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Thread: Billi vs the World

  1. #1
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    Billi vs the World

    Ok so Ill start...
    Billi tell me what you think makes a good member of society - but without referencing religion!!!

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    Wtf?!? Are you serious?

    Ok, since I canít mention ***, then the most important thing is to love one another, even your enemies!

    Then itís to sort yourself out, improve yourself and pick up some responsibilities to make yourself useful to this world in your own special way!

    I think thatís it. If I can think of anything else to add, Iíll be back!

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    Maybe someone who doesn't try to troll him all the time lollll

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    I know we discussed taxes and the rich - what is your attitude on wages, especially do you think companies should link top salaries to the base salaries?
    I find it hard to believe that the CEO is actually "worth" 100 times a base employee. Sure they have skills and education but that is an obscene ratio. They do have pressure and probably actually work longer hours. Also they can have a big impact on the finances of the company. But in some top US companies its even more, its 400x for some.
    https://www.business.org/finance/acc...-vs-employees/

    It just seems that this is totally out of whack. They can earn more in a day than some do in a year.
    And while this is just 1 person vs many, this wage inequality is a problem and seems to be getting worse.

    Like to hear your thoughts...

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    Man, this sure feels weird. DN is like a reporter interviewing the boards most ignored member. This thread probably won’t generate much ratings you know?

    Anyway, since you asked, it’s only polite for me to answer… I personally don’t believe we need to limit how much money a person can make. Minimum wage, definitely. Maximum wage? Never.

    For CEOs, perhaps we can follow Elon’s footsteps… that is pay CEO just bare minimum wage because it’s just not right to not have a salary for CEOs, but have their bonuses tied to company’s performance. If the company performs well, then the CEO ought to be compensated just as well. If company didn’t do well, then ceo only gets the min wage for the year. Whether he stays on next year, that’s for the board and himself to decide. It certainly makes no sense for a ceo who screwed up and still get millions of compensations as he is let go…

    Anyway, I really don’t think this wage gap is that big of a problem. Just as do you truly believe that if Elon became a trillionaire because Tesla and SpaceX end up doing super well by building cool affordable EVs and getting our asses to Mars within our lifetime… do you really believe that can be a problem for the world? Do we absolutely need to make Elon make less money?

    I think the problem only comes when wealth clouds a person’s judgement… just like traps that any dictator/monopoly might fall into… they think they can do whatever they want… that’s probably when we need to step in and stop them because we all know absolute power/wealth can corrupt people.

    We probably don’t want to have Tesla as the only car company nor SpaceX as the only rocket company in town… other than that, I’m not sure why we should care how much money Elon makes.

    [edit]
    Just saw this story and I thought might be relevant to our discussion:
    https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/m...164421929.html

    Elon taunts Bernie Sanders because Bernie thought as you do that the amount of money Elon has is at an 'immoral' level... so Elon is firing back on twitter saying that he'll finally be paying his 'fair share' thru capital gains tax. (Given that his $1 salary probably won't generate much income tax)

    I have to say that those 2 folks currently are probably my most admired folks each at the opposite end of the political spectrum. However, admiring them doesn't mean I have to agree 100% with them all the time. I think the key thing that I admire those 2 is their unwavering 'integrity' to avoid getting corrupted by money and power? Bernie's vision hasn't changed from when he was young til now. Likewise Elon's vision to get his ass to mars still hasn't changed.

    I'd worry about those rich people without any real dreams and visions... those are the type who'd likely end up hanging out with the likes of Jeff Epstein and become cancers of society.

    My point is that money itself really isn't evil. We don't need to limit the amount of money a person can make. It's the love of money that can be problematic. I think it should be clear that neither Sanders nor Musk are driven by money. I think that's the main reason why I love them. Where they land on the political spectrum is irrelevant to me. Bernie just need to focus on helping workers in need, rather than try to prevent rich people from making more money. Socialism should just focus on helping people earning below average income and let capitalism work freely, given that nothing illegal/immoral is really going on. Elon also should continue on making cool things that'll benefit our world and stop wasting time on twitter like Trump!

    Of course, what is 'immoral' in a discussion that can't refer to ***?

    Let's go back to loving our neighbors(and enemies) and relentless pursuit of self improvement and the improvement of our world. If we all do those things, it'll be hard for us to do anything immoral?

    So I really think Jesus, the MAN, is probably the best role model for us.

    Out of curiosity, who do you think is the best role model for humanity?
    Last edited by Crazed_Insanity; November 15th, 2021 at 10:59 AM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crazed_Insanity View Post
    Anyway, since you asked, it’s only polite for me to answer… I personally don’t believe we need to limit how much money a person can make. Minimum wage, definitely. Maximum wage? Never.
    But its never that simple...
    In most corporations the wages all come from the same pot of money, so the more you pay senior roles (not just the single CEO) means that there is less to go to others. Thats why Im saying that tying senior wages to lower wages could be good. No you havent limited maximum wage. But it stops them just throwing more money at people who have a large amount already. Want more - need to give a share to everyone else. Esp when those near the top are usually the ones making the decisions on where the money goes.
    Maybe the lowest paid should have a go at setting wages!

    This becomes even more important when you realise that 10% more money makes a huge difference to the lives of those on the least but makes a much smaller impact on those at the top.

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    If a companyís board is dumb enough to pay all or most of it available pot of money to sr management and not enough to pay its workersÖ, then this company will likely go bankrupt eventually. Sure, they can attract top management talent, but if they canít attract enough actual workers, not sure how they can survive?

    Anyway, I just think it doesnít make sense for government to intervene and micromanage all companies like that. Itís not like politicians are just so responsible financially themselves?

    Having a min wage to protect the most vulnerable is probably enough? (we're having trouble to do even that, and do you really think our congress will be able to pass laws to cap CEO's pay?)

    Besides CEOs, what about athletes? Should their pays be capped? We just should not pay Lewis Hamilton above X million dollars? Who gets to determine at what X, that level will all of a sudden turn Ďimmoralí?

    Also, just because Lewis can command such high salaries, does it make sense to also make the companies janitor to end up making a lot of money because his salary's tied to company's top earner? So if the janitor were to go work else where..., he will all of a sudden unable to support his family because his standard of living had been raised thanks to Lewis...

    I think it'd be great if a company can profit share bonuses with it's employees if they had a great year or something, but probably shouldn't become their permanent salary.

    Also, if such salary tying laws are in effect, do you know what would happen to Tesla and SpaceX employees? Given that their CEO is only making $1/year!

    Personally, I'd like to see politicians passing laws for themselves 1st. It doesn't make sense for them to be making so little with their salaries compared to the corporate world. Politicians also should get bonuses if they can balance budgets that year... if they failed to agree to a budget and cause govt shutdowns, then they automatically lose their jobs as punishment and the government will simply revert/repeat to the same budget as last year. Politicians also shouldn't be allowed to own stocks of their own, but government should take good care of them financially for the rest of their lives. If you own a lot of stocks/private businesses that you just can't give up, then public office isn't for you! There are a lot of things that we need to fix on the government side 1st IMHO.

    Point is, until we can have fiscally responsible government, I just don't believe it should have the power to tell corporations what to do.

    Let companies experiment however they want provided that they don't hurt folks... entrepreneurs should be allowed to try new things without their hands tied behind their back such as bunch of govt red tape. Government can then regulate things that may be harmful to society. CEO's and Sports athletes high salaries are not that harmful to society I don't think.

    I think the main problem with our current system is that our CEO enjoys all the benefits of high salary, but none of the responsibilities. CEOs of companies that caused market crashes or plane crashes are rarely held responsible financially or legally. That needs to change.
    Last edited by Crazed_Insanity; November 17th, 2021 at 09:04 AM.

  8. #8
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    LOL

    Thanks DN.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crazed_Insanity View Post
    I think the main problem with our current system is that our CEO enjoys all the benefits of high salary, but none of the responsibilities. CEOs of companies that caused market crashes or plane crashes are rarely held responsible financially or legally. That needs to change.
    Found the thing I agree with Billi on!

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    Yeah!

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