Isn't plastic fantastic?

[Rare White Ape]

If plastics can trap and keep carbon away from the atmosphere for 25,000 years, climate change worrier might think that's a good thing?

So can trees but I mean yeah right eh?

[Dicknose]

That’s fair. But what would be even more fair is that stores could just automatically transition to such bags without any political fight over it. Sure ban something, but please also give people appropriate substitute as well.

We didnt ban plastic bags - just ones below a certain thickness. Basically the very thin, very cheap ones.
So we still have others, but you have to pay 15c for one, which makes you think about reusing.

I think its helping, but to be honest there is many other easy areas we could do more. This was probably an easy to implement, but not that effective.
But it does get people thinking and aware.

[Dicknose]

If plastics can trap and keep carbon away from the atmosphere for 25,000 years, climate change worrier might think that's a good thing?

Unfortunately the carbon in them comes from oil...

Actually even most of the hydrogen we use come from hydrocarbons (ie oil/natural gas) not from water or atmosphere.


The biggest issue is that the production and use of plastics has increased dramatically in the last decade.
Its just too damn cheap and easy.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes, not arguing against thinking and awareness, definitely need to do that. My argument had been about how making it more political could potentially cause certain group to stop thinking...

Plus, like you said, lawmakers should also think about solutions more comprehensively, taking advice from scientists rather than just rush half baked laws that are not really that effective.

[Rare White Ape]

Plus, like you said, lawmakers should also think about solutions more comprehensively, taking advice from scientists rather than just rush half baked laws that are not really that effective.

They do.

But most legislation gets twisted and turned by what is likely the most popular solution (to retain voters) and the most profitable (to protect corporate interest).

I feel like we've had this discussion before.

[Crazed_Insanity]

If popularity(retaining max amount of voters) is the goal, would you agree we need to make this matter as apolitical as we possibly can? Because once we politicize the issue, you'd immediately lose half or close to half of the population... actually not only lose them, but they'll probably end up acting against your cause/effort!

Fighting against corporate lobbyists would be another matter entirely.

Anyway, in retrospect, it was probably not a good idea to let Al Gore campaign for global warming/climate change. Should've let somebody famous but more politically neutral... or Al should've partnered with another famous conservative in order to ensure the public knows that this is not just a liberal issue, but truly a global crisis! Likewise, passage of laws need to be a bipartisan effort. Until we get most of the population truly 'thinking' and 'aware' of the situation, we'll go nowhere or at least it'll be very hard to go anywhere.

[SportWagon]

On the Weather Network they showed a piece describing how some companies can take ocean waste plastic and use it as raw materials to process into products.

Will we end up in a situation where the junk needs to be dumped into the oceans because that's the only place from which these companies will know how to extract it?

[Dicknose]

Seen a few plans to collect plastic from oceans - they dont seem to work, at least not economically.
Not that hard to get it from recycling and even garbage destined for landfill.

Unless someone is paying to clean up and reusing the plastic is just a handy side effect, I cant see anyone collecting ocean plastic.
Hmm - maybe something on the above mentioned rivers might be useful. But still hard to see it as cheaper/easier than other sources of existing plastic.

[SportWagon]

Actually, the ads I saw today on the same source (The Weather Network) were emphasizing getting the material from beaches. Allegedly before it ended up in oceans. Either I wasn't paying full attention before, or the ads (well, human interest segments) have changed their focus.

[Tom Servo]

I know the Ballona Creek here in LA has big booms across it just before it meets the pacific to collect a lot of that stuff - not sure how small of items it can trap, but there always seems to be a big line of crud up against it. I haven't noticed similar things on the LA or San Gabriel rivers, and no idea if the storm drains are like that. The storm drains do seem to be one of our biggest issues, all the garbage people leave on the streets gets washed into them and, when it rains, suddenly torrents of refuse get flushed out into the ocean and for the next few days, swimming anywhere near one of those in the pacific will likely get you very sick.