Nissan will build small RWD car based on IDx Concept

[KillerB]

It would be nice if they could get an identically equipped IDX to near the same price.

[thesameguy]

Man, too bad about no AWD 6-speed RS. That would be a nutty little car. Meh, I wouldn't buy it.

But I'd seriously consider a regular IDx to replace the Fiat when that time comes. Assuming we still have petrochemicals to burn. I've often wondered what it would be like to have to go back to gas stations after three years of driving past them. Maybe we'll find out.

[novicius]

My girlfriend's Juke has manual mode. One, it's not very responsive - you ask for a gearchange, and it doesn't execute for a good half second. Secondly, even in manual mode, it has this weird slippery power delivery - it feels like a slipping clutch. Maybe they can tune this all out with software; who knows. But ultimately, the manual mode is actually slower than CVT mode, and not just by a little bit. Kinda sucks the fun out of it. So you've got to choose between sounding like a Vespa or feeling like you're not getting the most out of the car.

I don't hate on the CVT like a lot of people do - it's better for a small four-cylinder than a lot of the alternatives - but it's not a sporty transmission.

I attribute the lack of 'sport' to tuning.

Yes, due to the inherent nature of the CVT we'll never have the hard mechanical engagement of a geared tranny but as technology progresses I think it's safe to say that a CVT can be tuned for snappier response at speed than has been currently provided in the Cube/Juke (one anecdotal test drive of the Juke NISMO RS claims as much). Nissan is also claiming an improved mechanical soundtrack, too. R50 MINI Coopers with CVTs have a pretty loyal following and are considered quite engaging/enjoyable at speed through the twisties, autoxing and daily driving. No, similar to the GT86 automatic-equipped cars, they are not hard-launching cars from a stop.

Much like the raison d'être of the GT86 Twins (or the CR-Z for that matter), I feel that the logic of the design of a sporty performance-tuned CVT is going to shine at speed only (and in MPGs), not in the numbers generated at the limit. If the IDx offers RWD and somewhat neutral handling, I don't think that former buyers of torque-converter transmissions are going to feel particularly disappointed with a pre-programmed needless throttle blip prior to each "downshift" in their eight faux-gears.

[Yw-slayer]

Fair enough, Tyler. Now we see where each of us (Greg included) is coming from. On that list you mentioned:

rx8 - No new ones
s2000 - No new ones
350z, 370z - Different type of car
cayman - Different type/price of car, unless you buy used
c5zo6 - Totally different car and price, no new ones

[thesameguy]

I attribute the lack of 'sport' to tuning.

Yes, due to the inherent nature of the CVT we'll never have the hard mechanical engagement of a geared tranny but as technology progresses I think it's safe to say that a CVT can be tuned for snappier response at speed than has been currently provided in the Cube/Juke (one anecdotal test drive of the Juke NISMO RS claims as much). Nissan is also claiming an improved mechanical soundtrack, too. R50 MINI Coopers with CVTs have a pretty loyal following and are considered quite engaging/enjoyable at speed through the twisties, autoxing and daily driving. No, similar to the GT86 automatic-equipped cars, they are not hard-launching cars from a stop.

Much like the raison d'être of the GT86 Twins (or the CR-Z for that matter), I feel that the logic of the design of a sporty performance-tuned CVT is going to shine at speed only (and in MPGs), not in the numbers generated at the limit. If the IDx offers RWD and somewhat neutral handling, I don't think that former buyers of torque-converter transmissions are going to feel particularly disappointed with a pre-programmed needless throttle blip prior to each "downshift" in their eight faux-gears.

thesameguy likes this post.

Although you were on the edge of complimenting the CRZ, which I cannot abide.

[novicius]

Sorry.

More fuel for the fire -- 2010 Nissan Maxima V6 CVT driving impressions.

The only transmission available, much to the chagrin of some critics, is the CVT (continuously variable transmission), a much-improved Nissan innovation. Maxima's CVT offers a manual mode, and we found it a joy to use in either mode. According to Nissan, the Xtronic CVT software contains more than 700 shifting algorithms to cope with every driving situation in every gear from idle to full-throttle, and the transmission can shift 30 percent faster than a human. In the Sport Drive mode, the shifts were lightning quick, and included a very sporty throttle blip on every downshift.

TTAC weighs in.

Prior to the Maxima, I’d had no experience with Nissan’s variable CVT transmission in any form. I came away from this one impressed. In Drive mode, it feels like an automatic with no shift points. It has the same creep at slow speeds, and the subtle wheel vibration of a car in gear when stopped. Slow acceleration keeps the engine around 2000 RPM. It otherwise loafs at 1200 RPM, imitating the practiced boredom of a Corvette in high gear. This yields terrific mileage. Another more moderate driver in the family reported 28 MPG in a mix of highway and around-town cruising.

Wood the gas and the engine will zing to 4500 RPM, slowly rising to near redline as the car accelerates. If you’re aggressive, the system will assume you want to play and will hold 2500 RPM for a few seconds until it thinks you’ve relaxed. The heightened revs persist if you shift into Sport mode by moving the stick to the left gate. Sport can also add predetermined shift points to the CVT, an affectation that does no favors for acceleration. Even so, shifts are very quick. Holding a low gear and letting off the gas slows the car as if restrained by a giant hand. The connection isn’t quite as direct as a true manual, but it’s an interesting gimmick and sharper than any automanual I’ve tried.

I personally found Drive so effective that Sport was superfluous. If selecting pseudo-cogs has more appeal to you, order the Maxima SV with paddle shifters. It takes much more concentration to keep the car pointed in the right direction at full tilt when you’ve devoted a hand to the gear lever.

Nissan has the tech out in the wild already. The Maxima V6 is rated at 261 ft-lbs. of torque as well. IMO, CVT concerns are a non-factor.

That being said, here's hoping for confirmation of a six-speed manual IDx NISMO.

[Godson]

Fair enough, Tyler. Now we see where each of us (Greg included) is coming from. On that list you mentioned:

rx8 - No new ones
s2000 - No new ones
350z, 370z - Different type of car
cayman - Different type/price of car, unless you buy used
c5zo6 - Totally different car and price, no new ones

Yup, no worries.

[novicius]

Motor Trend has autocross comparison impressions of the current 2013 Nissan Juke NISMO AWD+CVT vs. FWD+M6:

After several runs, the CVT-equipped all-wheel-drive model emerged as the faster of the two in the autocross. The manual front-drive Nismo was fun to drive, but the substantial torque steer made it a handful coming out of the turns.

The all-wheel-drive model with its torque vectoring system put the power down more effectively, and clicking off the CVT's simulated gear changes made the absence of a third pedal more bearable. I did wish for a good set of paddle shifters so I could keep my hands at the ready to shuffle the wheel.

A Nissan rep said that's one feature that might be in the works, though a manual-equipped all-wheel-drive Juke isn't in the cards for this generation, as there's currently no gearbox that will mate up to the crossover's system, and developing a new manual would be too costly.

AWD+CVT already beats the current FWD+M6 -- unless your name is Bryan Heitkotter, of course. *#beatingadeadhorse

[Crazed_Insanity]

Really? A CVT AWD is faster than FWD MT? I didn't see the article mentioning MPG # between the 2..., wonder if those #s are on par...

Ugly car, but interesting comparisons nonetheless.

[thesameguy]

I think we need to accept that test with a grain of salt. All they're saying is that torque steer limited power transfer - and that would be a function of AWD not CVT. It could also be a situation easily cured with a different alignment or tires or somebody better at driving. Along the same lines, that test would also have little or no bearing on a less powerful RWD car - which wouldn't suffer from torque steer in the first place. However, I think the point of posting that (and correct me if I'm wrong Novi) is that the CVT is plenty good - and I'm sure it is. With a set of flappy paddles, you could probably convince yourself you're driving a fancy DSG (without the annoying stoplight behavior).