? My flat 27" Sony Wega was something like 100lbs without packaging, so that old 36" TV might be even more than that.

In local tube TV news, the previous resident of my house left behind two in the back of a long closet. One looks like a 27", and the other looks like a 36" :|

[Yw-slayer]

So #firstworldproblems

[novicius]

Heh, I wonder if BJ still has that 36" Sony WEGA in his place? The manual said that thing was like 180+ lbs! :lol:

[thesameguy]

FML. That is exactly what thing thing is - a 36" WEGA. Getting it down off the shelf was rough - I have to get it up two flights of stairs in a little bit. Glad I'm only taking one of them out of here - the other two would necessitate another flight of stairs.

[thesameguy]

Oh yeah, but the Traverse. I'll admit it, I'm impressed. I'm sure I am totally out of touch with the large crossover segment, but this thing is pretty competent. It hustled up here with zero complaints, and I was not taking it easy. I was a little blown away!

[thesameguy]

I bailed on the TV. I left it sitting in the bedroom. I don't get paid enough to blow out my vertebrae lifting 200lb dinosaurs, much less carrying them up stairs.

Anywho, the Traverse impressed the crap out of me. Like, really. The 3.6 DI motor is ever so slightly undersized for ultimate power, but totally respectable. There were only a few times passing uphill I really needed more power, and frankly moving that beast any faster probably isn't a good idea anyway. It is quiet and smooth with just a little growl when pushed. Nice motor IMHO and fits in here every bit as well as in the CTS. The 6-speed auto is tuned like the Malibu's was - very aggressive upshifting with a very tall 6th gear. I didn't mess with the manumatic mode - it's also the same shifter as in the Malibu, though less cramped so actually usable. Shifting is very crisp... not mushy old school GM shifting. As such, I found the 1->2 shift to be a little annoying due to gear spacing but, jeez, that's nit-picking. The super tall 6th probably results in good cruising fuel economy, but I didn't get to use it much - maybe 40 miles total. It was always eager to shift into 6th, but even slight grades and/or light throttle cause a downshift. Actually, many times, a double downshift was called for to do anything productive. Personally, in a vehicle like this, I am happy about that. I like that it's trying to maximize fuel efficiency because it's just not supposed to be driven aggressively. It's a big truck.

And I do mean big. I parked it next to the Suburban and was a little lower and a tad bit shorter, but remarkably similar in size. I think most of the height loss is just in ground clearance, as headroom is very good. The lower ride height made getting it and out easier. It also made loading 300-400lbs of AV gear into the trunk easier than it would have been on the Suburban. Although it had plenty of cargo room for what I needed, in typical modern fashion there are cupholders and storage bins and whatnot molded into the sides which eat into ultimate cargo holding - the same is true on the last several generations of Suburbans, too. Mixed blessings. It has three rows of seating. Getting into the far back isn't easy, but not really any worse than any 3rd row seats. Whatever. The middle row slides forwards and backwards with a 60/40 split. If you don't mind crushing the 3rd row people (who likes them anyway?) you can get copious legroom in the front two rows. I obviously didn't ride in the rear two rows (can't drive from there, and the dog doesn't have her license), but the front seats were quite comfortable in cloth and offered a fair amount of grip - which I used! Both front seats had power adjustments and adjustable lumbar - getting a comfortable position was remarkably easy. Seriously, I really liked the seats! 350 miles including a LOT of traffic and zero soreness. The rear two rows fold flat, but as all recent vehicles there are huge gaps everywhere. In the Suburban, you can create a solid, flat floor from the tailgate to the front row. In this, there is a large, unfixable gap between the two rear rows and the two front rows. I totally understand the whys (seat comfort and flexibility), but it's annoying if, say, you've got a dog in the back. It's hard for them to find footing. They need to figure out a way to get flat, solid load floors in SUVs again. Folding and unfolding the seats was easy from just about anywhere - well placed straps and levers and a single action to fold the bottom and back together.

I found the steering wheel had way too many buttons on it - I think 6 or 8 on the right side alone! Several times while making sharp turns I switched the stereo source by accident due to insufficient clearance in that quadrant of the wheel. Kind of annoying. More annoying was the infotainment doodad. A big double-DIN-esque display with two knobs and no buttons. The display is surrounded by touch-sensitive spots for things like "nav" and radio "source" which give you no indication you've done anything with them, or that they've recognized your touch. And, if your hands are cold or sweaty, they rarely recognize your touch. These "buttons" should beep or something when you activate them - otherwise, you end up having to look around to confirm what you wanted to happen did happen, and that's a dangerous use of time. The actual touchscreen is clear and easy to read, but totally nonsensically laid out. Information is all willy-nilly everywhere, buttons have inconsistent sizes and locations. I found this whole unit to be poorly designed and poorly executed with the exception of the backup camera, which worked great. Not only is there a distance gauge, but it's linked to the steering so it plots out your reverse course. Where I was, frequently navigating in tight spaces that were bordered by rocks or rock walls, that reverse plotting was very helpful - especially with limited rear visibility further compromised by a load of gear stacked almost to the ceiling. ;)

The HVAC controls are a typical modern 3-knob situation, and intuitive and easy to use. They are replicated on the back of the center armrest for middle seat occupants to control rear air. I didn't experiment, but I think the rear air does what the front air does unless someone in back overrides. That makes sense for most situations, I imagine, but if you want the front HVAC off and the rear HVAC on to help cool the dog (or a baby, or grandma) down, there is no way to do that short of contorting around and changing the rear controls. Kind of a dumb design too. Up front there is a big front storage box in the dash, a big glovebox, a couple small cubbies, big map pockets, and a scary deep bin behind the shifter. Like, big enough to put two 32oz water bottles in and close the top. HUGE. As expected, the thing has plenty of cupholders, USB ports for charging all over the place (including in the rear!). The gauge cluster is virtually identical to the Malibu's, so GM is probably using a common cluster with different fascias to create different looks. I like these gauges better than the Malibu's due to less chrome trim creating reflections and shadows. Easier to read and even dimming to useful levels in the dark. Speaking of the dark, the high beam switch works like it's supposed to - a mechanical switch that is away from the driver on high, close to the driver on low. :up:

(I blew up the message size limit :lol:, so I'll post the long version of the drive separately)

The entire drive up and down left me with no impression other than the Traverse's surefootedness. Expected levels of understeer, but prompt response from all the inputs. No appreciable throttle lag, prompt shifting, excellent brakes, and steering that felt shockingly accurate given the size of the truck and its tires. After I submit this, I'm going to read a couple magazine reviews just to see what they have to say. While room for improvement in an absolute sense, I just can't see any room for complaint in a practical sense. We spent three hours stuck in traffic driving around the lake and were comfortable the whole time. We spent four hours hustling up and down mountains gaining nothing but respect. I spent a little time in the dirt seeing how the AWD performed, and enjoyed nothing but solid four wheel traction - including one somewhat hilarious merge from a dirt road onto highway 89... dirt road -> uphill highway 89 -> slow-ass Prius doing 40 in a 55 -> instant pass. THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.

I have no idea how much this thing costs (probably a lot) or how it compares against other 3-row SUV/crossover vehicles, but in a vacuum, I love it. I'd buy one if the rear floor was gap-less. This is probably the first "plebian" vehicles I've been enthusiastic about since the Magnum. The radio controls suck, but that's really it. An ergonomic issue that might be cured with one of the other optional head units. Everything from a mechanical, comfort, and performance perspective is just so remarkably spot on I think I am genuinely going to miss driving this thing. Crazy!

[thesameguy]

Heading up the hill is always a challenge due to people who are either scared of the road or out sightseeing or both. The speed limit varies from 45 to 55mph, and a significant number of people drive 35mph - except in the long straight passing lanes where they try to stay out in front and gleefully hit 60 or 70mph. Idiots. I know the drive and I like the drive, and I generally stick to the speed limit in towns (nobody wants tourists speeding through their towns) or slightly above (65-70mph) in the open. As such, I'm generally counting the seconds til the next passing opportunity. In a truck with two people, a dog, and a good sized load in back I didn't have any expectation of driving really quickly, but certainly maintaining the speed limit. So, that's how I went in...

As we headed out of Placerville into the mountains, I fell in with a Volvo XC90 and Mazda CX5 who were clearly trying to get somewhere and not see the sights - probably trying to get home before dark. We hustled up the first incline at around 70mph - it's all four-lane highway with big sweepers and no real opportunity for failure. I knew these were my guys, as they were reliable (though polite) with their passing and consistent with their throttle. You can always tell the tourists because they overbrake for everything and poorly anticipate throttle for climbing. These two SUVs were not those people.

The Traverse was super stable on the big turns - car-like to be sure. The crap pavement on 50 was only transmitted to the cabin in the worst spots. Lots of shifting, but always responsive power. The steering was almost mind-blowingly good - very accurate and it was always easy to place the vehicle. Several times I remarked to the dog (the girl was sleeping), "Shit, this thing is totally decent!" When four lanes became two, the three of us hit a wall - a line of 10 cars trailing two logging trucks. Sad banana. We crept along at about 30mph until the first passing lane, when the Volvo rocketed out in front of us, passed all ten cars and the logging trucks and was GONE. I was trailing the Mazda and we were set to pass probably six cars, but a dude in an B5 A4 suddenly moved in between us and promptly chickened out. The Mazda ended up behind the logging trucks, and I was behind three cars plus the Audi. Very annoyed.

Another two miles of creeping until the next passing lane. Nobody knows how to pass in this state - everyone stays bunched up together and then hopes to have passing power when the lane opens. I hang back, give myself a decent gap to get up to a good speed right as the lane opens. When this lane opened, A late '90s Accord jumped into the passing line followed immediately by the Audi. I was a couple hundred feet back already going 60 and blew by both of them in the slow lane, moved easily into the fast lane and got ahead of the logging trucks. WIN. I remarked to the dog that I could have used more power, but the Traverse's performance was totally respectable for a 5000lb SUV with a V6.

We spent four miles hustling through some of the less crazy part of the drive - long straights and mostly easy turns punctuated by oddball decreasing apexes. I stayed a little above the speed limit, just perpetually blown away by how competent the Traverse was. Never a complaint from the tires, no untoward leans, and perfect brake performance. It worst attribute was a result of its tendency towards aggressive upshifting - in turns with trailing throttle it would upshift, resulting in an unexpected power level existing the turn. I suspect it felt more unsettling than it physically was, and it might be cured with transmission learning over time or, worst case, manual shifting. Several times I had to remind myself I was driving something roughly the size and very close to the weight of the Suburban - these shifting hiccups helped in that respect. ;) Otherwise, I could have been driving last month's Malibu. Our dog, despite being a little gimpy in back still, is very stable in cars, and every so often in a turn I'd remember she was back there, head out the window loving it all. She was totally comfortable, leaning into and out of turns, unaffected by my driving. As far as I'm concerned, that's an excellent test of a car's poise.

At some point, the Audi must have passed the Accord because at the next passing lane I could see the Audi's headlights in the rear view. I stayed in the right lane and slowed to the speed limit figuring he's got the better car. He blew by at probably 80mph followed closely by a 1st gen S40 and then, as the passing lane was ending, was on the brakes. The S40 made a dodge for the right lane, clearly hoping to get around the Audi, but was trapped. We caught up in a few seconds, and then followed the Volvo following the Audi for the next four miles... going well under the speed limit, overbraking for every turn, and every so often slowing down and drifting towards the shoulder. I was annoyed, but the guy in the Volvo was freaking out - occasionally poking to the left, considering passing over the double yellow. He never did, but I could tell he wanted to. When the next lane opened, the Audi moved automatically in the left lane (DICK), so the Volvo tucked back into the right lane. I had hung back in my typical fashion, and was on the Volvo's ass - both of us passing the Audi in the right lane. Audi guy was back on the gas, "YOU SHALL NOT PASS!" pointlessly written all over his face. We probably would not have made it by, but this passing lane is punctuated by a slow sweeper and several really tight, edge of the world turns at the top. The Audi driver panicked at the first turn and was off the gas, the Chevy and the Volvo rocketing by. I stayed tight on the Volvo for about a half mile, then backed off when it was clear the Audi wasn't going to catch up. I was pretty sure the Volvo wasn't going to hold us up.

No disappointments there... The next section of the drive is more straights and easy turns, and we were alone doing about 65mph for the entire distance. The S40 shot off into the distance (I didn't know they were that quick!) and the Audi was long gone in the rear view. It was fine - the dog's sea legs needed a little rest and it was dusk and time to watch for animals. Oddly, this quiet time reminded me of some of my first drives of the family's '85 Volvo - out in the middle of nowhere, with adequate power, good brakes, and just enough lean to feel dynamic without feeling clumsy. A very comfortable way to drive a mountain! I'm not sure how far it is from that segment of the road to the next, but maybe 10 miles or so. Something like that. Next up is a wide, straight section with an uphill passing lane that ends at the summit - which is a huge freakout for most drivers. I get it - you are on a mountain face looking out over oblivion - but still, if you're uncomfortable use the turnouts so you can drive at your own pace without pressure from behind. That straight section of the road is important, as it gives you an opportunity to pre-emptively pass all the people that are going to creep down the mountain. It must be used wisely! :) Up ahead I saw the S40 and the XC90 from earlier both passing a line of eight or ten cars, so I was on the gas. I crested 80mph then backed off - it's a straight wide road, but 80mph in a 5000lb truck is my limit. I just don't have that much faith in any brakes on public roads. I was able to get by all but one of the slower cars... I let a Nissan Frontier merge in, and watched sadly as the Volvos headed off unobstructed. More sad banana.

After the first couple turns, as the first turnout approached, I put a little pressure on the Nissan hoping he'd get the hint and move over. it never works, but I try to send the message anyway every single time. Maybe there's some magic in red soccer mom wagons, but amazingly the dude got the message and used the turnout. Stunning - it never happens! The drive down the mountain is super twisty left and right with very few straights until you're at the bottom. I was secretly trying to catch up to the Volvos while not upsetting the dog or letting the tires hint at my shenanigans. Not a complaint from either - left right brake accelerate and the thing never suggested it didn't like what I was doing. It was mind blowing. The girl, who was wide awake at this point, even commented how comfortable it was despite my driving.

Three days, 350 miles, one tank of gas, mountains, freeways, and vacation congestion and not once did I want out. Overall, great times, and the Traverse was a great compliment. Stunning!

[Yw-slayer]

Goes on holiday to Tahoe, takes along huge TV's in an SUV, then writes long review of the road trip, focusing on the SUV's handling and overtaking shenanigans. Dude, why didn't you just stay at home?

[thesameguy]

Because I don't get paid to stay at home?

[Yw-slayer]

You got paid to go to Tahoe on holiday?

[Random]

Nobody knows how to pass in this state - everyone stays bunched up together and then hopes to have passing power when the lane opens. I hang back, give myself a decent gap to get up to a good speed right as the lane opens. When this lane opened, A late '90s Accord jumped into the passing line followed immediately by the Audi. I was a couple hundred feet back already going 60


I had a dude in VW Golf who didn't check his mirrors before trying to swing a round a very slow truck going over 20 to Clear Lake. I had seen the signs for the passing zone, seen the beginning of the passing zone coming, and was on the gas ASAP so that I could hit the zone at passing speed--anticipation is key when you've got a loaded car and 130hp! Foreign concept for Mr. Golf, though, and he nearly had a hatch full of 2000 Camry for his troubles. :mad:



After the first couple turns, as the first turnout approached, I put a little pressure on the Nissan hoping he'd get the hint and move over. it never works, but I try to send the message anyway every single time.


Just before we hit Clearlake Oaks on the same trip we caught up to a slow Prius (no way!). Hand out the window, cruising along, tralalala. :sing: 45mpg in a 55 zone on the downhill into town--I'm thinking this is the kind of driver that obliviously drives 45 right through town, typically. Nope, slowed to down to a couple under the limit. And stayed there as we left town back into a 45mph zone. And stayed there. Cars start to accumulate. I do the follow-5-feet-too-close-thing with no response. At one point we come around the corner to one of those "YOUR SPEED" radar signs hung on a pole with the "SPEED LIMIT 45" sign. 29 flashes up on the board. :lol: Lady continues to toodle along, hand out the window, tralalala. Mapper is convinced the driver's high. The passing zones never line up with traffic. I even honked at her when we saw a "Turn Out 1/4 mile" sign! I try to count cars in the mirror, but the road twists too much, so I can only see 12 cars or so at a time. We finally get to the outskirts of Lucerne and a suicide lane appears...as does a mid-90s Chevy 3/4-ton doing about 75 up the left side of the line of cars. He honks at the Prius, gives her the Mario Kart "Luigi Death Stare," swerves into the lane in front of her, and then rockets off into the distance with his left hand out the window giving her the bird. "Fuck YOUUUUUUUUU"

[thesameguy]

You got paid to go to Tahoe on holiday?

I'm not actually sure where vacation entered this conversation. I got paid to go to Tahoe to set up three home theater systems in one of the partners houses. I haven't had a vacation since 2007. Burning Man will be my first time of more than three consecutive days off (including weekends) since September of that year. No, wait, that's a lie - twice I took two days off surrounding a weekend for Lemons. So, Burning Man will be my first more than four consecutive day vacation. ;)


I had a dude in VW Golf who didn't check his mirrors before trying to swing a round a very slow truck going over 20 to Clear Lake. I had seen the signs for the passing zone, seen the beginning of the passing zone coming, and was on the gas ASAP so that I could hit the zone at passing speed--anticipation is key when you've got a loaded car and 130hp! Foreign concept for Mr. Golf, though, and he nearly had a hatch full of 2000 Camry for his troubles. :mad:

That's about the worst - when someone who doesn't anticipate the passing lane ruins your expertly crafted use of one. OTOH, when it does go off without a hitch, it's a pretty glorious feeling. "Looks what I did with not enough horsepower" feels good for miles. :D

[Random]

"You just got passed by a Camry with a roofbox!!" :hard:

[Yw-slayer]

Oh,right. I thought everyone went to Tahoe on vacation.

My friend went to burning man last year and will be there again this year. You might meet him, but I wouldn't bet on it.

[thesameguy]

People clearly do, but I probably wouldn't. It's a clusterfuck of tourists up there these days. No place to do what I'd want to do in a place like that - be alone with nature. I spent the weekend in a 5000 sq ft lakefront house with a private pier. One of the other houses "we" have up there is about double that size, with a private beach and a helipad. It's out of control. Tahoe is not for a) the unrich and b) people who like to connect with nature anymore.

There are 60,000 people at Burning Man so it's pretty unlikely to run into a single random person. BRC is bigger than some actual cities. We'll be with the lamplighters, who are about as famous as you can get there - being in charge of lighting the city at night. Tell him to find the Fleetwood over there. Shouldn't be hard to find as it'll likely be right on the perimeter.

[Yw-slayer]

Yes, hence why I said I wouldn't count on it. Shortish Chinese guy who went to MIT. I can tell him, might be funny if you do actually meet up.

[21Kid]

Heh, I wonder if BJ still has that 36" Sony WEGA in his place? The manual said that thing was like 180+ lbs! :lol:
I remember trying to shoehorn mine in my RS to bring over to your (and his) place. :lol:

[Random]

We all remember you carrying it into the house with one hand.

[21Kid]

I'm not hoss... :shocker:

[thesameguy]

As we're approaching December 18th we had a limited opportunity to use up our remaining Year One Enterprise rental credits - we get 12 days annually for owning the 500e, and we'd only used four of them so far. Since we had to drive to SoCal for T-Day, I decided to blow five more of them and put miles on someone else's tires. I reserved a "standard" car and when we arrived I negotiated for Ford Focus they had on the lot, but oddly they would not let us "downgrade" car sizes so we ended up with a Chrysler 200. Meh, good enough. I thought.

I have never had such mixed emotions about a car in my life. The actual drive in the 200 seems quite good - nicely sprung, good steering, and solid brakes. But - OMG - one completely uncomfortable car. I messed with the seat for hours and couldn't find a place where I was actually comfortable. The steering wheel adjustment was a joke. The center armrest could neither move into a comfortable position nor move entirely out of the way. The pedals were uncomfortably high off the floor - I don't have small feet, but sheesh! As a Chrysler I expected a certain level of equipment - and the 200 totally did not deliver. Lame 2.4l coupled to a primitive 4-speed auto. The stereo offered a CD player - no USB, Bluetooth, not even MP3-on-CD! The EL clock was just constant glare stuck in the middle of the dash that didn't dim in lock-step with the rest of the cabin lights. No manual shifting. Pop the trunk... and it just release but doesn't actually open. Just everywhere you'd expect some sort of luxury touch and NOTHING. Seriously, the Kia Soul I rented a few weeks ago had WAY more technology in it. PATHETIC.

The upside is that five minutes into our drive, the TPMS went off. It was down a couple pounds so I added them back at a gas station. Then. the day after we arrived in SoCal we came out to a tire with 13psi in it. Turns out it had a giant screw in it, so we ran it over to the Enterprise here for a trade out. The Enterprise lot was filled with 200s - probably six of them just sitting around and that's what I expected to get... but Enterprise surprised me with a Corolla.

I can't believe I am going to say this, but the Corolla totally blows the 200 out of the water. It's a totally bland, uninspiring drive - lethargic CVT, tiny motor - but at least it's comfortable. The seats are cheap but supportive and grippy - getting comfortable took like eight seconds. Materials are cheap and the dashboard is totally mental, but it has a backup camera, bluetooth, a USB port, and automatic climate control. The stereo is a touchscreen, the instrument cluster has an info display. The steering is overboosted, but the turning radius is hilariously tight. The brakes are excessively grabby but they seem to do their job well. I will be sure to thrash it over the Grapevine. ;)

I can't decide whether I am more stunned that you can order a Corolla with so much equipment or that you can order a 200 with so little. In many ways, the 200 reminded me of the PT Cruiser - all sorts of little details that made me think, "THIS IS c2001 CHRYSLER EQUIPMENT!" OTOH, while the Corolla is a styling disaster, at least it has a proper amount of c2014 tech.

[KillerB]

Was this the new 200 or the old one? I've gotten a new 200 and my experience was completely different. Four cylinder, but had the 9-speed auto, the latest UConnect, and very comfortable for a car of that size. Only complaint was that the four-cylinder ran out of breath as it's a porky car and the 9-speed can only do so much once you're out of the lower gears. With the Pentastar it'd be fantastic.

Based on your description, I think you must have had the old one, which is indeed totally uncompetitive, but I think it's a little unfair to compare a car that's not even made anymore.

[Yw-slayer]

Yeah, the new one sounds good: http://www.washingtonpost.com/cars/on-wheels-chrysler-200-sedan-leaves-its-rocky-past-in-the-dust/2014/11/26/0c4b048a-7410-11e4-9c9f-a37e29e80cd5_story.html

Having said that, if I'd gotten the one TSG mentioned, I'd probably have broken my "Drive American cars when in America" rule. Did it have AUX-IN?

[thesameguy]

I think it did have aux in, but an aux in cable is definitely not something I bring along with me anymore.

It was clearly an previous gen car, but I am still shocked that Chrysler thought it was ok to put their name on such a shit box. As an Avenger, you could at least defend it as a poorly equipped Average Guy car - but as a Chrysler it was an embarrassment. You can't even buy a Kia with so little equipment. Well, maybe a stripper Forte. Maybe.

The Corolla proved to be a-ok. A very comfortable drive, adequate power, and excellent fuel economy. Despite two hours in stop & go traffic and doing my damnedest to maintain 80mph wherever possible we made it back on less than one tank of gas. At 13.2 gallons, that works out to better than 33mpg. My flash drive did manage to crash the stereo a couple times, but whatever. I'd take that madman-styled Corolla over the 200 any day of the week, for any and all purposes.

[TheBenior]

That first gen 200 was almost certainly developed under the Cerberus Capital Chrysler LLC timeframe, which I've heard Ralph Gilles describe as "dark days." They thought hiring Bob Nardelli after he fucked up Home Depot was a good idea.

In more current Cerberus Capital Management news, their tenure over Remington under the Freedom Group umbrella has seen spotty quality control and 3 massive recalls. Much like the auto industry, firearms only get recalled for unquestionably dangerous flaws (Model 700 rifles and 887 shotguns potentially firing unintentionally and their much-hyped all-new R51 pistol having every unit recalled due to a multitude of flaws including firing out of battery, which could potentially lead to a gun blowing up in your hands).

I guess what I'm saying is, that no shitty product should be a surprise where Cerberus is involved.

[thesameguy]

In more current Cerberus Capital Management news, their tenure over Remington under the Freedom Group umbrella has seen spotty quality control and 3 massive recalls. Much like the auto industry, firearms only get recalled for unquestionably dangerous flaws (Model 700 rifles and 887 shotguns potentially firing unintentionally and their much-hyped all-new R51 pistol having every unit recalled due to a multitude of flaws including firing out of battery, which could potentially lead to a gun blowing up in your hands).

The idea of a gun needing a recall is positively terrifying to me, and I don't even own one. Jesus!