Gun control

[21Kid]

Yup... Untrained vigilantes. :smh:

[overpowered]

Being able to use a gun correctly in a situation like that probably takes more training than learning to drive.

[Dicknose]

And even with lots of training people stuff up in high pressure situations.
It's a catch 22 that the situation that might justify using a gun is also the situation when you are likely to be incapable of safely using it.

[speedpimp]

83 yr old robbed of his gun as he walks to his car at 5:30 am (http://www.elkharttruth.com/news/crime-fire-courts/2015/09/29/Elkhart-police-investigating-reported-gun-theft-from-83-year-old-man-on-Dr-Martin-Luther-King-Drive.html)

[Dicknose]

And another shooting spree.

[LHutton]

Yup:

http://news.yahoo.com/shooting-umpqua-community-college-oregon-182211198.html

[Jason]

Sounds like it's another kid who feels the world owes him something. Probably bullied, probably had difficult times with the ladies, and probably believed in really stupid conspiracies... oh and probably white.

[overpowered]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=89d_1411198955

[LHutton]

Sounds like it's another kid who feels the world owes him something. Probably bullied, probably had difficult times with the ladies, and probably believed in really stupid conspiracies... oh and probably white.
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/11224871_482871378558208_1655529826792459572_n.jpg ?oh=d83738c6231817c6d6d3a5122e6f9b3c&oe=569B1D5C

https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlt1/t31.0-8/12039155_482873468557999_6472019223434664532_o.png

[overpowered]

‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens

http://www.theonion.com/article/no-way-prevent-says-only-nation-where-regularly-ha-51444

[21Kid]

These things just happen.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/02/politics/donald-trump-ucc-shooting-mccarthy-gop/index.html

[LHutton]

If you make it harder to get a gun license than a car license, less of this would happen.

[21Kid]

COMMUNIST!!!

[SportWagon]

‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens

http://www.theonion.com/article/no-way-prevent-says-only-nation-where-regularly-ha-51444

Isn't this somewhat similar to the 2011 Norway attacks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

Actually on a smaller scale.

[LHutton]

COMMUNIST!!!
I get that, but I'd just like to see rational people making exciting alternatives to lead death.

[speedpimp]

According to Fox News he asked everyone what their religion was before shooting them. That's according to Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/10/02/day-christians-were-martyred-on-american-soil.html).
1463

[speedpimp]

According to Fox News he asked everyone what their religion was before shooting them. That's according to Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/10/02/day-christians-were-martyred-on-american-soil.html).
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v709/speedpimp/Image2.png

[overpowered]

I would add that there is lots being done to try to stop cancer and cancer death has been dramatically reduced in the last 40 years.

Car crash deaths are also way down in the last 40 years -- mostly due to stricter enforcement of DUI and better safety equipment.

We are doing things about those causes of death. We're not doing anything about random shootings.

http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/

[G'day Mate]

The answer to cancer deaths? More radiation!

[Godson]

The answer to cancer deaths? More radiation!

And Chemo.



Funny how that actually works. (Coming from a second amendment advocate.)

[G'day Mate]

Chemo is controlled. Radiation control impinges on my rights :p

[G'day Mate]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/02/oregon-college-shooting-gun-control-roseburg

[LHutton]

Chemo is controlled. Radiation control impinges on my rights :p
So if we're more selective about who we shoot..... and shoot likely shooters before they shoot anyone? :lol:

[drew]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/02/oregon-college-shooting-gun-control-roseburg

"Tanner Langdon, 39, shopping for a holster for the 9mm wedged in his jeans, said the massacre would have been averted if the victims had been armed. “A whole different outcome.” He patted his gun. “I refuse to be a victim.”"


So, it's this stupid shit that causes all the debate/arguments.


I would venture a guess that less than 1% of people that can legally own/carry a gun, have any sort of professional training (say, akin to police training/reaction in stress situations, etc, and marksmanship). Everybody is tough when the shit's not flung at the fan.

I've been around guns for just about my whole life. I'm pretty to very proficient with them I can chew the 10-ring with a 357 at 50 feet all day (and have a dime somewhere that I hit with a rifle at 250yards in high school). But, those are inanimate targets, not people. If I were in a situation where some crazy person (let's face it, that's what the real issue is here) started shooting up the place I was in, I'm 100% sure basic human survival instinct would override any feelings of heroism, and I'd be trying to get the fuck out of there.

The only thing I see "arming everyone" achieving, given the context of training and proper response, is 4 people in the room trying to shoot each other. I'm not real sure that's constructive [rhetorical]

Without the training (proper training), someone is likely to panic/freeze with their gun (if they don't just start spraying the room in "defense"), and probably get themselves killed, and give the crazy another weapon to use.


People seem to think that if we add another level (psychological) of check on someone legally purchasing a gun infringes on their right to own them. You already have your guns, I can't imagine, in any situation/universe that will change, they're not going to be taken away from you.

...and again, this will have zero effect on those that acquire them illegally, which I don't think most understand. People think that "gun reform" means they'll have their guns taken away, and all their gun sport/etc will end are just stupid.


The fact is, this is probably about 30 years overdue, and will never change.

[LHutton]

Out of interest, can a blind person own a gun?

[overpowered]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2013/sep/10/america-gun-licences-blind-people

[LHutton]

I hope they have really accurate ears.

[LHutton]

Shame a guy like this doesn't run gun stores.

http://news.yahoo.com/oregon-gunman-may-killed-more-not-hero-student-023653508.html


Gunman in Oregon massacre was turned away from firearms academy

ROSEBURG, Ore. (Reuters) - The gunman slain by police after he killed his English professor and eight others at an Oregon college was once turned away from a firearms academy by an instructor who recalled finding him "weird" and "a little bit too anxious" for high-level weapons training.

"We wanted him to take a beginner safety course and he was trying to tell me that he already had experience with firearms and I didn't get a good feeling about him, so I turned him down," Way told Reuters.

[overpowered]

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/12112214_10207537532018190_8250977877628543080_n.j pg?oh=137b43bd8a5667ec5c9fa6702cef2fbd&oe=56A7ED6B

[neanderthal]

Look at the time period in that table for the terrorist deaths. Everything else is one year.

[overpowered]

All official GOP and NRA events must allow open and concealed carry

https://www.change.org/p/all-gop-and-nra-events-must-allow-open-and-concealed-carry

[G'day Mate]

:lol: Nice one

[LHutton]

...
I'm signing because this will increase the chances of them killing each other.

[LHutton]

Okay, this doesn't follow the usual line but it's actually pretty clever:

http://i.imgur.com/2sRJT41.jpg

[Jason]

If everyone who owned a gun went through an extensive background test, psychiatric evaluation, gun training, and emergency training, that graphic would make a good point.

[LHutton]

Very true. And even then accidents happen, as they did with JFK.

Wonder how many blind people they have in the Secret Service with guns.

[Godson]

JFK wasn't an accident dumbass.

[overpowered]

Okay, this doesn't follow the usual line but it's actually pretty clever:

http://i.imgur.com/2sRJT41.jpg

The main problem with that is that all of the people with guns in that picture are highly trained secret service agents. They've all undergone extensive background checking, mental health checking and gun training that includes role playing so that they know how to react to different scenarios. They're way better trained than the average cop. They're a lot less likely to make a mistake with a gun than the average redneck with a gun who may know how to operate it and even hit targets with decent accuracy but has no idea how to use one properly in a crisis situation. For example the article I posted recently about the "good guy with a gun" who tried to stop a car jacking but accidentally shot the victim instead. Someone with the level of training of a secret service agent would be very unlikely to make that mistake.

[overpowered]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10206718620758282

[LHutton]

JFK wasn't an accident dumbass.
Actually one theory is that it was. The Secret Service agent in the car behind him got up whilst putting his safety off and accidentally fired a round in the back of his head. But having reviewed footage I actually don't like that theory. Corrected.

[Godson]

Keep up the conspiracy theories.

[LHutton]

Not really a conspiracy theory actually. In fact, quite the opposite.

[speedpimp]

Only thing that kills that theory is that back then almost everybody carried revolvers.

[Godson]

And that Lee Harvey Oswald shot him.

[overpowered]

Guns, Impulsive Angry Behavior, and Mental Disorders: Results from the National Comorbidity Survey Replication (NCS-R)

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/bsl.2172/abstract;jsessionid=09D1D7D0EA798D7D280D3209C92A3F CC.f03t01

[LHutton]

Only thing that kills that theory is that back then almost everybody carried revolvers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_Error

[speedpimp]

Bullshit. Just like all other conspiracy theories.

[Sad, little man]

Sigh, it's just too bad there's nothing we can do to prevent things like this... IF ONLY THERE WERE SOMETHING WE COULD DO!!

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/10/06/boy-11-charged-murder-girl-8/73433082/

[LHutton]

Bullshit. Just like all other conspiracy theories.
Except it isn't really a conspiracy theory, since no conspiracy was involved in the killing, it was just an accident.


Sigh, it's just too bad there's nothing we can do to prevent things like this... IF ONLY THERE WERE SOMETHING WE COULD DO!!

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/10/06/boy-11-charged-murder-girl-8/73433082/
Owner of the gun should go to prison.

[Sad, little man]

See, that's the thing though. It doesn't matter how many irresponsible gun owners we throw in jail, it does nothing to prevent these kinds of incidents.

It's the same reason we're now realizing that mandatory minimum drug sentences are not effective. It doesn't matter how stiff you make the penalty when people think they'll never get caught.

How many people do you think get prosecuted for irresponsible storage of guns in their home when it doesn't actually lead to an incident like this? I'll bet pretty much none.

And what percentage of irresponsibly stored guns lead to issues like this? I bet very few. Now granted, any number of these incidents is too many. But the point is, your overall odds of getting prosecuted for irresponsibly storing guns in your home are incredibly small. So throwing the guy in prison won't dissuade anyone from being similarly irresponsible.

We as a country have already proven and continue to prove that we can't act like adults when it comes to having these toys, so the fucking toys need to be taken away. Sorry, I know some people are capable of responsibly owning guns, but unfortunately it's always the idiots that ruin the fun for everyone.

[overpowered]

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Encanto-Trolley-Stop-Shooting-62nd-Street-Akins-Street-331141362.html

[overpowered]

John Paul Stevens (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Paul_Stevens) on the second amendment.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-five-extra-words-that-can-fix-the-second-amendment/2014/04/11/f8a19578-b8fa-11e3-96ae-f2c36d2b1245_story.html?postshare=6941443900974892

[SportWagon]

Homicide by bow-and-arrow in Kitchener, Ontario...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitchener-waterloo/kitchener-police-release-drawing-of-man-in-connection-with-arrow-death-1.3261571

[G'day Mate]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=30&v=LORVfnFtcH0

[overpowered]

People are getting shot by toddlers on a weekly basis this year

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/10/14/people-are-getting-shot-by-toddlers-on-a-weekly-basis-this-year/

[Dicknose]

Scary that it is just looking at under 4. How many if the count was under 10.

[LHutton]

Ban toddlers.

[MR2 Fan]

the only way to stop a bad toddler with a gun is a good toddler with a gun

[Dicknose]

Clearly the toddlers just need training.
Also none of them did this with their own gun, so therefore toddlers are safer if they own their own weapon.

[G'day Mate]

What you need is a well regulated toddler militia to guard against a corrupt toddler government.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Amen brothers!
And baby Jesus loves you! :D

[LHutton]

What you need is a well regulated toddler militia to guard against a corrupt toddler government.
Disagree. What you need is a well-armed monkey militia to guard against toddlers... and crab people.

[SportWagon]

Seriously, in at least one of the referenced cases, surely the mother violated her training when she left her purse, containing a handgun, unattended. You might have a permit to carry concealed weapons, but not to leave them carelessly lying around.

[Freude am Fahren]

That's assuming she had training.

[overpowered]

Seriously, in at least one of the referenced cases, surely the mother violated her training when she left her purse, containing a handgun, unattended. You might have a permit to carry concealed weapons, but not to leave them carelessly lying around.The laws vary quite a bit from state to state.

In the more right wing redneck states, it's pretty common that there are no laws that address such things at all.

California is not one of those places. California Penal Code 25100, storing a firearm in a place where a child may be able to get to it without supervision or where a person who is not allowed to possess firearms can easily get to it is illegal.

[thesameguy]

Sadly, a high school friend's dad did time for such a failure.

[overpowered]

Was the weapon discharged?

[Crazed_Insanity]

People who have proven to be irresponsible should lose their right to bear arms.

[Dicknose]

People who have proven to be irresponsible should lose their right to bear arms.

And thats the problem - the logic assumes you should have a weapon until its too late.
Shouldnt it be that you have to show you are responsible, do some training before you get a weapon.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Training doesn't guarantee the 'student' will always be responsible. Just like we can still have reckless licensed drivers. Isn't it sensible to sometimes suspend or revoke license of irresponsible drivers? That's what I meant.

Right to bear arms is a given by constitution, but if you're unable to be responsible while handling arms whether due to mental issues or just reckless, then that right needs to be taken away.

[Dicknose]

But waiting till someone is injured or dead is a bit late.
We do train and test drivers.
We do fine and penalize drivers for a range on minor offenses (they don't need to crash or hurt anyone to get penalized)

How do you detect these irresponsible people?
If it's mostly waiting till their weapon is used to injure or kill someone, then it's too late.
How many irresponsible people have had a child get access to the weapon but no one got injured? Many 100 times for every accidental older shooting someone.
Shouldn't the aim be to prevent these incidents to reduce the number of people injured.
Otherwise you are just stopping the people who might have a 2nd incident after their child has killed someone. I think even the dumb people would learn after a serious incident.
Horse, gate, gone, close.

[SportWagon]

:sing: Bang! Bang! Maxwell's silver hammer came down upon their head! Bang! Bang! Maxwell's silver hammer made sure... ... that they were dead!:sing:

[LHutton]

But waiting till someone is injured or dead is a bit late.
We do train and test drivers.
We do fine and penalize drivers for a range on minor offenses (they don't need to crash or hurt anyone to get penalized)

How do you detect these irresponsible people?
If it's mostly waiting till their weapon is used to injure or kill someone, then it's too late.
How many irresponsible people have had a child get access to the weapon but no one got injured? Many 100 times for every accidental older shooting someone.
Shouldn't the aim be to prevent these incidents to reduce the number of people injured.
Otherwise you are just stopping the people who might have a 2nd incident after their child has killed someone. I think even the dumb people would learn after a serious incident.
Horse, gate, gone, close.
Well there was one incident lately where one of those 'citizens on patrol' near the riots accidentally discharged a weapon. That should have lead to a fine and a ban. Maybe you do the same for people carrying whilst drunk. Quicker bans for young owners and new licensees. The other would be medical screening pre-license and every so often there after. Maybe you require proof of a certified gun cabinet pre-license. Maybe you test that the person can actually hit a target 1ft wide at 20ft consistently pre-license. That would weed out the incompetent and the blind. Maybe you test their ability to operate a firearm safely, loading, unloading, clearing the chamber, safety switches, pointing it in a safe direction etc. Screening based on holding a clean driving license for a minimum of 10 years, someone who can't follow rules isn't suitable for a gun. Why would you let a two time drink driver owner a gun for instance? You can also test if someone is an alcoholic/drug user with a medical. Let's face it, if it was anywhere near as difficult to get a gun license as it is to get into SWAT or SO19, far less people would have a gun and there'd be far less incidents. At the moment though, an adult just walks into a shop and buys a gun, and he could be a meth addict, an alcoholic, a drink driver etc. He might never have operated a firearm before. He may even be illiterate and incapable of reading instructions. Christ, he may even have Turrets or epilepsy and hence be capable of accidental damage. He may not even be able to see as things stand right now.

[speedpimp]

What the toddler really needs is a good hiding for missing his target. If you can train them, then beat them. It's worked properly for thousands of years without any ill side effects.

[LHutton]

A toddler with a gun indicates an irresponsible owner, just as a toddler with a car does.

[overpowered]

http://www.naplesnews.com/news/crime/zombicon-shooting-raises-security-concerns_30852252

[Alan P]

Don't forget though, it's those refugees you guys need to be careful about. You never know where they come from or what they might do.

[Godson]

Don't forget though, it's those refugees you guys need to be careful about. You never know where they come from or what they might do.

:lol:

:(

[LHutton]

http://news.yahoo.com/gunman-custody-attack-planned-parenthood-clinic-074633655.html


Suspect in custody after shooting at Planned Parenthood

[LHutton]

Don't forget though, it's those refugees you guys need to be careful about. You never know where they come from or what they might do.
There will always be random murders in any society but the current worry with refugees coming from areas where large, expansive terrorist armies are present, is not random murders but extremely well organised mass murder perpetrated by militarised Jihadi armies with military grade firepower who've smuggled their way in among the genuine refugees and the destabilising affect it has on the societies and civilisations it's being wrought on. Domestic police are simply not trained to cope with well organised urban warfare on a large scale and that was seen to some degree in Paris. Lone gunmen and armed robbers they can deal with forever and a day, however 1,000-10,000 Islamist lunatics with PKP Pechenegs, RPGs and IEDs isn't something they can deal with even once. The army/marines would have to be called in, then you'll effectively be living under martial law until they've sorted the problem out, then you'll have to repair whatever city it broke out in, bury the collateral etc.

We've seen the likes of ISIS overpower militaries in other countries, so it wouldn't be entirely unthinkable for a few thousand strong unit to overrun a military base and come out with tanks and missile launchers and take a county hostage. That's why there's skepticism and caution. Nobody imagined anything like 9/11 would happen until it did. Hell, look at Chechnya if you think it can't happen. Now put yourself in the position of EU nations which don't have anything like the military might of the US (some probably couldn't even match the US police for firepower) and it's a fucking scary proposition.

View the situation as a deadly viral outbreak with no cure, it sucks to keep people in quarantine, especially those not infected, but it's the only way to guarantee that it doesn't spread. You wouldn't have randomly put a million people from an Ebola inflicted region living in the EU, so why randomly put a million people from a terrorist inflicted region in the EU? And Jeez, Ebola has killed a pathetically small amount of people by comparison.

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QjZY3WiO9s

[G'day Mate]

:up:

[Alan P]

They seem to believe that the potential that someone might have a gun concealed on their person is enough of a potential threat that it will stop these things and these people. It won't. If anything the video shows it makes them the first target and therefore the first person to get shot.

[MR2 Fan]

Agreed....a lot of these people who do these mass shootings don't expect to survive them anyway, it seems

[Godson]

I'd like to see that same test done with competitive shooters.

[Crazed_Insanity]

For the citizens, we're just not fast enough... so yeah it's a bad idea to have conceal weapons for regular folks. That I totally agree.

However, for the cops, perhaps they're too fast after all their training or maybe not enough training... so when they're spooked while trying to save their own lives, they're accused of being racists.

Hope that video can also help folks be more understanding of cops too.

[overpowered]

Even if you're a suspected terrorist, you need to be allowed to buy guns.

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/gop-blocks-bill-stop-terrorists-buying-guns

[LHutton]

Put everyone who wants a firearms license through the same vetting and training as cops.

[Godson]

That really isn't much tbh

[LHutton]

That really isn't much tbh
Mostly works though.

[LHutton]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-uber-driver-shoots-gunman-met-0420-20150419-story.html


Uber driver, licensed to carry gun, shoots gunman in Logan Square

Authorities say no charges will be filed against an Uber driver who shot and wounded a gunman who opened fire on a crowd of people in Logan Square over the weekend.

[TheBenior]

He actually just got his pistol back.

[Godson]

He actually just got his pistol back.


;)?

[G'day Mate]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-uber-driver-shoots-gunman-met-0420-20150419-story.html

Hooray for anecdotes!

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/12/08/responsible-gun-owner-settles-toy-store-dispute-second-amendment-style-video/


‘Responsible Gun Owner’ Settles Toy Store Dispute Second Amendment Style

[Freude am Fahren]

https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/l/t1.0-9/12249761_10100177231469089_7886714164148106600_n.j pg?oh=ad3e6153bbbfec6a8aa92fe1def28c58&oe=56E9997D

[LHutton]

He actually just got his pistol back.
Nope.

[TheBenior]

Nope.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-concealed-carry-gun-return-met-1202-20151201-story.html

[LHutton]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-concealed-carry-gun-return-met-1202-20151201-story.html
Oh you mean after the incident? Sorry, I thought you meant before.

[Godson]

He would have had his gun before the incident, otherwise he couldn't have shot the bad guy.


Please continue to be a half-whit knee-jerk reactionist.

[George]

Um, shouldn't that be half-wit?

Tee hee hee! Sorry, my friend, I absolutely could not resist. :p

*runs safely out of firing range*

[Fogelhund]

http://deadstate.org/combat-veterans-shoot-down-the-nra-good-guy-with-a-gun-is-based-on-a-fantasy-world/

Combat veterans shoot down the NRA: ‘Good guy with a gun’ is based on a ‘fantasy world’

[LHutton]

He would have had his gun before the incident, otherwise he couldn't have shot the bad guy.


Please continue to be a half-whit knee-jerk reactionist.
He could have got it back just before the incident, which is what I originally expected was being implied. Never mind, thanks for the irony once again.

[21Kid]

http://deadstate.org/combat-veterans-shoot-down-the-nra-good-guy-with-a-gun-is-based-on-a-fantasy-world/

Combat veterans shoot down the NRA: ‘Good guy with a gun’ is based on a ‘fantasy world’
Which is pretty much proven in the video above.

[overpowered]

https://www.facebook.com/photo/download/?fbid=10207170731858008

[overpowered]

I'd like to see that same test done with competitive shooters.Competitive shooters shoot at targets.

They don't react to an unexpected threat.

It's not as much about shooting skills as it's about the ability to react quickly and correctly. Note that the cops are saying that it's a perishable skill. They have to train regularly and they can lose it in as little as a month if they don't keep training.

[Godson]

Competitive shooters shoot at targets.

They don't react to an unexpected threat.

It's not as much about shooting skills as it's about the ability to react quickly and correctly. Note that the cops are saying that it's a perishable skill. They have to train regularly and they can lose it in as little as a month if they don't keep training.

I'd still wager they'd be a lot better in the situation than any of those people in the test.

[LHutton]

[IMG]https://www.facebook.com/photo/download/?fbid=10207170731858008[IMG]
Would the people just find other ways of killing though? Looking at Canada too, it seems North America has other issues besides the availability of guns.

[overpowered]

I'd still wager they'd be a lot better in the situation than any of those people in the test.In that video I posted about the college students who volunteered for training, they had one competitive shooter. He went for cover instantly, which was better than the others. He then failed to get his gun out and was shot multiple times, just like the others.

[Godson]

Im pretty sure he wasnt a competitive shooter, just that he had many hours of shooting experience.

[Alan P]

Competitive shooters train regularly to remain calm and control their breathing while shooting. IMO they wouldn't have the first idea about shooting someone while hopped up on adrenalin.

[TheBenior]

There are kinds of competitive shooting that actually involve moving about.

[overpowered]

And they're still trying to stay as calm as possible, because nervousness inhibits aim and steadiness of the hands. Trying to stay calm when someone's got a gun and is coming after you is quite another type of animal, and I'd think you'd know that better than most of us.

[TheBenior]

Realistically, force-on-force training with Simunition ammo is the best training for dealing with an active shooter, but if you get caught by surprise and are outnumbered, good chance you don't come out on top.

I think odds are that a three gunner gets killed in a multiple attacker scenario just like anyone else, but they'd have better odds than most.

[MR2 Fan]

there's many places I could have put this, but I'll just leave it here:

https://www.facebook.com/GunTotinJesus/

[overpowered]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/one-killed-officer-involved-shooting-charlotte-mall-n485646

[speedpimp]

This is what happens to a gun company that doesn't keep good paperwork or keep a strict inventory. (http://www.ctpost.com/news/article/Feds-CT-gun-company-didn-t-register-machine-6715350.php)

[Godson]

He is a shit bag.

[LHutton]

The real question is, "why did he have them?"

[Godson]

Because he likely made them.

[MR2 Fan]

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/12/hero-security-guard-diffuses-hostage-situation-only-to-be-fatally-shot-by-late-arriving-cops/comments/#disqus

[LHutton]

Heh, sometimes security guards are wannabe cops who didn't make the cut but sometimes that cut is just wrong.

[overpowered]

http://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/1269cbCOMIC-goodguy-with-a-gun.jpg

[MR2 Fan]

http://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/1269cbCOMIC-goodguy-with-a-gun.jpg

That's one of the biggest problems with that mentality, when cops arrive, they have no idea who the "good guy" vs the "bad guy" is and will take down anyone who's shooting.

[tigeraid]

Last year after the Hebdo attacks, a gun owner's club in Texas tried to re-enact it with paintball guns, with a bunch of armed civilians trying to "save the day." Every experiment devolved into a fucking Wild West-style shootout, and every single "good guy" civilian died, having shot each other, and only once out of the experiments did they manage to take down even ONE of the attackers.

I forget where I read it now, but apparently there was an armed forces veteran present during one of the last two shootings (in Cali I think?) and had his weapon on him. Instead of getting into an idiotic shootout, he did his best to organize protection of the innocent, getting them into hiding or away from the gunmen. He said in an interview that it would've been absolutely stupid to start firing back. Acted like a hero actually does.

It's fucking daydreaming bullshit, and the notion that "I'd rather go down shooting" is fucking horrible because you're more likely to kill an innocent than get the bad guy. Arming the untrained, stupid, trigger-happy general populace as a panacea to terrorism is nonsense logic. Never mind all the hilariously accurate statistics that show more people dying from children accidentally firing their guns in the home, than from terrorist attacks.

(InB4 someone posts a link to one or two ultra-rare, ultra-lucky incidents where an off-duty marine shot a gunman and saved some people.)

[overpowered]

Here that is:

http://kxan.com/2015/01/14/texas-gun-owners-re-enact-charlie-hebdo-massacre/

[LHutton]

http://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/1269cbCOMIC-goodguy-with-a-gun.jpg
The last few lines raise an interesting question. Should it be legal to be in charge of a firearm in public whilst under the influence of drink?

[Godson]

The last few lines raise an interesting question. Should it be legal to be in charge of a firearm in public whilst under the influence of drink?

It is not legal. In Missouri or Kansas to carry a concealed firearm, and i would wager having control of a firearm, while under the influence of any mind altering substances.

[Godson]

Last year after the Hebdo attacks, a gun owner's club in Texas tried to re-enact it with paintball guns, with a bunch of armed civilians trying to "save the day." Every experiment devolved into a fucking Wild West-style shootout, and every single "good guy" civilian died, having shot each other, and only once out of the experiments did they manage to take down even ONE of the attackers.

I forget where I read it now, but apparently there was an armed forces veteran present during one of the last two shootings (in Cali I think?) and had his weapon on him. Instead of getting into an idiotic shootout, he did his best to organize protection of the innocent, getting them into hiding or away from the gunmen. He said in an interview that it would've been absolutely stupid to start firing back. Acted like a hero actually does.

It's fucking daydreaming bullshit, and the notion that "I'd rather go down shooting" is fucking horrible because you're more likely to kill an innocent than get the bad guy. Arming the untrained, stupid, trigger-happy general populace as a panacea to terrorism is nonsense logic. Never mind all the hilariously accurate statistics that show more people dying from children accidentally firing their guns in the home, than from terrorist attacks.

(InB4 someone posts a link to one or two ultra-rare, ultra-lucky incidents where an off-duty marine shot a gunman and saved some people.)

The fact that you use hilarious and a child being shot in the same sentence tells me you are not a polite individual. The motion of the idea pisses me off and you should be ashamed of that comment and thought. I do not care of your point, and do not bother trying to defend yourself.

[overpowered]

Even Texas doesn't allow it.

[tigeraid]

The fact that you use hilarious and a child being shot in the same sentence tells me you are not a polite individual. The motion of the idea pisses me off and you should be ashamed of that comment and thought. I do not care of your point, and do not bother trying to defend yourself.


Well, actually, if you read it, I said the "statistics about children SHOOTING others accidentally" are hilariously accurate. Didn't say children were being shot. Plenty of those statistics involve children shooting their parents accidentally, for example.

But thanks for getting that wrong AND completely blowing that whole thing out of proportion instead of understanding the point.

If it helps, I will paste the EXACT quote, with the word "hilariously" removed and replaced it "alarmingly." The statement is still the same, the point is still the same, the intent is still the same.


Arming the untrained, stupid, trigger-happy general populace as a panacea to terrorism is nonsense logic. Never mind all the alarmingly accurate statistics that show more people dying from children accidentally firing their guns in the home, than from terrorist attacks.

[Godson]

Nowhere did you say parents. You simply said people. Continue to laugh at others who get injured and die.

[Freude am Fahren]

That's not what he's really doing, but whatever, let's move along.

[LHutton]

It's possible that armed civilians could help against terrorism but obviously at the moment you have a whole shit load of people who don't even understand the basics of safe firearm storage and operation, let alone how to shoot properly. I blame the licensing system for that. It's like letting people with severe down's drive HGVs with no training, the very idea of it is ridiculous and people can understand that because The Constitution didn't mention HGVs. But for some reason, because of the 2nd Amendment, people assume that allowing any retard a gun, minus training and testing, is an indisputable right.

[MR2 Fan]

:up:

[G'day Mate]

This woman sounds like a pretty good shot - http://www.occupydemocrats.com/responsible-gun-owner-kills-own-daughter-believing-she-was-intruder/

[Cam]

The daughter could have saved her own life if she had a gun.

[LHutton]

Even Texas doesn't allow it.
Given that they allow blind people guns in some states, allowing drunk people to use guns seems relatively sensible by comparison.


This woman sounds like a pretty good shot - http://www.occupydemocrats.com/responsible-gun-owner-kills-own-daughter-believing-she-was-intruder/
Poor Oscar Pistorius was sent down for that.;)

[overpowered]

Responsible gun owners.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/breaking-news/os-orlando-girl-shot-celebratory-gunfire-20160101-story.html

[G'day Mate]

More responsible gun owners kill a girl following a road-rage incident (http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2016/01/unt-student-shot-in-head-in-suspected-road-rage-incident.html/). The six guys in the car must've felt pretty threatened - this is her:

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/files/2016/01/Sara-Mutschlechner.jpg

[LHutton]

That's a weird one. I can't see why 6 guys would need to shoot a single woman, even if they did have malicious intentions towards her.

[G'day Mate]

Well I guess they didn't need to, but it turns out she's dead

[Dicknose]

She wasn't alone, they shot into a car with other people. It's quite possible they were aiming at anyone specifically.

The problem I see with the "it's not guns, it's the people" is that there is a range of different styles of shooting and they all happen regularly.
Accidental discharge
Suicide
Domestic dispute
Shooting in the air
Shoot intruder who is friendly
Shooting unarmed threat due to fear, especially black victim
Tough guy in a group, indiscriminate firing when angry, hyped (this could be the girl shoot in the car)

That's just a start and hasn't even touched on the mass shootings or premeditated crimes.

The problem is treating the causes or identifying who would be likely to do any of these is really hard. It's not a single cause.
Really the only thing in common is guns and people.
Saying we need better mental health checks doesn't help most of those.
Only way to reduce these across the range of shooting types is with stricter gun laws.

[overpowered]

Responsible gun owner shoots 14 year old for ding dong ditch

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/paranoid-gun-owner-shoots-teen-for-ringing-his-doorbell/

[G'day Mate]

... and apparently they're not yet sure whether shooting a kid as he runs away from your house is even illegal

[LHutton]

There must be a massacre every Halloween during Trick or Treat.

[overpowered]

http://www.bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/03/gunman-fatally-shoots-two-relatives-at-cemetery-before-turning-gun-on-himself/

[overpowered]

Texas Motorist Shoots 6-Year-Old Child After Family Makes Wrong Turn

http://www.bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/03/texas-motorist-shoots-6-year-old-child-after-family-makes-wrong-turn/

[G'day Mate]

That headlights one is truly fucked.

[LHutton]

That's one problem with gun availability, it gives bad people a lethal alternative to simply shouting abuse. Psychological evaluation under stress should be part of licensing.

[21Kid]

:(


Yet according to the NRA, all problems can be solved with a gun. Sure seems like more problems are created than solved. yup

[overpowered]

https://www.facebook.com/photo/download/?fbid=10153870469517363

[overpowered]

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/13/co-founder-of-anti-obama-march-shot-between-the-eyes-by-organizer-over-gun-dispute/

:smh:

[Cam]

Is it wrong to thing that pro-gun people shooting each other is hilarious?

[21Kid]

Didn't he have a gun to protect himself?

[LHutton]

^Hallucinogenic dart. Clearly.

"My eyes are awash with a thousand pink moons. I think you all deserve to die... except you... no... you deserve to die too.":lol:

[Godson]

Death isn't funny. It is sad that alcohol was in use, which supports my saying is a lack of firearm respect.


I fucking hate people.

[G'day Mate]

On their Facebook page they keep going on about "self defense". Of course, if there were no guns there then "self defense" wouldn't be necessary, however they ignore that and after all it's not the gun's fault for being there, so that seems to make "self defense" an acceptable rationale.

[overpowered]

Self defense might still be necessary, but would be less likely to end in a lethal exchange. Idiots still hit each other all the time.

[G'day Mate]

Yeah, it doesn't just escalate straight to "kill or be killed" straight away.

At least they get to make an argument along the lines of "the only thing safer than having one gun is having two guns ... you know, cause your friend drunkie might nick one of 'em"

[tigeraid]

Is it wrong to thing that pro-gun people shooting each other is hilarious?

Apparently yes, unless a child is even briefly mentioned, then you're a sadistic monster. Once you turn 18, it's hilarious.

[novicius]

Self defense might still be necessary, but would be less likely to end in a lethal exchange. Idiots still hit each other all the time.
Yep agreed. Self-defense exists in the face of intent to do harm, apart from there being guns present.

[LHutton]

Death isn't funny. It is sad that alcohol was in use, which supports my saying is a lack of firearm respect.


I fucking hate people.
Assassin's Creed dialogue reference.

[LHutton]

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/22/americas/saskatchewan-la-loche-school-shooting-canada/index.html


Four dead, several injured in shooting in Saskatchewan school

[tigeraid]

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/22/americas/saskatchewan-la-loche-school-shooting-canada/index.html


And like our country always does after a rare, isolated mass shooting, about fourteen far right-wing nutjobs will talk about owning guns, and the rest of us will mourn, and we will move on.

[overpowered]

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/23/man-opens-fire-on-good-samaritan-trying-to-help-him-in-snowstorm/

:smh:

[FaultyMario]

Saw that and was thinking whether it belonged here or on the bad drivers thread.

[MR2 Fan]

Breaking..."Emergency officials in Denver, Colo. say as many as nine people have been shot and stabbed in and around Denver Coliseum Arena."

I have an idea, let's ban Colorado, there seems to be an unusual amount of mass shootings there

[speedpimp]

It was at a motorcycle show and was between two rival motorcycle clubs. Here (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/01/30/two-shot-one-stabbed-at-denver-coliseum-police-say.html?intcmp=hpbt4).

[overpowered]

Breaking..."Emergency officials in Denver, Colo. say as many as nine people have been shot and stabbed in and around Denver Coliseum Arena."

I have an idea, let's ban Colorado, there seems to be an unusual amount of mass shootings thereFloriduh is worse.

http://qz.com/463260/all-204-mass-shootings-so-far-this-year-in-america-mapped/

[LHutton]

It was at a motorcycle show and was between two rival motorcycle clubs. Here (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/01/30/two-shot-one-stabbed-at-denver-coliseum-police-say.html?intcmp=hpbt4).
In that case I'm betting the guns weren't legally owned, and therefore not addressable via gun control laws.

[Godson]

In that case I'm betting the guns weren't legally owned, and therefore not addressable via gun control laws.

Glad you can see that. Others won't, and will scream that this was a mass shooting or some shit.

[speedpimp]

In that case I'm betting the guns weren't legally owned, and therefore not addressable via gun control laws.

The two clubs involved were The Mongols and The Iron Order. The Iron Order is a club made up primarily of law enforcement officers and service members. A member (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/feud-between-motorcycle-clubs-started-deadly-denver-brawl-attorney-says/) of the Iron Order is a Colorado DOC member and fired his legally carried gun "in self defense". The Iron Order has gotten a reputation for instigating trouble with other clubs and they tend to get away with it because of their members being police officers.
BTW, The Mongols had no firearms on them at all.

[G'day Mate]

In that case I'm betting the guns weren't legally owned, and therefore not addressable via gun control laws.

Part of gun control is reducing the amount of guns to actually make them harder to get, not just some bullshit "oh well his cousin gave it to him so he's an outlaw" argument. Here his cousin wouldn't have an assault rifle full stop. For all intents and purposes, nobody does.

[Freude am Fahren]

^^Exactly^^

That's why it will never happen here seriously. Less guns = less money for the gun companies.

[G'day Mate]

Yeah, I don't ever see scenes like this being a reality in the US:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/image/4431214-3x4-700x933.jpg

[Yw-slayer]

http://lanesplitter.jalopnik.com/gun-toting-truck-nutjob-to-biker-youre-all-about-to-ge-1756512932

LOL, I think.

[overpowered]

Not sure what state that's in. I don't recognize the plate style.

We have so many violent morons in this country.

[thesameguy]

Yeah, I don't ever see scenes like this being a reality in the US:

What do you mean? Plenty of people around here have that many guns. We just take care of our guns and keep them in display cases, not on dump trucks. To each his own...

[speedpimp]

Not sure what state that's in. I don't recognize the plate style.

We have so many violent morons in this country.

Texas plates and the truck is a Silverado Texas Edition.

[overpowered]

Texas has some of the most lax gun laws in the country. That idiot might not have even broken the law.

[G'day Mate]

What do you mean? Plenty of people around here have that many guns. We just take care of our guns and keep them in display cases, not on dump trucks. To each his own...

:lol:

[novicius]

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/crime-and-courts/woman-killed-in-shooting-outside-metro-market-on-madison-s/article_ea9e1538-39be-55e7-be05-29848d8f1b58.html

[Godson]

Sounds like someone was upset at an ex.



Fucker

[novicius]

Yup. A few blocks away from my Momma's house. :|

It's actually a pretty nice neighborhood. Not really an indicator of anything.

[LHutton]

Yeah, I don't ever see scenes like this being a reality in the US:
Or anywhere. Guns with bent barrels have terrible firing problems.

[speedpimp]

Or anywhere. Guns with bent barrels have terrible firing problems.

But spare barrels and actions are available for a multitude of weapons, so a bent barrel or knackered action means bloody fuck all.

[LHutton]

It does if you try fire it.

[Drachen596]

http://www.fox5vegas.com/story/31114133/road-rage-on-camera-man-points-gun-at-motorcyclist

Nevada. the Jalopnik story was in Nevada.

there's also a full video including stuff prior to the Jalopnik linked one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8hwsXzPUuk

[novicius]

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/crime-and-courts/woman-killed-in-shooting-outside-metro-market-on-madison-s/article_ea9e1538-39be-55e7-be05-29848d8f1b58.html
UPDATE: Criminal Complaint: Homicide suspect fired from store, blamed victim (http://www.nbc15.com/home/headlines/Police-invesstigating-first-homicide-of-the-year-for-Madison-367465641.html?device=phone&c=y).

Hey but props on the speed of purchasing that handgun, bro. :smh:

[thesameguy]

And they say America has lost that go get 'em attitude. LIES.

[G'day Mate]

My YouTube account seems to think I'm anti gun control as it keeps suggesting crappy "advocate/student/liberal gets skoooooled" videos to me.

[SportWagon]

Maybe because of what you watch in the name of research?

[overpowered]

http://reverbpress.com/news/showing-gun-not-loaded-leads-to-accidental-shooting/

[LHutton]

I'm tempted to call that Darwinian Selection. Seems like he forgot even the basics of his training.

[tigeraid]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/feb/06/boy-11-guilty-of-murdering-girl-8-after-she-refused-to-let-him-see-puppies?CMP=share_btn_tw




Boy, 11, guilty of murdering girl, 8, after she refused to let him see puppies

He asked the sisters to fetch their puppies, the judge’s order said, and when they refused he got a 12-gauge shotgun and a BB gun and told the girls he had guns. According to the judge’s description of the events, McKayla laughed at him and responded that the guns were not real.

The boy “then made certain the gun was loaded, cocked the hammer on the gun and shot the victim just above the heart at a downward trajectory”, the judge wrote.


The boy had been trained in firearm safety and had hunted with his father and grandfather, the judge noted.

:rolleyes:

[Godson]

Please keep the eye rolling to a minimum.


The kid likely hasn't been taught the importance of life, nor has his parents done their due diligence at keep the firearms out of his reach. This is a sad, sad situation that fills my heart with sorrow, and my mind with pure rage.

[Sad, little man]

Stay classy Alabama.

http://www.postbulletin.com/news/nation/police--year-old-girl-fatally-shot-by--year/article_55750189-e89a-5238-9dde-9caf2c0478ef.html

Can you imagine the therapy bills in about 10-15 years?

[LHutton]

Please keep the eye rolling to a minimum.


The kid likely hasn't been taught the importance of life, nor has his parents done their due diligence at keep the firearms out of his reach. This is a sad, sad situation that fills my heart with sorrow, and my mind with pure rage.
The idea of an 8 year old with a gun beggars belief. It's a poster boy for irresponsible parenting.

[Godson]

Oh I know, I wasn't saying it to anyone in general. It really hits home for me when I see this. The parents are likely flipping clueless about the situation and its presentation. I deal with bad parenting on multiple levels and angles every single day.

Seeing this just pisses me off.

[LHutton]

An 8 year old should simply never have had the opportunity to make that kind of mistake in life. The father should get 2 life sentences. One for his daughters death and a second for fucking up his son's life. Unless they get serious, parents* won't get the message.

*Irresponsible ones.

[Godson]

The thing I have noticed with my interactions with people. Is so many people want to simply let actions decide the way to teaching instead of the action of talking and telling them implications of their actions.

Like you hinted at, there are so many areas of issues from what the story says, this can be summed up by; piss poor parenting, inadequate measures of locking up the firearms, and a complete lack of respect for life of any sort.

I am a strong supporter of the 2 nd Amendment, but people that allow this to happen make it hard for me to want to support it.

[Alan P]

Sorry but just WTF? 'He says the boy found a loaded pistol on a bedroom nightstand and shot his sister in the head with it.'

Why on earth do you leave a loaded gun in plain view, easily picked up by children? This blows my mind. Culpable Homicide?

[LHutton]

The funny thing is, the same people probably wouldn't dream of leaving their car on the side of the road in a dodgy neighbourhood with the keys in the ignition and the engine running, but somehow doing the equivalent with a gun is acceptable to them.

[LHutton]

http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2016-02-23/story/trial-begins-man-facing-120-years-prison-firing-2-shots



Trial begins for man facing 120 years in prison for firing 2 shots in the, no one was hit

Seems severe.

[overpowered]

Right to Bear Arms? Not at CPAC 2016

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/04/right-to-bear-arms-not-at-cpac-2016.html

[Cam]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/washington-state-man-fatally-shoots-himself-while-taking-selfies-1.3474672

[LHutton]

Any kind of basic license test could have prevented this. Never point a gun at yourself ever, whether the safety is on or off, or whether it's loaded or unloaded.

[LHutton]

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/eastland-shut-down-due-to-commotion-over-new-jordans


Eastland Mall shuts down due to commotion over new Jordans

Shooting at Foot Locker in Brooklyn Center, Minn.

Two people were shot Saturday morning in the parking lot of a Foot Locker in Brooklyn Center, Minn., according to NBC affiliate KARE 11. They were taken to the hospital with non-life threatening injuries.

WTF is wrong with people?

[G'day Mate]

Not enough good guys with guns

[LHutton]

It's not just the guns though. Even the fact that many people queue up at a shop because there's new Jordans is a sign of a wider mentality problem. And the fact it leads to a shooting is beyond retarded.

[G'day Mate]

Sneakers don't kill people, people do. With sneakers.

[speedpimp]

Sneakerheads. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sneaker_collecting)

[Godson]

It's not just the guns though. Even the fact that many people queue up at a shop because there's new Jordans is a sign of a wider mentality problem. And the fact it leads to a shooting is beyond retarded.

This. Right. Here.

[21Kid]

Right to Bear Arms? Not at CPAC 2016

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/04/right-to-bear-arms-not-at-cpac-2016.html
:smh: :(

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/washington-state-man-fatally-shoots-himself-while-taking-selfies-1.3474672
:smh: :(

[Godson]

Sad case of Darwinism.

[overpowered]

Model, 2nd amendment activist, Jade Helm conspiracy theorist and a mom, shot by her 4 year old son with her own gun.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/jamie-gilt-florida-mom-accidentally-shot-4-year-old-son-n534981

[Freude am Fahren]

A Florida mom was accidentally shot in the back by her 4-year-old son with a .45-caliber pistol he found on the floor of her pickup truck, police said Wednesday.
emphasis mine

:rolleyes:

But everyone should be able to "protect themselves"

[Sad, little man]

Apparently the four year old gets really excited to go target shooting. I guess he got a little too excited.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/03/09/my-4-year-old-gets-jacked-up-to-target-shoot-gun-loving-mom-brags-hours-before-her-little-boy-shoots-her/

How about we just do this... Let's allow people to own guns, but let's ban idiots from owning guns. Isn't that reasonable? Not an idiot? Here you go, here's your gun. Idiot? Sorry, you're on the banned list.

Oh, and also no owning guns if your reason for owning them is to compensate for your own deep seated, unacknowledged personal insecurities.

[Godson]

How would one decide if one was an idiot?

[Dicknose]

How would one decide if one was an idiot?

Easy, they want to own a gun.

[Godson]

Easy, they want to own a gun.

Wrong answer.

[Drachen596]

there are groups that would not be opposed to that same thinking being applied to motorcycles..

[tigeraid]

Easy, they want to own a gun.

:D

[tigeraid]

Model, 2nd amendment activist, Jade Helm conspiracy theorist and a mom, shot by her 4 year old son with her own gun.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/jamie-gilt-florida-mom-accidentally-shot-4-year-old-son-n534981


So because this was a KID who shot an ADULT, instead of another kid, is it okay to make fun of this one?

[overpowered]

Yes, because it was her own gun and her own child and she was required by law (and common sense) to secure the gun so that the child could not access it.

[Sad, little man]

The only way to stop a four year old with a gun is a good guy with a gun... Or something.

[overpowered]

Police, Texas Rangers investigating shooting of state senator's Houston office

http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Texas-Rangers-and-Houston-Police-investigating-6882136.php

[overpowered]

Erm.....

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/13/co-founder-of-anti-obama-march-shot-between-the-eyes-by-organizer-over-gun-dispute/

[LHutton]

https://us.yahoo.com/news/video/man-killed-deputy-involved-shooting-164631318.html


A man was shot and killed by deputies in Florence after he pointed his finger at them

[21Kid]

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/13/co-founder-of-anti-obama-march-shot-between-the-eyes-by-organizer-over-gun-dispute/

:smh:
Erm.....

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/01/13/co-founder-of-anti-obama-march-shot-between-the-eyes-by-organizer-over-gun-dispute/

:? Longest double post ever?

[Crazed_Insanity]

With regard to idiots, if prisoners can lose voting rights, why not gun rights?

Further, accidental shooting should employ a 3strikes and you're out rule. If accident is fatal, then it should be 1 death and you're out just like the dead mom. If there's also a dad, he should be classified as an idiot too. Both parents will be in this together.

[21Kid]

Partners in Death: The GOP and the NRA (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-north-patterson/partners-in-death-the-gop_b_9021138.html?)

In truth, it doesn’t matter what Republican officeholders know or believe in their hearts. They are the NRA’s legislative arm — without them, the NRA could not have succeeded in making America the first world’s most dangerous place. Because, quite simply, they are the craven servants of the gun lobby — their services bought and paid for at whatever cost in human lives.At what point are they going to be considered a hate group? :smh:

[LHutton]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSeFaApcTco

[novicius]

Partners in Death: The GOP and the NRA (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-north-patterson/partners-in-death-the-gop_b_9021138.html?)
At what point are they going to be considered a hate group? :smh:
I'm always surprised when I discover another liberal acquaintance that owns guns. Progressives with guns is very much a thing -- maybe they're Clintonian Democrats? :lol:

[21Kid]

I know a few people that use them for hunting or target practice. Or police work.

But, yeah... the vast majority of the people I know that own them are not. In fact, aren't there fewer gun owners now-a-days even though there are more guns? Which makes sense. You should stock-pile them for when Obama takes them away. :rolleyes: He better hurry up too, he's running out of time!!!

[Freude am Fahren]

We had a liberal president for 8 years preside over probably the worst run of mass shootings and gun violence in the country's history and getting guns got exactly zero more difficult. Don't worry, guns aren't going anywhere.

[Godson]

Not exactly the case. In July, gun laws are changing that require more information, including finger printing, etc, for firearm purchase.

[thesameguy]

Well, at least then you'll know pretty conclusively who killed you.

[21Kid]

Unless they sell it...

[thesameguy]

Oh, they still killed you. Just indirectly.

[21Kid]

Then this happens. :( Don't play cops people. :(


‘He thought he could help': Concealed carry gun-wielder intervenes in domestic dispute and is shot dead (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/05/03/he-thought-he-could-help-concealed-carry-gun-wielder-intervenes-in-domestic-dispute-and-is-shot-dead/)
Just before noon on Monday, 35-year-old T.J. Antell, who had served in the Marines, watched the unfolding of a domestic dispute between a man and a woman outside a Walgreens in Arlington, Texas, authorities said. The man, a soldier stationed at Fort Hood, allegedly fired a gun twice, one bullet burying into the ground and another striking the woman. He then climbed into his truck in the parking lot and attempted to leave when Antell tried to stop him.

Antell, a father of three and CrossFit gym owner, retreated to his vehicle, grabbed his own gun, and approached the shooter, Arlington police said.

Instead of abiding by Antell’s commands to stop, police said the shooter climbed out of his truck and fired his gun again.
The shot hit Antell in the head, reported the Dallas Morning News. He was pronounced dead at the scene.

His wife, Crystal Antell, saw it all, according to reports.
Within hours, the shooter had turned himself in to authorities.
...
As the number of states allowing people to carry guns has increased, reports of injuries and deaths have also risen.

[LHutton]

Sounds like Antell couldn't bring himself to shoot.

[Godson]

You pull a gun, you shoot a gun. One warning. And that is it. You do not approach a situation once it has begun to de-escalate.

The baffling thing is he was a marine, and his training would have taught him that. But I digress.

[thesameguy]

Especially when you're approaching a guy who's already fired twice. WTF?

[Crazed_Insanity]

Just out of curiosity, had the marine shot and kill the shooter, there'd be no legal issues? Surely that wouldnt be self defense. Can people legally chase down and shoot down(judge) criminals?

[21Kid]

The guy was getting in his truck to leave. He should have just called 911 and followed the guy.

[Godson]

Just out of curiosity, had the marine shot and kill the shooter, there'd be no legal issues? Surely that wouldnt be self defense. Can people legally chase down and shoot down(judge) criminals?

Depends on state legislature. There have been cases in Missouri in which an attacker was shot and killed by a bystander and not the attackee. No charges were placed on the 'shooter' by the state or anyone else.

[Godson]

Especially when you're approaching a guy who's already fired twice. WTF?

Exactly. While the story is sad, dude was obviously not the brightest bulb out there. Rule number one in any dangerous situation is to protect yourself first. SERE: survival, evasion, rescue, escape, will keep you out of mounds of trouble in an active firefight.

[overpowered]

Exactly. While the story is sad, dude was obviously not the brightest bulb out there. Rule number one in any dangerous situation is to protect yourself first. SERE: survival, evasion, rescue, escape, will keep you out of mounds of trouble in an active firefight.Yep. I'm rather surprised that a Marine made that mistake.

[LHutton]

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-politics/georgia-passes-campus-carry-bill-legalizing-guns-a/nqjH4/


Georgia passes ‘campus carry’ bill legalizing guns at colleges