Page 905 of 2473 FirstFirst ... 405805855895903904905906907915955100514051905 ... LastLast
Results 9,041 to 9,050 of 24728

Thread: Politics

  1. #9041
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    3,553
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    I haven't. I haven't done much of anything because you started your post positing that I must believe one thing because I said something else.

    You might even be right. I dunno, because you immediately put words in my mouth and I immediately said "Oh, here he goes again" and didn't bother with the rest of it.
    He does that a lot.

  2. #9042
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,265
    I'm a bit shocked that nobody has posted anything about the Congressional shooting.

  3. #9043
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    8,832
    Quote Originally Posted by Godson View Post
    I'm a bit shocked that nobody has posted anything about the Congressional shooting.
    My guess is there's not a lot to debate with that. It was horrible, and I'm glad the only person killed was the shooter.

  4. #9044
    Senior Member sandydandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Toronto, ON
    Posts
    2,108
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    My guess is there's not a lot to debate with that. It was horrible, and I'm glad the only person killed was the shooter.
    The congressman is in critical condition.

    The shooter's Facebook profile was memorialized and people are taking a shit all over it.

    I wonder what the NRA has to say about it, since it was an extreme liberal terrorist, (I won't say mentally ill lone wolf, cause obviously that's reserved for far right wing nut jobs).
    Last edited by sandydandy; June 15th, 2017 at 03:06 AM. Reason: Congressman, not senator.

  5. #9045
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    12,803
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    I like to think that I'm the same way, but after a while I got tired of being put into false equivalencies, such as the recent one where my argument that an apathetic electorate is a big part of what allows big money to control elections somehow makes me believe that the exact same thing is true of Hong Kong's democracy. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm trying to protect myself.
    Swervo, rather than getting pissed of at me, why not stick to the topic at hand?

    Whether if voter apathy allowed big money to involve more in politics or perhaps voter apathy is the result of big money's tight grip on our political process?

    HK was simply used for comparison purposes by the TED talker and I assumed wrongly that you saw that. Regardless, our discussion does not require you to accept everything that I said in order to continue. I honestly don't quite understand your need to 'protect' yourself.

    You self admit to being the snarky one. You also seemed to claim that voters like me cause problems in our democracy. Anyway, maybe those were responses after you felt like I attacked you or your beliefs? I've never been on any debate team nor in toastmasters, maybe I should consider joining in order to improve my delivery methods. Quite often I find that TSG and I have very similar ideas, but when I deliver the message, it causes a flame war, when he delivers it, you guys may not fully agree, but at least everything's still civil...

    So I realize I still have a lot to learn..., also makes me apprehensive about joining toastmaster..., if I speak my mind there, wonder if it'll cause people there to hate me so much to want to shoot me too. At least in this forum, I'm somewhat safe...

    Anyway, besides big money problem, we also need to ease up on our political polarization..., or else more 'terrorists' from both sides of the political spectrum might show up on our news... Sigh...

  6. #9046
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    8,832
    Ugh.

    Okay, first off, I'm not pissed at you. I just don't feel like engaging in what I believe will ultimately be a fruitless conversation that will leave us both frustrated and annoyed.

    You say that our discussion does not "require you to accept everything", yet your premise in your very first sentence started with "So you also believe". You didn't ask how I felt, you put words in my mouth or asserted that I *must* believe one thing because I believe something else, and I merely answered that they are not equivalent, so the entire premise is shot. You like to do that, a lot, and I'm protecting myself from having to explain yet again about how the world is not black and white.

    In the end, I don't think it matters whether voter apathy caused big money or if big money caused voter apathy. My *only* point was that unless there's actual vote manipulation (or voter suppression, natch), big money ONLY works if you let it. Most people do, but everyone has the power to research and determine who they want to win (or who they think has the best chance of keeping out someone they really don't want to win). Most of the money goes into campaign advertising and such, and that only works if you let it. Then I cited a specific example, namely you saying you didn't have enough time to research the propositions in Nov. despite there being more days left prior to the election than there were propositions, and it really doesn't take much longer than 10-20 minutes to get a general handle on one of them. Snarky? Yeah. I still stand behind it, though, and it no way, in ANY WAY, indicates a specific belief of mine about any other country's government.

    That's my problem. Don't tell me what I think or believe.

  7. #9047
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    8,832


    That tweet did not age well.

  8. #9048
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    10,171
    Well, it's not wrong.

    What is fun about the shooting is hardcore right wingers seizing the opportunity to condemn the liberal movement.

    https://news.vice.com/story/leftist-...ginia-shooting

    Michael Savage, the popular conservative radio host and author, tweeted, “I warned America the Dems’ constant drumbeat of hatred would lead to violence!” And Breitbart promoted the response of Republican Rep. Steve King of Iowa, a perennial bomb thrower, who said, “Violence is appearing in the streets, and it’s coming from the left.”
    Savage totally nailed it.

    I am so sick and tired of politicians blaming crazies of any type on politics. People are crazy because they don't get the help and support they need to not be crazy. When someone speaks up with a concept or idea to give that crazy some thrust and direction, bad shit happens. What a damned revelation.

    I am so tired of "it's broken because you broke it." What about it's broken because you didn't fix it?

  9. #9049
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    12,803
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    Ugh.

    Okay, first off, I'm not pissed at you. I just don't feel like engaging in what I believe will ultimately be a fruitless conversation that will leave us both frustrated and annoyed.

    You say that our discussion does not "require you to accept everything", yet your premise in your very first sentence started with "So you also believe". You didn't ask how I felt, you put words in my mouth or asserted that I *must* believe one thing because I believe something else, and I merely answered that they are not equivalent, so the entire premise is shot. You like to do that, a lot, and I'm protecting myself from having to explain yet again about how the world is not black and white.

    In the end, I don't think it matters whether voter apathy caused big money or if big money caused voter apathy. My *only* point was that unless there's actual vote manipulation (or voter suppression, natch), big money ONLY works if you let it. Most people do, but everyone has the power to research and determine who they want to win (or who they think has the best chance of keeping out someone they really don't want to win). Most of the money goes into campaign advertising and such, and that only works if you let it. Then I cited a specific example, namely you saying you didn't have enough time to research the propositions in Nov. despite there being more days left prior to the election than there were propositions, and it really doesn't take much longer than 10-20 minutes to get a general handle on one of them. Snarky? Yeah. I still stand behind it, though, and it no way, in ANY WAY, indicates a specific belief of mine about any other country's government.

    That's my problem. Don't tell me what I think or believe.
    Let's start with post #9002, I commented on a post made by Dan Rather. Nothing about you nor your beliefs. I said I agreed mostly with what Rather said, except I don't believe American people can really vote ourselves out of this political mess.

    In #9003, you proceed to engage me and tell me that I'm off with my slight disagreement with Mr Rather. I believe you believe that as long as there's no voter fraud, then this should still be a true democracy! You also think my way of voting is what contributed to our current political problems. Now, I hope I'm not premising anything, but those are just the things I picked up from your post which was premised with your snarkiness.

    Anyway, I assumed you viewed that TED talk I linked earlier, my mistake. That was why I 'asked' you whether if you believe HK has true democracy. It was in a form of a question. I really wasn't aware that I was making a premise as something you must believe. I only brought up HK because the TED talker illustrated various similar points to show how the USA is also no longer a true democracy because of the tainted nominees in elections!

    I can accept YOUR 'premise' that I'm a lousy voter, but I can almost assure you that even if my kind are no longer allowed to vote... or become very informed and have 100% voting rate, regardless of how black or how white or how gray I become, USA's political situation will not improve because I vote more often and more intelligently... because we voters are no longer in real control of our political future. That's just my belief.

    If you just cannot see my point, we can just agree to disagree or I'd like to hear your thoughts on how informed and involved voters can keep big money out of politics when often times we have money tainted candidates coming in from both sides? Tell me what YOU believe please..., or not, if you're really frustrated with this.

    I'm honestly not here trying to make you 'bite' and then get you frustrated.
    Last edited by Crazed_Insanity; June 15th, 2017 at 10:29 AM.

  10. #9050
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    12,803
    Quote Originally Posted by thesameguy View Post
    I am so sick and tired of politicians blaming crazies of any type on politics. People are crazy because they don't get the help and support they need to not be crazy. When someone speaks up with a concept or idea to give that crazy some thrust and direction, bad shit happens. What a damned revelation.

    I am so tired of "it's broken because you broke it." What about it's broken because you didn't fix it?
    Yep.

    However, I think it's probably too much to ask politicians to fix this though. They'll probably just fix this by beefing up security to ensure they have a safer future. Just as they would never ever come up with a version of healthcare that'd be good enough for both themselves and the people they supposedly serve...

    But of course, I hope someone will eventually step up and come up with a more comprehensive fix...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •