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Thread: Humans

  1. #1
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    Humans



    I feel like sometimes I'm an outsider and just here to observe human behavior.

    I've noticed several things that I want to share, in case any other humans here are interested. I think it's important to find our weaknesses as a species (or whatever category we're in) because I believe that recognizing our weaknesses is the only way to improve on them.

    First - We have major difficulty thinking about individuals...we're much more comfortable labeling groups. That's the basis of racism, sexism, nationalism, etc. Any time we can label a group as a certain thing, it makes our dealing with them less prone to thinking hard about them.

    It reminds me of that saying, something like, a death is a tragedy, ten thousand deaths is a statistic. The larger the group, and the more we see similarities, the easier to stereotype and pigeon-hole them into trying to get evidence to prove what we think about them.

    (I fully realize that this post is entirely also doing the same thing...I am stereotyping all humans here, but I am.....of course............wait for it...........................only human).

    Also, a note about my thoughts on racism, and related things. Racism, etc. to me is based on lack of intelligence, specifically lacking the ability or mindfulness to go beyond very basic concepts to judge others.

    You know what it's like when you've had a long, stressful day at work, your brain is fried and someone asks you a complex question....you can tend to get a bit mad or frustrated right? Because you've mentally exhausted yourself, and taking into account everything needed to correctly answer the question is too much for you.

    Imagine that kind of mental issue and expand it to being like that 24/7, because you just have less mental capacity overall, and the only way you can get through the day, are by making basic choices and setting aside things you can't think too much about. Also, of course, racism comes from a lack of familiarity with those who you may be racist against.

    "People fear what they don't understand, hate what they can't conquer, I guess it's just the fury of man, became a monster" - Nas

    We're seeing this loud and clear with the muslim issue in the world right now. 1.5 Billion muslims in the world and some people will stereotype ALL of them as being terrorists, etc. even though 40-50 years ago, no one was thinking about that...everything back then was about commies....Russia, China, Korea, Vietnam....muslims were still around, but no one was worried about them back then....amazing.


    Second- As we've seen time and time again...passion and emotion can overwhelm logic in many, many situations and for a long, long period. We're bad at logic. I like listening to some of Carl Sagan's thoughts on humanity and religion, etc. and think to myself, why is this guy so unique? why aren't most of us using more empirical means and thought to come to rational conclusions instead of heated and mis-guided judgements based on emotion?

    Are we genetically pre-dispositioned to be like this? Can we change this by enough of education about how to rationally observe the worlds and events around us? Is it merely survival skills that we've kept since the caveman era that manifests itself in other ways now?




    That's all for now, maybe post more later
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    Wow, you and SLM are being very philosophical this week. I don't think the GTX(f) has seen so many deep musings before… aside from "Why isn't my Win10 computer working?" because for some that's as deep as it goes.

    Back to the more enlightened ones, I'm beginning to think that a man called Trump has lit a candle in some people's minds and they're starting to question more strongly the rising madness that is surrounding them.

    Well, wouldn't you believe it? I read something yesterday that I think fits directly in with your thoughts on humans at this moment.

    http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424...thoritarianism

    The tl;dr version: the authoritarian stance within politics is nothing new, but studying the phenomenon may help explain the rise of a new extreme-right arm of politics that is popular today. Trump just happens to be the right man at the right time to take advantage of that.

    I'm quite familiar with the authoritarian stance. It has been a platform on which our elected leaders in Australia have gained a lot of votes recently. And both the left and right of our two main political parties have shifted noticeably further right in the last five years.

    At the last federal election, a lot of lower and middle class votes went to the right on the basis that they had the best plan to "Stop the Boats," referring to asylum seekers mostly from Afghanistan in boats trying to find refuge in our country. Politically it's a huge issue, in reality it's very minor, and it can be helped greatly if a more considered approach was taken. At the moment, any asylum seeker who arrives by boat is taken to Manus Island or Nauru for (say this next bit out loud) offshore processing, which is part of the Pacific Solution. The government has promised to no arrival by boat will ever be settled in Australia.

    No mention of any airport arrivals has ever been mentioned.

    Another embarrassing thing last year was a senate enquiry into food labeling, which was started in the back of the public perception that halal foods were a 'religious tax' or that buying halal 'funds terrorism' or gives 'them' (the Muslims) an unfair advantage. None of the submissions into this enquiry were able to prove any of these claims.

    So yeah, that's what we're dealing with. In America, you've been lucky to largely avoid this because you've had a president for the last 8 years who actually sounds intelligent, articulate and is genuinely funny and charismatic. He actually talks to people as if he respects their intelligence and they'll understand what he is saying. An authoritarian politician is quite the opposite. They'll reduce a lot of things down to sound byte level and aim for the anger emotion, to try and mobilize a highly reactive part of the population.

    It's extremely effective. You should have seen the reaction when people found out that Vegemite was halal.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rare White Ape View Post
    It's extremely effective. You should have seen the reaction when people found out that Vegemite was halal.
    ║]=(86)=[║ Venturi3D.com

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    What about PEANUT BUTTER???!??!??????

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    Do you really yearn to be more like Data?
    Do you realize Data yearns to be more like human?

    Human brains can be emotional and rational at the same time... and they can compliment each other not just fight each other. I think rational thinking and emotional thinking often times end up in a false dichotomy. Irrational doesn't always mean emotional. Lacking emotions also doesn't automatically make you a rational person.

    A psychology book I read recently used a pretty cool analogy... think of a song. Emotional side is like the melody. Rational side is like the lyrics. It's fine if you wish to ignore the music..., you can still write a beautiful poem, but there's really no need for poets to look down to music, if done right, it can enhance your poem further and make it a great song!

    Yes, some musical melodies can be awful, but we don't have to look down on music as a whole. In fact, a lot of our psychological problems can't even be fixed using lyrics(rational thoughts), but its the melodies(emotional) that need fixing.

    I know most of you guys don't believe in the Bible, but considering all known facts, human brain is probably one of the most awesome and amazingly complicated creation in this universe. Yes, it's probably broken a bit, but it's still quite beautiful and it can be restored... and we for sure haven't tapped into its full potential yet.

    Bottomline is that humans are amazingly cool and I love them!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rare White Ape View Post
    It's extremely effective. You should have seen the reaction when people found out that Vegemite was halal.
    When that was really jumping off, it kind of obsessed me. I was reading Australian editorials, man on the street interviews, and comments sections all the time - the reactions of the public were just so interesting and weird. People talking about how buying halal foods was funding terrorism, suggestions that eating halal foods was some sort of back-door conversion, etc. It was some wild shit.
    -Formerly Stabulator

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoshInKC View Post
    When that was really jumping off, it kind of obsessed me. I was reading Australian editorials, man on the street interviews, and comments sections all the time - the reactions of the public were just so interesting and weird. People talking about how buying halal foods was funding terrorism, suggestions that eating halal foods was some sort of back-door conversion, etc. It was some wild shit.
    Yeah man, you've hit that nail right on the head. The most fucked part for me is that I became distanced from a lot of my close friends because I just wouldn't buy into that sort of nonsense. I partially blame social media for this, because I doubt many people would have heard about it nor would they have aired their opinions like it is possible to now. It became really widespread in such a short amount of time, and even after the claims were left unproven in the senate inquiry, they just won't fully die.

    There were incidents like a small-time yoghurt company which had a $50,000/yr deal to supply food to Emirates airlines. People found out they were Halal, then started a huge social media campaign to boycott them. The company responded by dropping the Halal cert just to stop the endless barrage of hate mail, and in doing so lost them that $50K deal. It was a senseless attack that directly disadvantaged a local supplier who provided lots of good jobs to people in their area. But, six months later as soon as the heat cooled off the company reinstated its Halal cert and won back the contract to supply Emirates. And behold, I did heartily LOL when I heard this.

    Consider this: Vegemite is Vegemite. With or without a Halal cert, it is the exact same product. People just wouldn't get the idea that it opens up the massive S.E. Asian market if a product is certified Halal, which brought in huge dollars for suppliers in Australia. People were upset that companies were paying a few thousand to certify (something like 0.0001c per jar), saying it was extorting us to the advantage of the Muslims, but completely ignoring the millions it brought to our economy.

    Yet people bought trillions of liters of petrol last year without complaining at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rare White Ape View Post
    Yeah man, you've hit that nail right on the head. The most fucked part for me is that I became distanced from a lot of my close friends because I just wouldn't buy into that sort of nonsense. I partially blame social media for this, because I doubt many people would have heard about it nor would they have aired their opinions like it is possible to now. It became really widespread in such a short amount of time, and even after the claims were left unproven in the senate inquiry, they just won't fully die.

    There were incidents like a small-time yoghurt company which had a $50,000/yr deal to supply food to Emirates airlines. People found out they were Halal, then started a huge social media campaign to boycott them. The company responded by dropping the Halal cert just to stop the endless barrage of hate mail, and in doing so lost them that $50K deal. It was a senseless attack that directly disadvantaged a local supplier who provided lots of good jobs to people in their area. But, six months later as soon as the heat cooled off the company reinstated its Halal cert and won back the contract to supply Emirates. And behold, I did heartily LOL when I heard this.

    Consider this: Vegemite is Vegemite. With or without a Halal cert, it is the exact same product. People just wouldn't get the idea that it opens up the massive S.E. Asian market if a product is certified Halal, which brought in huge dollars for suppliers in Australia. People were upset that companies were paying a few thousand to certify (something like 0.0001c per jar), saying it was extorting us to the advantage of the Muslims, but completely ignoring the millions it brought to our economy.

    Yet people bought trillions of liters of petrol last year without complaining at all.
    What about stuff that is certified as being kosher?

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    Not one mention of kosher from the bogan bigots; although that was included in the senate inquiry (along with health-focused Heart Foundation tick of approval, etc) so that they didn't single out the Halal thing.

    When asked about kosher in a tv interview, there was a lot of squirming followed by some thing about Jews not being involved in terrorism, which is total bullshit - there are terrorists from all religions and political leanings.

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    Wait, are you talking Jewish the religion, or Jewish the ethnicity? Because you can be a non-Jewish Jew, like my girlfriend. I don't think she's a terrorist.

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