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Thread: Formula One 2019

  1. #1021
    Dead Brand Ambassador dodint's Avatar
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    My guess is your little brother 'hit himself' a lot growing up?

  2. #1022
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeW View Post
    I will say that the Max pass tended to look worse than it was because Charles turned down on him at the crucial moment...in my eyes to try to draw the penalty.
    Actually I do agree the pass didn't look that bad if we don't pay attention to the track itself... the maneuver looked pretty smooth and safe even. It only looked bad when you can clearly see Charlie boy being pushed off track.

    I suppose the main difference between Max's move and Kvyat's was that Max didn't rip any part of the front wing off of the other guy's car. Perhaps that's the difference? If you damaged another guy's car then you get penalized?

  3. #1023
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    Kvyat basically straight-lined the first part of the corner and hit Perez at an angle, with an overspeed. Clearly a collision of two converging trajectories, leading to damage. A clear penalty for causing a collision.

    Max ran parallel to Charles throughout and took up his right to follow the normal racing line at the exit. He squeezed Charles off the track, but it wasn't exactly a 'collision', more rubbing. And as mentioned, the right to run people off the track at the corner exit is well established in F1, for better or for worse. Clearly not a penalty in modern F1.

    I would imagine that enforcing giving each other space, as per the old Grand Prix Legends rules, would possibly lead to slightly better racing with more passing and re-passing. But I couldn't be sure that such rules wouldn't themselves be exploited in an unreasonable way, e.g. by dive-bombing up the inside and claiming space.

  4. #1024
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    Charles took evasive action! If he decided to stick with his racing line... the 2 racing lines will of course eventually cross and end in a collision.

    So that would be considered as a 'racing incident' as they retire from the race? Or would Charlie boy ended up being penalized for not yielding to Max? Of if the pass ended up causing a collision, then Max would be penalized? I'm a little unclear how FIA makes up their minds.

    Is this also really that acceptable of a thing to do on a temp street circuits? Squeeze the other guy into a wall? Will FIA assess penalties differently based on different circuits?

  5. #1025
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    Quote Originally Posted by FaultyMario View Post
    I just don't see what Kvyat did wrong.
    Reviewing the footage @ 20s...

    Both cars were turning left...Kvyat was not going straight diving bombing into that corner. It's just that their racing lines intersected one another.

    I really think the main difference was that Max wasn't that much ahead of Charles so they ended up banging wheels, whereas Kvyat got slightly more ahead and banged into the front wing of the racing point...

    Personally, I'd called that a racing incident. If official rules forces me to penalize Kvyat, then I don't understand why Max got a way with it.

    I think the moral of the story is that the front driver need to make sure the door is always closed to avoid this gray area from entering in the 1st place... Senna does it exceptionally well. Holding off much faster superior drivers/machines behind him by never giving them a chance to try anything.
    Last edited by Crazed_Insanity; November 5th, 2019 at 01:47 PM.

  6. #1026
    That corner complex can be really hard to defend from a car with faster tyres. Perez knew that if he defended more to the left, Kvyat would go outside and, on his fresher tires, be able to choose where to to clean around the outside or hang out wide and do the over-under with his superior traction. Watching the onboards, I think Perez did a great job choosing a line that made things difficult for Kvyat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazed_Insanity View Post
    Is this also really that acceptable of a thing to do on a temp street circuits? Squeeze the other guy into a wall? Will FIA assess penalties differently based on different circuits?
    I think it's understood by the drivers that if you're on the outside on a street circuit, you're digging your own grave so to speak. You will still get squeezed. It's up to you to back off or get sandwiched. This is the stance the FIA has taken pretty consistently since I've been an F1 fan.

    Quote Originally Posted by samoht View Post
    I would imagine that enforcing giving each other space, as per the old Grand Prix Legends rules, would possibly lead to slightly better racing with more passing and re-passing. But I couldn't be sure that such rules wouldn't themselves be exploited in an unreasonable way, e.g. by dive-bombing up the inside and claiming space.
    For sure, a 'give space' rule would change the corner entry dynamic as well. And probably mid-corner, with drivers differing about who has the right to what space. I haven't fully engaged in this mental exercise, but the thought of it has seemed interesting to me at a glance. Currently, the driver who is 1" ahead has the "right" to decide where to place their car on track, including at 200mph on a straight to squeeze the other guy over. F1 drivers understand this and seem to be ok with it. Sometimes, in a corner, if the inside driver is slightly behind the outside driver the inside driver will accelerate early even though it takes them wide, but they know that by doing this they will be even with or slightly ahead of the outside driver when they touch, and thus they now 'own' the corner and the other guy will have to back off or get pushed off. I've seen this happen a lot and this is why I'm a little surprised at Kvyat's penalty even though it does look worse. When they touched, he was even or ahead.

  7. #1027
    Severed Member JoeW's Avatar
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    https://wtf1.com/post/why-saying-hes...sing-hamilton/

    Good little story about champions who get knocked for having the best car.

  8. #1028
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    Very nice read, Joe. Thanks.
    And I signed in WTF1... dunno why, but it seems I wasn't registered to it! Shame on me!

  9. #1029

  10. #1030
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    Amazing acomplishments.

    The bad thing I can see in those pics is that the cars are now as long as SUVs.
    acket.

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