The thrust of curiosity that leads men to try to go where no one has gone before. (The Space thread)

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SLj4b_s40Q

Preparing for launch for an unmanned test flight tonite... or early tomorrow morning... Boeing is finally catching up to SpaceX! ;)

[Crazed_Insanity]

Okay, correction, Boeing is not catching up to SpaceX....

I think Boeing needs to subcontract all future software work to a more legit silicon valley software companies in the future. Maybe they can help do a better job at ensuring the Starliner and the 737Max to do their jobs properly! :p

https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/20/21031243/boeing-cst-100-starliner-oft-launch-failure-orbit

Anyway, so the glitch means it won't dock with the space station, lets hope it can at least come back home safely...

I am kinda surprised to learn that the Starliner has such a small fuel tank. One wrong maneuver means you won't have much fuel left to perform another one?

One thing I have to say about Boeing's recent woes is that I really don't think corporate greed was the problem. I think Boeing has a more serious problem... that is arrogance. We think we know what we're doing... FAA trusted that we know what we're doing... and earlier good safety records falsely proved that we know what we're doing..., but obviously Boeing has let it's guard down which resulted in a lot of careless, unnecessary errors. Sigh...

[FaultyMario]

Boeing: Too big to fail.

SpaceX: Why not?

[Crazed_Insanity]

If Boeing doesn’t get its act together, after Elon Musk achieves intercontinental travel thru his BFRs, Boeing would probably be finished.

Also saw a lot of YouTube commenters saying the launch was boring because it lacked more onboard views like what SpaceX did. All they showed were mission control folks...

Maybe if they had more onboard cameras, they could’ve seen the mistaken maneuvers the vehicle was making and correct in time?

Anyway, very disappointing...

[Rare White Ape]

I think that Verge article is needlessly negative.

Remember: space travel is hard. That’s why we do test flights. Better to fail now And learn about it than to fail on a real mission and lose a life.

Also nobody would’ve died had it been a crewed flight.

[Crazed_Insanity]

You sound as nice as Elon! :)

Yeah, it’s not a major problem I suppose, but I’m personally kinda disappointed and embarrassed... since I spent the past 5 years working on it...

[Crazed_Insanity]

Safe return to earth!

https://apple.news/AwJv6m3BVRrSlkC7Aum6KfQ

Folks at SoCal worked mostly at structural design and testing of the Starliner. Reentry resulted in the most loading onto the capsule. Capsule sees nearly 400,000 lbs of aero loading while decelerating from Mach 25... so I’m glad the vehicle survived as predicted...

Anyway, I think Boeing is repeating the same Max issue with the Starliner. Obvious we have a capable vehicle, but we really need more redundancy with the software. I can’t believe Max was relying on a single sensor. Likewise Starliner was relying on a single timer... why couldn’t the system double check with other sensors?

With an experienced crew, surely we could ensure safe journey by manually fix such anomalies. Boeing just need to make sure they don’t sell these commercial capsules to cheap space liners hiring inexperienced astronauts in 3rd world countries... ;)

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4CeipvvYb4

Finally able to see the onboard video.

Don't really understand why they didn't or couldn't transmit these videos live during the actual mission.

Could've stopped the random firing of the thrusters that wasted so much fuel which resulted it having to abort trying to dock with the space station.

[Crazed_Insanity]

SpaceX successfully completed an inflight abort test. They’re trying to fly their capsule away from the rocket during the worst phase of the rocket flight and see if they can safely eject and land the capsule...

I think it’s not really a NASA requirement, that’s why Boeing isn’t doing the same test. Suffice to say SpaceX is doing a swell job, doing more things for less money...

This article below also has video footage of the test: https://apple.news/ASriVypv5Q8u383R4D5Ty5g

Both Boeing and SpaceX suffered delays, but commercial space travel should be happening within our lifetime. Not sure about it being affordable though... :p

[Dicknose]

Great news!

Now we need a date for the launch with people.

[Rare White Ape]

Can we send The Donald into space?

[Rare White Ape]

Or on one of these flights?


https://youtu.be/R-HOQrinzlY

[Rare White Ape]

A hero. A pioneer. A true legend of exploration.

…who could’ve achieved his goals simply by hopping in a 747 and flying only east or west for a few days.

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/23/flat-earth-advocate-mike-hughes-dies-in-rocket-crash/

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, saw that... don’t really know what to say...

[speedpimp]

The video of it is a bit rough to watch.

[dodint]

Curiousity really thrust that guy good.

[sandydandy]

I really hope he wasn't trying to prove flat earth when he decided to blast off. That whole movement is not only silly but sad now that a person has to lose their life for it. If indeed that was the motivation for this stunt.

[dodint]

He was interviewed on some news-comedy show like Jim Jefferies or something. Said these rockets wouldn't be able to prove anything, but his efforts and notoriety brought exposure to his cause.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes though.

[Leon]

RIP Katherine Johnson, of Hidden Figures fame. Age 101.

[Dicknose]

I really hope he wasn't trying to prove flat earth when he decided to blast off. That whole movement is not only silly but sad now that a person has to lose their life for it. If indeed that was the motivation for this stunt.

Flat Earth is kinda funny. ok its complete nutballs. They have no coherent replacement. It involves way too many conspiracies and usually assumes the "southern hemisphere" is a hoax.
I particularly like the "no flights go from Australia to South Africa or South America - its faked with actors". Hmm - no one paid me to pretend those flight went direct when I was on them.

[FaultyMario]

In a flat earth, Autumn wouldn't have the greatest lighting effects in the meso-tropical band of this lovely planet.

[Phil_SS]

The video of it is a bit rough to watch.

Maybe Karma will catch up to me but I thought it was hysterical. Guy was a total f'in moron.

[Freude am Fahren]

He truly is the flattest of flat-earthers.

[Crazed_Insanity]

That is actually kinda funny, but I really don't want to laugh.

[FaultyMario]

Freman Dyson dead at 96.


Rest in stars, starmaker.

[Crazed_Insanity]

A quote by Freeman Dyson:

Technology is a gift of God. After the gift of life it is perhaps the greatest of God's gifts. It is the mother of civilizations, of arts and of sciences.

Interesting, I always thought my Dyson vacuum cleaner was man made and purchased by my own money. But anyways, thanks God! ;)

[Dicknose]

Interesting, I always thought my Dyson vacuum cleaner was man made
That would be Sir James Dyson...

[sandydandy]

Flat Earth is kinda funny. ok its complete nutballs. They have no coherent replacement. It involves way too many conspiracies and usually assumes the "southern hemisphere" is a hoax.
I particularly like the "no flights go from Australia to South Africa or South America - its faked with actors". Hmm - no one paid me to pretend those flight went direct when I was on them. Oh man the Flat Earth stuff is beyond stupid.

There's a YouTube channel called Professor Dave Explains (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0cd_-e49hZpWLH3UIwoWRA), who has absolutely destroyed these Flat Earth imbeciles more than once. Flat Earth is not the focus of his channel, he's a chemist and does a lot of tutorials on chemistry and other areas across the wide spectrum of science and maths. Really smart guy.

I've been meaning to post his Flat Earth stuff for a while, but today is the perfect day since he posted his fourth video on the subject just yesterday.

Here's the first one, which is just a general debunking of the stupidity. He doesn't insult anyone and just looks at it from a strictly academic point of view:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC5RalYWZ5Y

The YouTube channel Globe Busters responded with an idiotic three hour long video deconstructing Dave's video. I won't post that, but I will post Dave's response to that, which includes excerpts of their ridiculous comments. It's about 45 minutes, but I highly recommend it because it's so comprehensive, and I love the way he brutally puts those monkeys in their place:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDy95_eNPzM

Then a few months later he released another video, in which he was especially savage. Here it is:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KyD8VIK032o

A quick note: Dave does make a mistake in this third video when he says buoyancy is not a force, when apparently it is. He admitted the mistake in a chat on another channel. I think he said he was using the dictionary definition of buoyancy, but admits it is a real force. *shrug*

So just yesterday he released his fourth video to mark the almost one year anniversary of his first one. It's quite good:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQl8h7Aa75s

So that's the Professor Dave stuff. I love re-watching these from time to time. I also am regular follower of SciManDan (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCRtsZ5Iak9wSLsQLQ3XOAeA), who is one of the best on YouTube at debunking Flat Earth, and other pseudoscience bullshit. I recommend checking him out. I'm not a scientist at all, and have only rudimentary knowledge, but I have gained some good knowledge on astronomy and astrophysics watching these guys. There's a lot of good information out there, and these guys are the source of a lot of it.

[Rare White Ape]

I haven’t watched this yet (I am planning to today) but knowing the quality behind the Smarter Every Day YT channel, this will be highly entertaining.


https://youtu.be/o0fG_lnVhHw

[Dicknose]

What? No chatter about the upcoming return to US manned space flight!?!

Im excited. Although I actually suppose to be flying Chicago to San Fran today, so I would have been more excited to swap that for a side trip to Florida.
Oh well I guess its interwebs time for a launch viewing. Thats also cheaper and less disappointing if its postponed.

This is actually a pretty momentous occasion. First manned US flight in almost 10 years. Their first new style space craft in about 40 years. First private operation to launch to orbit.
Go SpaceX!

[Freude am Fahren]

Damn, with everything else going on, that has completely fallen off the radar. Glad you mentioned it. I should be able to drive up to viewing distance. :up:

However, weather is not looking good.

[Godson]

I hadn't entirely forgotten about it.

When does this happen again?

[sandydandy]

Where are they going?

[Crazed_Insanity]

Going to the Space station on May 27 I think. Hope they won’t bring the virus onboard! :p

SpaceX is truly amazing!:up:

They did it faster, better and cheaper than Boeing!

[FaultyMario]

I hope they don't get swallowed by the South Atlantic anomaly.

I know they won't, space engineers have figured out workarounds.

[Dicknose]

Yeah nothing new on the destination, just the method of getting there.
Expected stay is a couple of months. And just 2 crew, I presume to minimise potential worst case scenario. Both are experienced astronauts.

[sandydandy]

Sounds exciting. I had no idea that NASA had stopped sending astronauts to space from American soil. I am going to record this.

I miss the days of the Space Shuttle. Those were always exciting to watch. Launch and landing.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, I was so bummed out when they retired the shuttle before I had the chance to see one take off... I heard the experiences were awesome!

Anyway, shuttles have became too old and too pricy even for NASA. So they've decided to save the money to go back to the basics and develop new systems using just simple rockets and capsules..., but both Boeing and SpaceX encountered delays after delays... so there was a big gap when US doesn't have the capabilities to send up astronauts and need to rely on russians.

Now with SpaceX's reuseable rockets, I wonder if Elon could beat Russians' launch prices... of course Russians claimed SpaceX has artificially lowered their prices because they're being subsidized by NASA, but Elon's claiming the main reason why Russians' are more expensive because their rockets can't be reused! Anyway, considering that SpaceX is not a public company so we don't know its finances, hard to say who's wrong or right... but surely time will tell.

[sandydandy]

Bad weather is threatening to scrub the launch. :mad:

[George]

Sounds exciting. I had no idea that NASA had stopped sending astronauts to space from American soil.

Yeah, that was one of the check boxes on the list for downgrading the USA to third-world nation status.

And I'll be the first to say there are more important things to spend taxpayer dollars on than a space program currently, but it is unfortunate.

[Crazed_Insanity]

George, you have to think of it as a stimulus spending... if US government were to cut space spending right away, the unemployment line will simply get longer because I'll be in line for that...

Another thing is that space is a longterm plan, it'll be difficult to start and stop this ship on a dime. It might end up being more expensive to restart something if we halt it half way. Sometimes finance isn't the only issue, we could end up losing the know how if we stop the program... for example, we don't even know how to rebuild the F-1 rocket engines that got us to the moon. Even with all the blue prints, there are some technical know hows that were just lost forever because we ended the program.

Yeah, perhaps even back then, US probably could've found other programs to fund rather than the moon program..., but personally I'll take space programs over wars any time, right? Plus, Apollo program did also spun off a lot of different technologies like CD players and Fuel Cell batteries...

Now, returning to today, it'd really be nice if government and its people could just come to an agreement on how we can fight this damn virus...

[Crazed_Insanity]

Aw man, mission aborted due to weather... hopefully weather will be better on Saturday!

[Freude am Fahren]

I'm excited it was scrubbed. I couldn't get up towards there today, but I can Saturday I hope.

[Freude am Fahren]

...or maybe I wont.

https://scontent.fmia1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/99095270_703712206868417_1624424869787598848_o.jpg ?_nc_cat=109&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=uhTmxf1VQ-cAX-mfTW-&_nc_ht=scontent.fmia1-2.fna&oh=9259dfe66e3a9664eac8a07fceeedef5&oe=5EF2A47E

[Crazed_Insanity]

What the...

[Godson]

It's 6 feet away!!!! Lol

[sandydandy]

3:22 PM launch on Saturday. Weather permitting, of course.

[Crazed_Insanity]

T minus one hour...

Hopefully this will be a good distraction for America...

[sandydandy]

Watching.

[Crazed_Insanity]

To George..., without the space program..., America is almost like nothing... especially during times like these...

I think there was a black female commentator either from SpaceX or nasa shed a tear over this momentous occasion... she didn’t get political at all, but surely it was a bittersweet moment for her.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Space station, the final frontier..., without the virus and protests...

Actually Antarctica is doing well too!

Humanity needs to explore harsh new environments in order to get along well with each other I guess.

Anyway, I thank God for SpaceX! Well done Elon! Commercial Space travel most likely could become possible within our life time! One of the few positive memories of 2020...

Here's hoping we won't burn it all down...

[Tom Servo]

Not sure if this belongs here as it's not about going to space, but it is about space. Every time a comet has come around I've lived in a place where it was overcast every night. I missed Hale-Bopp, I missed Halley's, but now I've got a chance to see NEOWISE. So, I picked up maybe the first non-crappy binoculars I've ever owned and plan to head to the mountains tomorrow night to try to see it. I'm kinda hoping that, a lot like my Vitamix, that maybe just spending the extra money once will mean I have a solid set for the foreseeable future instead of little dinky binoculars that I end up losing anyway. We'll see. That said, I doubt I'll be able to do much when it comes to taking pictures of it, so instead I'll share the one my friend took from the hills above Malibu the other night.

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/108169335_10158125635158880_1107563511319820826_o. jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=oTEisVE1i9cAX96PyqR&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.xx&oh=5b1e8ca98581d0f45dfc7ef4816ec854&oe=5F399146

[Crazed_Insanity]

Nice!

[Tom Servo]

Woot, finally saw a comet!

[Crazed_Insanity]

How are you able to see it? We went up Mt Wilson and wasn’t able to see it... it should be dark enough, but perhaps it got so close and near the horizon so it was blocked by some of the mountain ranges?

Ideally we need to go some where dark and flat... so where was that for you?

[Tom Servo]

Mt. Wilson seems like it should have worked. We first tried to go to Palisades Park in Santa Monica, but I guess the coastline heads more northwest than I thought rather than due north, so it was just behind the mountains fo runs. So, we drove up into the Santa Monica mountains and ended up at the intersection of Schueren and Stunt Rd. above Calabasas. You can find the spot on google maps if you search for "Topanga Lookout Trailhead". The drive up is a little more treacherous coming from the PCH side, using Old Topanga, Mulholland, and Stunt to get there from the valley isn't particularly tough. We got there probably about 9:30pm or so, a good half hour after the last sunlight had gone away.

That said, it was barely, barely, barely visible with the naked eye. I'm glad I looked beforehand at a skymap on the web to be able to try to spot it, if I didn't know pretty much exactly where to look I don't think I would have found it. Shortest version of that is that the big dipper is just above it in the sky, and if you follow the line between the star that makes the edge of the dipper part and the handle and then the next one on the handle downwards, it's maybe 10 degrees or so below the constellation in that direction. (I just looked up the names of the stars, if you follow a line from Alioth through Megrez, it'll point pretty close to the comet). It looked like a little bit of a smudge in the sky, and was faint enough that it was one of those things where if you look not-directly at it, it's a little easier to make out. It was clearly visible with the 9x63 binoculars I was using, however.

My sister and her family saw it pretty well from up in the high desert, they took 395 out past Adelanto, about halfway between there and the Kramer Junction with 58, and said they were able to see it quite well from there. Definitely less light out there and it's very flat.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Thanks for the tip! Will try tonight! :D

Another friend of ours also tried Mt Wilson and had no success... I bet it’s probably blocked by the trees or mountain ranges... anyway, the. They went all the way to Mojave and was finally able to see it! I’m not sure I want to go all that way...

[Tom Servo]

Good luck! It was actually pretty crowded where we parked on Saturday night, but we were still able to score a parking spot. I imagine it'll be less crowded on a Monday, so you shouldn't have much trouble.

[Tom Servo]

Again, not my pic, but it looks like if you've got something to help with light pollution, it is visible from Griffith Park.

https://i.redd.it/vs9iobpn01c51.jpg

[Crazed_Insanity]

Wow, that’s a nice shot!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Gosh, maybe I'm just too old or need new glasses, I could not see the comet with my naked eyes. Need to use binoculars, then I could barely see it. Or maybe there were still too much city lights? We didn't quite make it to the Topanga Lookout Trailhead, we just picked a spot along the way where we could park...

Wife and I tried to take our own photo... not very good.

It looks like we captured 2 comets, but I guess the brighter one was probably a plane?
3571

Anyway, at least we finally saw it. :p

[Tom Servo]

Yeah, I couldn't really *see* it. I could see that there was something there, but it just kinda looked like a smear of slightly lighter coloring in the sky, almost like it could have been a really wispy cloud or something.

I probably should have read up on what the numbers mean with binoculars before I bought some, but I assumed that Celestron would make reasonably good astronomy ones. Turns out the number after the 'x' in 9x63 is actually reasonably important, that's the diameter of the lens and a larger lens means more light comes in. Thankfully my hunch was pretty good, the ones I got did do a pretty good job of helping me see it, 63mm is actually pretty large as binoculars go.

The fact that you could get a photo at all puts you one up on me though, glad you were able to see it!

[Crazed_Insanity]

My old binocular is 7X35mm... good enough for me to located the comet and then blindly aim the camera in that general direction hoping for a picture... :D

Oh yeah, having an app showing us which general direction the comet is... and relative to other constellations helped out too. Without that app, I'm pretty sure I would not be able to find the freaking comet. Thanks again for the location tip which gave us a more unobstructed view!

[Rare White Ape]

Again, not my pic, but it looks like if you've got something to help with light pollution, it is visible from Griffith Park.

https://i.redd.it/vs9iobpn01c51.jpg

Wow that's a killer photo.

Want a tip?

Expensive camera, expensive glass, looooong exposure, and plenty of know-how for editing night time astronomy shots.

Or you could just leave it up to the pros and spend more time enjoying the sight with your own eyes. It'll be 6000 years before you get to see it again, so make the most of it :)

[JoshInKC]

I saw it for a few days last week. We were digging down in west Texas again, a few miles north of Big Bend Nat'l Park, which is also an International Dark Sky Park, so it was pretty clear. It was fine.
Honestly the more impressive thing was the meteor shower I saw Friday (I think) morning. As we were trying not to die in the daytime heat we left the house to travel to the site at 6:15am, but I was waking up pretty consistently at 4:45 and would go out on the porch to smoke and drink coffee. That morning I saw ~30 shooting stars heading toward the eastern horizon in about 15 minutes, and they were so clear it looked like you would expect in a major motion picture.
Anyway, there's a lot of very pretty night sky down there if you get the chance.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Should today,8-2-2020, be marked as the 1st historic day of commercial space travel or should it be the actual date of the launch couple of months ago?

Anyway, which ever day it is, big congrats to SpaceX!

This is the kind of stuff that should be making America great..., not the other crap... or maybe America just like to go big, whether it’s good or bad... :p

[G'day Mate]

February th... oh. Sigh. You Americans and your crazy MDY format.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Actually Chinese people would go by month 1st and then date too!

You guys are the crazy ones living down under! :p

[G'day Mate]

Metric ...

[Dicknose]

Putting the least significant field in between the more significant fields is just crazy.
And its not just "down under" - I think lots (most?) use d/m/y

And Id say the launch date is the important one.

Interesting that this was also the first "splashdown" in over 30 years. The shuttle was wheels down and the Russians land on, well, land!

[Tom Servo]

Whereas all us programmers do YYYYMMDD so that it sorts correctly even when being sorted alphanumerically.

[George]

Metric ...

:down: Down with the metric system! :angry:

https://pics.me.me/americans-will-measure-with-anything-but-the-metric-system-4-61317167.png

[Dicknose]

Whereas all us programmers do YYYYMMDD so that it sorts correctly even when being sorted alphanumerically.

ISO8601 would say YYYY-MM-DD

[Tom Servo]

True, RFC3339 is my go to for timestamps, but for filenames, I just do YYYYMMDD.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Putting the least significant field in between the more significant fields is just crazy.
And its not just "down under" - I think lots (most?) use d/m/y

And Id say the launch date is the important one.

Interesting that this was also the first "splashdown" in over 30 years. The shuttle was wheels down and the Russians land on, well, land!

Yyyymmdd does make the most sense!

Anyway, SpaceX capsule supposed to be able to land on land just like the rocket boosters, but they gave up on that idea due to overly complicated qualifications testing...

It would’ve been so cool if that could be done...

[Random]

Interesting that this was also the first "splashdown" in over 30 years. The shuttle was wheels down and the Russians land on, well, land!

Commentator noted today that the last previous manned splashdown prior to this was actually....a Soyuz!

Soyuz 23 landed in (on) a partially frozen lake; the capsule sank, and the cosmonauts had to wait overnight for rescue.

[George]

^ Who's the new guy?

Nice to see you around. :)

[Crazed_Insanity]

I know, who the heck is that? Making such a random appearance... :p

[Rare White Ape]

There was a splashdown in 2011 of the uncrewed Orion capsule demo flight (yes it has been in development for that long).

But the last crewed splashdown was in January 1986.

[Dicknose]

Considering that SpaceX can do a powered landing of the 1st stage it does seem strange to splash down the crew capsule.
I guess its cheap, safe and known.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Cheaper yes! They could’ve done it, but it’d just take too much time and effort to prove to NASA that they could do it safely...

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/Fwfm734nOXQBVUYMFekOQA--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjt3PTk2MDtoPTUyOC43Mzg0NjE1Mz g0NjE2/https://s.yimg.com/uu/api/res/1.2/61nazPoPeRi7SIlqGTbo8g--~B/aD0zNTg7dz02NTA7YXBwaWQ9eXRhY2h5b24-/https://media.zenfs.com/en/techcrunch_350/3fe344ce564b987a1170911953f53caf

We'll be able to get our asses to mars soon!

[Dicknose]

Nice hop!

[Rikadyn]

Starlink makes me hope for Kessler syndrome.

[Crazed_Insanity]

No biggie, eventually space vehicles will have shields to protect themselves from space debris and warp engines that will propel them far way from LEO! :p

[Rare White Ape]

I've recently rediscovered APOD and it never fails to deliver.

Related to NEOWISE which flew past last month:

https://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap200803.html

https://apod.nasa.gov/apod/image/2008/NeowiseGorge_Emmanouilidi_1161.jpg

[Crazed_Insanity]

Wow... that is one amazing shot!

[George]

That's flying west from Sandy Shores toward Fort Zancudo, right?

[Rare White Ape]

Haha!

Yes, if those locations are in Greece.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Okay, this monumental achievement definitely deserves some praising in the appropriate thread!

Good job CCP! Hopefully we can turn the trade war into a space war! Doesn't matter who wins the space war, humanity surely will benefit! :)

https://www.space.com/china-chang-e-5-moon-landing-lunar-sample-video

[sandydandy]

The Galactic Federation is among us. (https://www.nbcnews.com/news/weird-news/former-israeli-space-security-chief-says-extraterrestrials-exist-trump-knows-n1250333)

Normally this stuff is tongue-in-cheek, as alien/ufo stuff has been consigned to the realm of ridicule, but I’m seeing legit news sources all over the place publishing this story. Either this old Israeli official has lost his mind or this really is true. I’d need more evidence and confirmation from officials that are not retired, and are in a position of actual power and authority.

This is something I wish was true, but my logical side tells me it’s likely BS.

Still very interesting.

[Rare White Ape]

Yeah I don’t think so Tim.

[sandydandy]

Who?

[Crazed_Insanity]

Tim.

[sandydandy]

Got it.

[FaultyMario]

I've always believed that this particular version of the universe in which we live is not really populated and the visits we get are from entities/beings that can only partially come here, in some manner that involves a vehicle with very little mass, like something that allows codified energy to pass back and forth.

But that is a belief, this is the space thread and space is part of the mechanical universe, so I'll let the engineers correct me.

[Rare White Ape]

You mean they sorta teleport in and out from a parallel universe and the best they can do is transmit a ghostly apparition of some sort?

That could potentially be possible if we stick to quantum mechanics. For example the many worlds interpretation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretation) allows for multiple universes to exist that are layered right on top of ours, similar to how a ghost car in Gran Turismo can be layered over your actual car. They come about because of divergent possibilities that end up branching off into their own parallel universes instead of collapsing all possibilities into our one universal experience.

We just can't see those parallel universes or interact with them. But they all have their own universes, according to MWI. So imagine an infinite amount of ghost cars in Gran Turismo all driving every possible lap at the same time. It could be possible that any one of those ghost car drivers (the analogy for the version of 'us' in those infinite other possibilities) has found a way to peer into a parallel universe and see what is going on, and what we would see could be a 'shadow' of their presence.

So according to one interpretation of quantum mechanics, it could be possible. But that doesn't mean in can happen. As with everything, you'd need hard evidence that this might be going on.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I saw that in ST:TNG! Characters from another quantum reality came to this universe...

So this is definitely possible... in Star Trek. :p

BTW, I think Sandy and I would still like to know which quantum reality does Tim reside?

[Rare White Ape]

Tim has no quantum space or time apart from Tool Time.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Oh! :lol:

[FaultyMario]

We just can't see those parallel universes or interact with them. But they all have their own universes, according to MWI.

Well I'm thankful for Mozart, then. And all of the great works of god that we have here.

[Yw-slayer]

I've always believed that this particular version of the universe in which we live is not really populated and the visits we get are from entities/beings that can only partially come here, in some manner that involves a vehicle with very little mass, like something that allows codified energy to pass back and forth.

But that is a belief, this is the space thread and space is part of the mechanical universe, so I'll let the engineers correct me.

You mean... they only visit our universe a little at a time?

[Dicknose]

Jumping back to reality...
SpaceX did their big hop test today, 12km up and then land.
It went up well, came back down accurately... then landed too fast and exploded (sorry unintended high speed mechanical separation)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S0B3hnOh-U

[Crazed_Insanity]

I’m assuming their primary objective wasn’t landing because Elon said there’s only 1/3 chance of a successful landing...

The test was probably intended for other maneuvers...

So I think that was a successful test?

I like the green flame right before the landing before the spectacular great ball of fire! :D

Anyway, believe it or not, we are inching closer to Mars!

[Rare White Ape]

Hey! Well I guess there's proof that their unique belly flop descent configuration works, and they just need to stick the landing.

There's excellent footage here. Watch from 1 hour 47 minutes for the launch, and 1 hour 54 minutes for the 'splosion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap-BkkrRg-o&ab_channel=SpaceX

[Dicknose]

I think they were trying to do the landing, just that they also wanted data and success for the other stages.
So maybe its a 8/10.
But it is also pretty expensive when your reusable craft is destroyed.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Their rockets usually land with legs, right?

I didn’t see it extending any legs. Didn’t even look like it has any... so I wonder if perhaps that’s why Elon gave it a 1/3 chance of a successful landing?

If landing were a primary objective, not sure I would fire it off knowing I only have a 33% chance of success...

Besides landing, it sure looked like everything else was a success. I suspect they probably just couldn’t make the legs in time and thought perhaps the ship might survive the landing if conditions are perfect? The vehicle does looked cheaply made, they probably just wanted to see if their maneuver concepts worked or not. It’s not like they have lots of trouble nailing their landings anyway...

[Freude am Fahren]

That one just has "legs" or pads right at the base, so you'd only see them close up.

You can see them in the onboard.

Here's a better look from SN5 though.

http://gtxforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=3648&d=1607617413

3648

[Crazed_Insanity]

Oh yeah, I guess those short stubby things are legs! :p

However, their attach locations look kinda flimsy to me going only 2 bays(rings) in and not really connected to any longitudinal structures...

Plus, they are so short, not leaving much gap when the ship does a final touch down... I can see that the engine blast pressure might build up too much as it approaches the ground and might blow out all the structures the legs are attached on...

One way or another, this demonstrator was not really ready for landing. Either they didn't have to resources to do it properly in time, or perhaps they realized that doing it properly would end up making it too heavy and they don't want to compromise the actual flight...

Surely on the real starship of the future, it'll be fitted with way more engines and be able to take off with heavier load.

[sandydandy]

So the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction has been happening these past few days, and the big show will be tomorrow night when they will appear to cross from our perspective. Anyone keeping an eye on this?

The skies have been shit here the last few days. Rain and snow. Hopefully it’s clear skies tomorrow night!

[Dicknose]

Had clouds the last few days, but was good before that.
Also being summer solstice for us southern types means that its a very small window between sun down and Jupiter setting. Its not dark here till after 9pm.

[sandydandy]

Looks like it's going to be cloudy tonight again. Fuck. Can't remember the last time I saw the sun, moon, stars or planets. It's been gloomy skies for a week. Oh well, will have to watch live on YouTube.

[Dicknose]

Yeah Im still fingers crossed it will clear tonight, its sunny today but a few big storm clouds. Thats still better than complete cloud cover.
Warming up, which is nice. Except it would be megacool if the temp dropped and we got xmas snow.

[Rare White Ape]

I can't really walk, and I live on a hill that rises as it goes to the west, so I'm not in a position to easily catch a glimpse of this conjunction. I'll give it a whirl on X-Mas Day though, as I'll be out of the house up at my friend's place. He happens to live at the crest of the hill I live on, so does get an alright view of the western horizon. I think a quick limp and a stroll the 200m to the nearest main road would suffice just after sunset... if I remember!

[Freude am Fahren]

I saw them on Friday on the way up to Gainesville to get the M2. Had a great view from the middle of Florida, miles from any artificial lights other than the BRZ's headlights. They were in a nice position just to the lower right of the crescent moon.

Might try to catch it with 300mm telephoto tomorrow night. Probably not enough to get the rings, but oh well.

[JSGeneral]

This company is attempting to launch their bio-fuel prototype reusable rocket (today). In the state of Maine. They have 3 payloads. One of which is waffles.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4X4uh9MvRL4

[sandydandy]

There’s some sort of launch almost every day, streamed live on YouTube. What an amazing time we live in.

[Crazed_Insanity]

This company is attempting to launch their bio-fuel prototype reusable rocket (today). In the state of Maine. They have 3 payloads. One of which is waffles.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4X4uh9MvRL4

4hr video and in the end they scrubbed the launch due to weather?!?!?!

Glad I didn’t sat thru that entire 4 hrs... :p

I do wonder if we could launch to space with biofuels...

Another thing to consider carefully is that are biofuels truly carbon neutral? I’ve heard conflicting reports on that and not really sure who to believe.

[Dicknose]

I do wonder if we could launch to space with biofuels...

Another thing to consider carefully is that are biofuels truly carbon neutral? I’ve heard conflicting reports on that and not really sure who to believe.
Well they need transport. And they can be responsible for deforestation, which is not only carbon bad, but also bad for biodiversity.
But generally they are carbon neutral.

Other carbon neutral fuels would be hydrogen from water and methanol from water/carbon. Both of these would need renewable electricity. Neither of these methods is the current most common way to produce the fuels, they tend to come from fossil fuels! That takes way less energy.

I could see SpaceX getting into this, not just to be "green", but as its also how they would produce fuel away from Earth. If you are on Mars or the Moon and had access to water you could do this.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes, if our rockets can only run on fossil fuels, then we can’t explore too far away from earths fossils... and when we run out, we won’t be able to explore no more. :p

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/01/nasas-space-launch-system-rocket-shuts-down-after-just-67-seconds/

Man, it appears Boeing just can’t get a break...

Some politics are also involved with developing rockets...

Thank goodness for Elon I guess.

[Dicknose]

Yes, if our rockets can only run on fossil fuels, then we can’t explore too far away from earths fossils... and when we run out, we won’t be able to explore no more. :p

Most of the effort is to get out of Earths gravity and atmosphere.
And its more that fossil fuels are cheap and easy and we got "plenty for now"

As to long distance travel, it could be that we move away from rocket combustion propulsion - instead light sails, electric thrusters or some other methods. I could also see having launch catapults in space.

[Rare White Ape]

Ooooh magnetic rail guns!

There are plenty of future technologies on the drawing board. But, as you say: hydrogen and kerosene are abundant and relatively cheap.

[Rare White Ape]

https://youtu.be/Yi-fBKK7nME

[Yw-slayer]

Jamiroquai is over-rated.

[drew]

2/2/21 SN9 10KM test ends in a crater.

Is it ironic it's Groundhog Day?

[Crazed_Insanity]

Punxsutawney Phil predicts 6 more weeks of winter...

Better luck next time, SN10?

[Rare White Ape]

Fuck it would have ben so funny to see it land on top of the SN10 they had parked there.

[Rikadyn]

How many successful SN launches have there been?

Coincidentally enough I went with my stepdad today to launch two rockets and had one failure as well (something flew but the rocket never left the pad and left behind the engine casing)

[Rare White Ape]

That was only the second 10km flight test of the SN series.

Both were successful launches, but neither have landed in one piece yet.

And I am avoiding the use of the word unsuccessful, because nobody expects early test flights like these to not blow up.

[Crazed_Insanity]

It's not like vertical landing of rocket is something spacex has never done before. I'm guessing they're experimenting with something in these crash landings...

[Dicknose]

And I am avoiding the use of the word unsuccessful, because nobody expects early test flights like these to not blow up.

Partially successful?

Agreed that they have to have expectations that it could go wrong.
Im sure the landing is a big part of the test. While the configuration is new, so its all a test of new stuff, the landing is the most complex part and relatively newest trick.
And as we have seen - by far the most likely to go wrong in early prototypes.

Im pretty sure that this will work, just like their first few attempts with the boosters didnt succeed, they got it right and now it seems reliable.

Next time...

[Rare White Ape]

Eh. I'll give it five more goes.

But these are only test articles, and they'll have to move along to the next prototype phase, and the next, and the next. Getting it to space and having it land, then getting it to orbit, and having it land. Then building one that can be re-used, sent back up to orbit, and then put through the stresses of another landing.

And then comes the question of landing them on Mars, where something like 50% of all the missions humanity has sent have resulted in failure. Thin atmosphere and high re-entry speeds are very difficult to contend with. And we've never sent anything back from Mars... yet. The first planned mission (edit: second. The last one failed on launch) to do this is only two weeks away from its 50/50 chance of failing before it even hits the ground.

How much of all this do they have to do before they even begin to plan for human-rating for this potentially-40-passenger behemoth?

Another edit: and they're building these outdoors in a dusty paddock in Texas!

[Crazed_Insanity]

What is so amazing is that most people probably believe SpaceX will eventually succeed even if we lose count of how many failures these prototypes had...

Anyway, this 2nd flight really looked worse than the 1st one.

[JSGeneral]

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1362506126839848961

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1362506126839848961

:D :up:

[Godson]

Awesome stuff

That twitter link has some seriously salty bitches commenting on it.

[George]

Good video about why we need to explore Mars. It's not too long, either.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2Mu8qfVb5I&feature=emb_logo&ab_channel=JaminGray

[Rare White Ape]

Awesome stuff

That twitter link has some seriously salty bitches commenting on it.

They’re right to be upset, but NASA should not be their target.

[Dicknose]

Why Mars?
I agree that the search for life, even extinct, is probably one of the biggest questions of all time. If they find life it will tell us a hell of a lot. We go from "Earth is the only known life in the universe" to "look here is another, independent set of life".
And yes its the nearest planet that can be explored. Venus is pretty much instant death even to probes. Next best places will be moons of the gas giants. Till then, Mars is it baby!

Im NOT a fan of the "oh climate, need Mars as backup" because thats a hundred year project that is probably way easier in another 100 or 200 years. And as much as we are screwing things up, we arent going to make the whole planet inhospitable for quite some time. Not to the stage of "easier to modify Mars than fix Earth"

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, kinda doubt explorers do their thing because they wanted a back up just because home might fail? ;)

Exploration is just adventurous and fun. IMHO, it’s also better to develop new technologies to explore rather than for war...

Of course we could save all the money on such research and development and use the money to feed the poor..., but you’d probably get better return using the money to feed the designers and builders of these exploration vehicles... of course Mars doesn’t have to be it. Universe offers us endless possibilities...

[Dicknose]

the SLS had a successful test burn, ran for over 8 minutes.
Ok its a static test, so it wasnt going to hit the pad when landing!!!
But still good to see it succeed and be one step closer to its launch later this gear.

Its probably not a great long term proposition, its expensive and that includes reusing left over shuttle parts.
I think SpaceX is looking good for cheap and reliable.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes!!!

(For the successful test and for your analysis...)

[Rare White Ape]

I think SpaceX is looking good for cheap and reliable.

Different purposes though. NASA is doing the expensive leading in science and exploration, while SpaceX has a commercial goal.

[Dicknose]

SpaceX is being used as part of the Artemis project. They are going to deliver some of the modules to moon/lunar orbit. Quick check - Falcon 9, Falcon Heavy and Starship will all be used for different deliveries.

SpaceX would be capable of doing almost all of the bits that the SLS would do. They are happy to do work for hire for NASA.
It seems NASA didnt want to put all the risk on SpaceX. And that SLS would be cheap because it used some existing motors. However they are looking like being disposable and that the cost per launch, even excluding development, will be much higher than SpaceX Falcon Heavy/Starship.
Blue Origin is also doing some launches.

SLS is meant to also do Mars, but then again so is Starship.
I guess we wont be doing monthly Mars trips, so reusable is not an issue. But there could be a number of Moon runs with crew and it seems SLS/Orion are turning out to be the expensive option.

[Rare White Ape]

And added to that Starship is many years away from being viable, whereas SLS is 2-3 years away if they stick to the current timeline.

But also, Starship is a wild idea that may never even become a useable product.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Starship has the potential to put commercial aviation... at least the trans-oceanic flights out of business by going anywhere in the world in like 30 minutes.

SLS has the advantage of using proven off the shelf stuff. Other than that, there's really not that much advantage. Not like it's going to be cheaper or anything... :p

I have nothing but respect for Elon's technical prowess.

[Dicknose]

And NASA has extended the deadline for picking the moon lander, with SpaceX still in the running. This was due in Feb but now will be before end of April.
SpaceX looks like just doing the lunar orbit to Moon part. Astronauts go up via SLS/Orion then would transfer to the Starship to go to the surface then back. It could then be possible to refuel/restock the Starship and reuse it. So it wouldnt return to Earth. This means it can drop heatshield and some other parts.

SpaceX is also expected to test the booster, Super Heavy, this year.
So the whole Starship (super heavy booster and starship 2nd stage), uncrewed, might be ready for test flights next year.

Damn its hard to discuss when they use "starship" for parts as well as the whole, then "heavy" can be Falcon heavy or Starship super heavy booster. Bring back BFR!

[Dicknose]

Starship has the potential to put commercial aviation... at least the trans-oceanic flights out of business by going anywhere in the world in like 30 minutes.

I think they are saying an hour between any two points. But that assumes a spaceport at each end.
And I hate to think of the ticket costs. Could they carry more than 50 people? And launch costs might be millions.
I think its more of a technically possible rather than economically possible. But Elon has surprised before.

[Crazed_Insanity]

How reusable will it be is key. If vehicles have similar initial costs over their lives, then it comes down to fuel cost. His rockets only needs fuel to go up and down, whereas planes need to burn fuel for the entire duration... the faster you go, more fuel you’ll need.

So Elon’s rockets could potentially be greener too.

Concords have proven Mach 2 air travel to be not very economically viable, Elon at least is giving us a possibility of going faster and cheaper. Only draw back would be that older rich passengers with heart conditions may not survive the launch? ;)

[Crazed_Insanity]

SpaceX Starship has won sole source contract for moon lander... beating out Amazon’s blue origin and the usual US defense contractors...

NASA being chronically underfunded, just can’t afford to fund multiple programs like the crew capsule... considering SpaceX’s cheaper crew capsule has already flown astronauts to the ISS twice and the more expensive Boeing version is still retrying to dock with the ISS unmanned, I guess if you can only afford to put all your eggs in one basket, SpaceX is probably one of the safest baskets out there right now!

Congrats Elon!

One thing that’s worrying for me is that I’m working on the return to the moon part of the SLS program now... if starship is operational, NASA really doesn’t need Boeing’s stupid expensive and aging SLS rocket anymore. Scary. May need to switch program soon... :p

[sandydandy]

James Webb Space Telescope to launch tomorrow. (https://www.wsj.com/articles/nasas-webb-telescope-to-see-deeper-than-hubble-to-edge-of-universe-11640082607)

Launching tomorrow from Europe, hopefully televised. The Webb telescope is supposed to replace Hubble, and will generate even deeper deep field pictures. I’m excited!

[Rare White Ape]

Oh yeah this is a big deal. I’ve been looking forward to JWST coming online for years now. It’ll be a fantastic Christmas present :D

*it’s launching from French Guiana, which is a small country on the northern border of Brazil.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Need to wait like 6months after launch to calibrate and stuff… so sure is a Xmas present that’s very difficult to unwrap! :p

Still better late than never. I’m sure the new images will be awesome!

[sandydandy]

Better link. (https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-59782057)

The one above was from WSJ where you have to have a subscription in order to read the article.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Mo better link: https://www.theverge.com/2021/12/25/22850167/james-webb-space-telescope-jwst-launch-mission-success

Anyway, glad to know it’s now up there in one piece!!! Merry Xmas NASA!

[Leon]

Wooohoooo!!!

[FaultyMario]

With all the things that could go wrong during deployment, you get a sense of "no way they planned this thing for 10 years of operations", that's probably the lower limit.

Here's to hoping everything goes as it should.

[Dicknose]

*it’s launching from French Guiana, which is a small country on the northern border of Brazil.

While politically its Europe (its part of France), its definitely not geographically!
Also - space launches from there are a major part of the economy. Its a good location - near equator on an east coast.

[FaultyMario]

All major elements of the JWST have been successfully deployed.

[Crazed_Insanity]

That quick? I thought it’ll take months? Or maybe the minor detail tuning testing will take months?

Anyway, can’t wait to have the Jehovahs Witness Space Telescope start knocking on heavens door! :D

[FaultyMario]

A description of a project that was granted observation time from JWST: "Constraining the Atmosphere of the Terrestrial Exoplanet Gliese 486 b".


We will perform time-series observations to measure the secondary eclipse of the exoplanet Gl 486b. The fundamental parameter that determines the
length of our time-series observations is the eclipse duration of Gl 486b, which is 1.08 hours. In addition to this length of time, we need to observe
out-of-eclipse baseline in order to identify and effectively model any instrument systematics. Such systematics typically introduce red noise, which
can occur on varying timescales and requires longer observational baselines to identify, characterize, and remove. We include 3 hours of baseline, as
a 3/1 ratio of baseline to in-eclipse observing should allow us to successfully identify and remove systematics. We also include 30 minutes to allow
the telescope to settle.

Go ahead, nerd out. There's a lot of cool shit (https://www.stsci.edu/jwst/science-execution/approved-programs/cycle-1-go).

[Dicknose]

Seems the rocket debris that is going to crash into the Moon is not SpaceX, but likely to be Chinese.
Actually that makes sense if they have been doing Moon missions. The Moon is a long way out from any of the typical satellite orbits. Yeah some missions are further out esp Lagrange points, but most things doing satellite insertion wouldn't be that high.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I guess it's cool that we're tracking all the space junk so that future missions won't be jeopardized. However, at this point in time, why should we care if some space junk crashing to the moon? :p

I think recent solar activity had cause SpaceX to lose some of its Starlink satellites. That kinda sucks. However, luckily they just have so many of them in orbit so it won't cripple the entire system?

Anyway, I'm more eager to see images coming from JWST.

Actually, I'm more eager to see Elon making commercial space travel a reality within my life time. Not sure if we can count on Boeing at this stage of the game... :p

[Dicknose]

I think recent solar activity had cause SpaceX to lose some of its Starlink satellites. That kinda sucks. However, luckily they just have so many of them in orbit so it won't cripple the entire system?
We have Starlink!
Im posting now using it.

Yes it was just most of the satellites in the latest launch, not most of their existing satellites.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Oh? That’s cool! Is it fast and reliable enough to be your only source to connect to the internet?

[FaultyMario]

I had a dream that the JWST had a minor navigation miscalculation that had made it crash onto an object in the vicinity.

But it was front page news, and people were really bummed about it. So from that, I conclude that it was clearly a dream and not something that could ever happen in real life. People in the post-Trump world, paying attention to science? pfft.

[Crazed_Insanity]

:lol:

Wow! It's interesting that you'd actually dream about JWST?!?!?

Wonder what that JWST actually represent in your unconscious mind...

[Dicknose]

Oh? That’s cool! Is it fast and reliable enough to be your only source to connect to the internet?
We replaced NBN satellite (geostationary) - its higher bandwidth, much lower delay, better plan. We can get outage when there is no satellite coverage, but that's usually twice a day for total of about 30s. You dont notice it, only find out when you look at the stats. Those outages could even be 4am. So all good so far.
Actually got a guy here now to install the dish on the roof, it was just sitting on the lawn. This is a serious job, it gets windy here - like road signs blow over, had a house nearby biow away Wizard of Oz style. So it needs a good install. I think he is reusing the existing satellite install, effectively swapping dishs.
Oh and the Starlink dish is not a dish, as in its not a reflector to then have a collector at the focus. Its a curved antenna. We have the round one, there is also a rectangular one.

But me - I mostly use 4G on my phone and iPad, they are super fast as we have a tower nearby that's mostly just to give coverage to an important road, very few people live here. Hopefully 5G will come soon, its in town and at the ski resort, we are just on the road in-between.

Its just my Mac that I usually put on the wifi to use the satellite internet. And when streaming on the tv.

[Dicknose]

I had a dream that the JWST had a minor navigation miscalculation that had made it crash onto an object in the vicinity.

I guess there are some other objects out there...
(must be careful not to say satellite, as they are not orbiting the Earth, so aren't technically satellites)
wiki is your friend:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_objects_at_Lagrange_points

Ok so just 3 man made objects at L2. Could be some alien ones! And possibly space stuff.

But cool dream!

[Rare White Ape]

SLS is complete and standing free!

The crawler is due to driver under her this week and it will start the journey out to LC39B for further testing in preparation for a launch in the coming weeks.

https://scontent.fsyd2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/276034273_495644508892699_7192543177757653824_n.jp g?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=jVJK2SPP0ykAX-ajwnJ&_nc_ht=scontent.fsyd2-1.fna&oh=00_AT91GwDGGiLWYaV_D0UG9h3BPewBrksLIOQ8aFk1nFcM tw&oe=623819D9

[Dicknose]

Nice!
I thought I read they had fuelled up, must be a pressure test. Id imagine you fuel out, wouldn't want that while moving it, for either weight or safety.

[Rare White Ape]

I believe the main testing they will do is a “wet test”, which I assume means filling it wilt various liquids and ensuring it all holds pressure and nothing leaks out.

[Dicknose]

Ah so maybe the wet test is after moving.

Anyway good to see progress.

And I got all excited the other day as a Starlink train was due to pass overhead, about 50 satellites just a couple of days after launch. There was even a smaller set of about 6 that was going to cross it. And of cause - bloody weather, clouds came over and saw nothing.

[Rare White Ape]

They always do fuelling tests on the launch pad. First of all, because that’s where the fuel lines and storage tanks are, secondly because if anything leaks you don’t want to be cleaning up the VAB, thirdly the launch pad is built to withstand huge explosions if it all goes wrong; remember SpaceX losing a rocket on the pad roughly five years ago during a fuelling test?

To my knowledge NASA has never transported a fully fuelled rocket from the VAB. Much safer and easier to transport an empty rocket which weighs maybe a fraction of its launch weight.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Russian cosmonauts arrived at ISS wearing yellow and blue suits.

https://www.npr.org/2022/03/19/1087722545/russian-cosmonauts-space-station-ukraine-colors

[MR2 Fan]

Not sure if this is a great news source, but....huh?

https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/mystery-rocket-NASA-moon-crash-country-origin-17273903.php

[Dicknose]

And unfortunately it hadn't been tracked long enough ago to identify it. This mystery might remain till exploration of the moon is common.

And while Im here...
NASA did a launch from Australia earlier this week...
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/27/australia/nasa-launch-first-space-rocket-alpha-centauri-australia-intl-hnk/index.html

The Northern Territory is a good launch place - its much closer to the equator than Florida (Cape Canaveral is 28øN, Arnhem Space Centre is 12øS) and it also has a large body of water to the east (although there is then some land a bit further east). Its a bit "in the middle of nowhere" but still inside a stable 1st world country.
https://ela.space/arnhem-space-centre/

[Godson]

Inside a more stable 1st world country than the country launching it...

[Rare White Ape]

I’m reading that JWST has completed its checks and is now fully operational. Apparently the date for us to witness the power of this fully armed and op…

Ahem.

July 12th is when we’ll see the first science pics.

[Dicknose]

Hope there isn't an exposed exhaust port...

[FaultyMario]

First image.

So the roundy colorful things are galaxies, right?

WTF are those big bright mfers?

[Tom Servo]

My guess is that the big bright bits are closer-to-us stars that are part of the image. Interestingly, the reddish galaxies are red because they're moving away from us.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Everything is moving away from us… so everything is a bit red to us. Not really sure why some are redder than others… Perhaps they are further away and therefore moving faster away from us?

Need DN to help us solve this mystery. ;)

[FaultyMario]

Everything is moving away from us…

Speak for yoself, beesh. My magnetism is powerful, I bend light away from the curvature of space.

[Rare White Ape]

If the big bright mfers are sharp and have diffraction spikes they will be stars and will be close.

If they are fuzzy they are galaxies and will be far away.

If they are fuzzy and look bent they are galaxies and will be very far away.

[FaultyMario]

Deepest-ever view of the cosmos from
@NASAWebb
. The spiked objects are local stars in our own Galaxy. ignore them. Everything else is an entire galaxy. Many distort into arcs, revealing spacetime curvature from the gravity of a galaxy cluster in the image's center.


Spoiler by Neil deGrasse Tyson.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Looks like most of the 'red' things are smaller and do not have any spikes... so they're probably further away and moving faster away?

Oh, also saw some Hubble vs JWST pics. It's like getting a new pair of glasses! :D
https://www.businessinsider.com/photos-james-webb-vs-hubble-universe-pictures-show-huge-improvement-2022-7

[JSGeneral]

NASA (ala SpaceX) is launching this tomorrow. (https://earth.jpl.nasa.gov/emit/)

[FaultyMario]

We ought to make sure it won't wake up the worms.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.livescience.com/james-webb-space-telescope-micrometeoroid-picture

Some a-hole dented our brand new $10 billion dollar telescope!!! :angry:

Oh well, at least it still works. It's not like we can file an insurance claim...

Unlike Hubble, we really won't be able to service or repair the JWST... so scientists better take as many pictures as quickly as possible before more a-holes scratch it up!!!

[Dicknose]

Everything is moving away from us… so everything is a bit red to us. Not really sure why some are redder than others… Perhaps they are further away and therefore moving faster away from us?

Need DN to help us solve this mystery. ;)

Very late reply...

yes the further away the faster we are moving apart, the more red shift.
Reminder - this indicates that the universe is expanding, at all locations, not just moving away from us.

And that these better telescopes are about the ability to detect fainter light as much as they are about magnifying areas.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, looks like the redder galaxies/objects are more likely to be distorted due to gravitational lensing… so they must be further back…

Yes, this universal expansion only looks as if everything is moving away from us, doesn’t mean we’re at the center of the universe! :p

[Rare White Ape]

The further away things are, the bigger they look as well. It's called the angular diameter turnover point. So you don't need to magnify things. You just need to be better at looking for the correct wavelengths.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Oh wow! I did not know that...or did not know about that 'term': angular diameter turnover point.

I guess it kinda makes sense that whatever we're seeing now was it's previous position. It's current position must've been way further away now due to universe's expansion. So objects in JWST's mirrors appear closer(or larger) than they really are? :D

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://news.yahoo.com/russia-international-space-station-withdraw-133909393.html

Damn shame that Russia is pulling out of the ISS.

United Federation of Planets? Well our planet isn't really very united... Actually take that back, even the States are not very United.

Besides looking beyond with JWST, humanity also needs to take a peek within to see what the heck went wrong... sigh...

[Dicknose]

The ISS has already been marked to shutdown - NASA had said 2028 and now I think they pushed to 2030. They plan to de-orbit (ie crash!) it in 2031.
So Russia pulling out ahead of that time is not a huge shock. They will say "to work on our own projects" but probably its to save a buck.
At least the US has capability to send people and supplies!!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, we don’t need them anymore and they probably will find it harder to finance this… plus, if things escalate into a world war, it’s gonna get awkward up there…

I’m just a bit sentimental, I really thought we’re marching toward Gene Roddenberry’s dream after Berlin Wall fell, but it looks like my daughter will be facing uncertain times ahead.

[sandydandy]

As I grow older I find I love this stuff more and more. Science - astronomy and astrophysics. I wish I loved it when I was in high school. :(

[Rare White Ape]

As I grow older I find I love this stuff more and more. Science - astronomy and astrophysics. I wish I loved it when I was in high school. :(

Starting with this topic late-ish in life is what got me to the job I am in now :)

[Dicknose]

As I grow older I find I love this stuff more and more. Science - astronomy and astrophysics. I wish I loved it when I was in high school. :(

Stick to "popular science", it all gets very technical and mathematical if you actually study it.
I dropped physics after 2 years at university to major in mathematics and computer science. But I was finding the physics hard and not that fun anymore. Did have friends who stuck with it, one is an astrophysicist who ended up head of physics at the university. For all that I still remember explaining to him why you dont see full moons during the day! He was like "i deal with global clusters of galaxies, not the moon"

[Crazed_Insanity]

:lol:

[sandydandy]

Starting with this topic late-ish in life is what got me to the job I am in now :) Cool what do you do?


Stick to "popular science", it all gets very technical and mathematical if you actually study it.
I dropped physics after 2 years at university to major in mathematics and computer science. But I was finding the physics hard and not that fun anymore. Did have friends who stuck with it, one is an astrophysicist who ended up head of physics at the university. For all that I still remember explaining to him why you dont see full moons during the day! He was like "i deal with global clusters of galaxies, not the moon" Definitely agree about it getting technical. I’ve been watching a lot of Professor Dave Explains videos and other science videos on YouTube in the last couple of years that have really piqued my interest. These videos teach in a way that relates to the average layman. I’m far from an expert in anything, but can probably comfortably carry on a conversation about science with another layman. I guess that should be good enough.

[Dicknose]

Layman also means you can just do the stuff you like!
And it is good that the more you know the more you appreciate how it all works. Some people marvel at the mystery, I find it more interesting by knowing more, it might take some mystery away but replaces it with a deeper appreciation of how amazing it is.

Get some basics right - especially gravity - will get you a long way in understanding planets, moons, rockets!
And then you get quirky stuff like - Jupiter doesn't orbit the Sun! To "orbit" is usually taken to mean that the smaller objects centre of its motion is inside the large object. The centre (barycentre) of the Jupiter and Sun pairing is outside the Sun. So they are better considered as a binary system! Except that there are other planets involved...

[Rare White Ape]

Cool what do you do?

During my injury layup I took the opportunity to study a laboratory skills course and now I have a job working in a pathology lab for the Queensland Government at the Gold Coast University Hospital.

I basically increased my hourly pay by 50% over my previous job and I get to play with blood every day, and I’ve learned a LOT about the very small slice of healthcare that we deal with in the larger hospital environment, all with a little effort and dedication.

And it all started because I got extra curious about astronomy one day and bookmarked the fantastic Astronomy Picture of the Day website a decade ago.

[Dicknose]

And we had some exciting local news...
Earlier this month there was a loud explosion and a streak across the sky. Originally thought to be a meteor, it was identified as a bit of SpaceX junk.
Well a sheep farmer found some bits in one of his paddocks...
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-29/space-junk-found-in-nsw-snowy-mountains-paddocks-/101277542

This is the next town to us. Do love the Aussie farmers.. Mick and Jock!

[Dicknose]

So we are approaching Artemis launch time!!!

This is big, launch of a new rocket. So its not crewed (sorry mannequins) but its still a huge step in returning to space, well more than just low earth orbit!

[Rare White Ape]

Yeah I am pretty excited. Launch will be sometime after 8pm our time.

[Dicknose]

Yup! Got an alarm set (in case Im napping)

[Rare White Ape]

Two-hour window between 22:30 and 00:30.

I gotta get up at 5:30 for work. I might be tired tomorrow.

[Crazed_Insanity]

So we are approaching Artemis launch time!!!

This is big, launch of a new rocket. So its not crewed (sorry mannequins) but its still a huge step in returning to space, well more than just low earth orbit!

Noone packed your bags last night pre-flight
Zero hour 8:33 a.m.
And you’re gonna be high
As a kite by then :sing:

(Fingers crossed)

[Dicknose]

Two-hour window between 22:30 and 00:30.

I gotta get up at 5:30 for work. I might be tired tomorrow.

I tossed my bed on the footpath for the council cleanup!!
But I dont have to be up for work (my last day of work was a 5:45am start, so up before 5am - wow 2 years ago and I only just realised I finished on an early start)

linky...
https://www.nasa.gov/nasalive

[Rare White Ape]

Launch scrubbed. Engine problem. Next available date is this coming Friday, but that depends on if they can get it fixed before then.

[sandydandy]

Well that sucks.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I guess I didn’t cross my fingers far enough… :p

[Dicknose]

Launch scrubbed. Engine problem. Next available date is this coming Friday, but that depends on if they can get it fixed before then.

And it seems its a different problem to the previous fuelling issues.

Also seems odd that they have quite specific launch windows... I mean its the moon, its basically in the same position relative to Earth. Ok go a week later and you have to do a 1/4 orbit more. But its not Mars where there is a window every year. Maybe the window is set on when some bigwig is available to watch!

[sandydandy]

Next launch attempt scheduled for this Friday Sept. 2nd. Hope all systems are go.

[Rare White Ape]

And it seems its a different problem to the previous fuelling issues.

Also seems odd that they have quite specific launch windows... I mean its the moon, its basically in the same position relative to Earth. Ok go a week later and you have to do a 1/4 orbit more. But its not Mars where there is a window every year. Maybe the window is set on when some bigwig is available to watch!

So it turns out the launch window thing is more complex than this. The sun position is taken into account as well. There’s a thing called a ‘dark’ orbit where there won’t be enough light to reach the space craft solar panels during parts of the mission which they have to minimise, and Earth/sun/moon tidal forces will play a part too. There are only 7 opportunities for a perfect launch window in September.

[Dicknose]

Thanks! must check this out.
Could see the sun position being important, but that would typically lead to windows a month or weeks apart. Days seems interesting, but I guess if there are several factors and they want to maximise them all then it could be quite specific times.

[Rare White Ape]

I got the info from Kurzgesagt on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/Kurzgesagt/posts/pfbid0M2M4xRBSCmdL7Cjk6ph1SijoesZwh3y3eboaE5Sb8qBP wxjwdr1MRk7NRcFU1WXpl):


Houston, or rather Engine 3, had a problem, and the start was canceled.
The possible launch will be on September 2nd. Why not earlier?
This is due to the alignment of Earth, Moon, and Sun: the orbital complexities of these celestial bodies narrow down the possible launch windows to two weeks each month. During these two weeks, there are days that end up in a dark orbit, not admitting enough light for the orbiter's solar panels. Additionally, the requirements concerning the departure burn to the Moon and the reentry maneuver, as well as the daytime of reentry, must be considered. Together these parameters may result in shorter mission durations or missed objectives, leaving only 7 perfect launch windows in September.

Plenty here to learn more about for the curious.

[Dicknose]

Ok - that sounds good and makes sense.
The phase of the moon controls the if the journey gets good light - that could be the weeks each month. Just seems interesting that its a specific day in that period, but maybe they have a min time between attempts, that would set a next earliest window.

Anyway looking forward to it

[Dicknose]

Ok so having said Friday or Monday... they announced it will be Saturday!!

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2022/09/nasa-will-re-attempt-a-launch-of-the-artemis-1-mission-on-saturday/

Seems it will be Sat between 2pm-4pm ET.
Fuck that's like 4am Sunday here... if I get up it better bloody launch!

[Rare White Ape]

I will be awake but I'll be at work.

I watched F1 qualifying last week on Kayo with my phone propped up against the computer I work at.

I should be fine to have NASA TV streaming this weekend, but on a desktop window with YouTube :D

[Crazed_Insanity]

Imagine planning a vacation around a launch of any kind... :p

Best way is to be a Florida residence, next best thing is to probably camp near the launch sight. I've never been able to catch any close up live launches in my life. Not even the ones in Vandenberg Air Force Base off the coast of CA! Just occasionally some cool rocket trails in the night skies...

Anyway, thank goodness for live streaming nowadays. We can see them anywhere at any time! ;)

[Crazed_Insanity]

Oh man, scrubbed again.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/09/years-after-shuttle-nasa-rediscovers-the-perils-of-liquid-hydrogen/?amp=1

Okay, just learned that they’ve attempted to fill up the LH2 tank a grand total of 6th time, from initial test to today’s scrubbed launch. They’ve actually been successful at filling up the LH2 tank at a grand total of 0 times! Hmm…

[sandydandy]

SpaceX did a launch last night. That’s not really big news anymore, I know. I didn’t watch the launch live, but I caught it yesterday while watching a livestream on LA Flights, (plane-spotting channel which is quickly becoming my favorite on YouTube). They’re doing a cross country tour right now and were livestreaming at Boston Logan Airport, and suddenly looked up and caught the rocket as it passed by, and we even saw the stage one separation. Really cool stuff!

EDIT - here's the video. Rocket appears overhead at 6:33:40 or so.


https://youtu.be/LxKfLlzs5z4

[Phil_SS]

Wow, that was crazy cool.

[Dicknose]

And the DART mission hit its target.
I think they are still waiting to see what the net affect is, the impact it should slow the orbital speed of the small asteroid around its bigger companion. This then should be seen as a shorter orbital period, I think they are expecting 10 min off from about a 12 hour orbit.

quirkily - slower orbital speed = smaller orbital period (for the same distance out), it ends up with a lower orbit for the rest of its orbit and that takes less time, its not only shorter, it speeds up as it "falls closer", so its going faster at the opposite side of its orbit.

And while they are too far away to easily see the smaller asteroid, they are an "eclipsing pair", so they should notice the orbital period from dimming of the brightness. Basically the same technique eased to find exoplanets.

This is all good news for asteroid protection! When we have plenty of time to detect, get our impactor out there and plenty of time (years) for the effect to accumulate.
Not so great for long period objects (comets) that could strike on their first pass. Ditto with objects coming from outside the solar system.
But its a good first step!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yep, we’re getting there! Baby steps at targeting asteroids and planning to colonize Mars… so we probably won’t end up going away like dinos?

Since I’m also religious, I do wonder what would happen to the Martian colonists when Jesus returns to earth? ;)

Anyway, thanks to Elon, commercial space travel appears very possible within our life time…

[Dicknose]

Yep, we’re getting there! Baby steps at targeting asteroids and planning to colonize Mars… so we probably won’t end up going away like dinos?

I dont think we are at a stage where colonising Mars is going to save us from extinction.
Would have to be an extremely major event to make Earth less liveable than Mars. It could wipe out all other life forms and lose 99% of the water and we would still be better off here than Mars. Even if all the oxygen went and you needed a breather, at least the atmospheric pressure would mean you dont need a pressure suit.

[Rare White Ape]

Nope DN you’re wrong.

If Elon colonises Mars it’ll mean He is on Mars.

And we all know that Elon is our only hope at survival. He will bring two wives with him, which means He will come twice.

Put your faith in Him, the major shareholder in SpaceX, to save us all.

Pray to Daddy Elon.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don’t think Mars will ever be at a stage that it’ll be like earth. It’s just another rock bigger than the moon…

Anyway, point was that we’re inching closer to be able to defend ourselves against run away rocks from outer space and possibly become interplanetary.

I’m just hoping at least I can live to see space tourism thanks to daddy Elon! ;)

[Tom Servo]

Nope DN you’re wrong.

If Elon colonises Mars it’ll mean He is on Mars.

And we all know that Elon is our only hope at survival. He will bring two wives with him, which means He will come twice.

Put your faith in Him, the major shareholder in SpaceX, to save us all.

Pray to Daddy Elon.

You will do well on Elon's Mars, because you are also a firm believer in free speech, defined by Elon as speech that does not criticize Elon in any way.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don’t really know what exactly happened to Musk politically, moving to Texas…, fine. But supporting DeSantis? Really don’t get that. However, I can understand his feeling might be hurt when Biden continues to think that he and Tesla are invisible and believe GM to be the EV leader of the world…

I never fully agree with anyone politically. Not even Bernie Sanders. He’s just somebody I agree with the most.

As for Musk, he’s not a politician, so I don’t really care about his political views… his actions are more important than his views. If he can make commercial space travel more affordable, I’m all for that. I’m not gonna not buy his cars or not ride his rockets because I disagree with his politics. I really think people are taking politics a bit too seriously. However, I do like the jokes you guys are making… shows that at least you guys are not too serious about it. ;)

[JSGeneral]

Stoke Space is a relatively new company starting with a unique approach towards a reusable second stage...

https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/10/stoke-space-aims-to-build-rapidly-reusable-rocket-with-a-completely-novel-design/

[Crazed_Insanity]

Interesting. Hope they succeed. More of these companies the merrier!

[JSGeneral]

And the DART mission hit its target...



Google "Nasa Dart"

[G'day Mate]

This is some cool science …


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d0EGIt1SPc

[G'day Mate]

Did that work? Someone remind me how to post videos please :lol:

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, that worked.

Not sure why on iPhone safari browsers we can no longer see YouTube videos, but if you get on the forum thru Google, it’s should work fine. Of course it’ll work on PCs without problems… it is kinda annoying that we can’t see videos on iPhones anymore using safari… oh well.

[sandydandy]

Artemis set to launch in little over an hour. Fingers crossed.

Edit - they keep saying 1:04 am ET launch time, yet their own countdown clock shows that launch will be around 12:34 am. I’m watching live on NASA’s YouTube channel.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Launch time is currently slipping indefinitely, most likely won’t make the 1:04am ET launch…

Ok, slipped behind a bit but they fixed the problem and we had a successful launch! Yeah!

[sandydandy]

I watched it last night. Not exactly thrilling being a night launch, but still somewhat satisfying. When they switched to the animation I turned it off.

[Rare White Ape]

Yeah a day launch would have been cooler.

Getting to see a new launch vehicle from NASA hasn’t happened since the 70s.

[Rare White Ape]

Crazy to think that most of us weren’t alive when the Shuttle first launched, and some of our kids weren’t alive the last time Shuttle landed!

[Crazed_Insanity]

SpaceX definitely puts up a better show! :p

This is billions and years in a making. It's thrilling for me to finally see it launched!

Hopefully humanity can begin regular space travel for good and not have a similar end as the Apollo program. Apollo did resulted quite a bit of other tech advancements, but kinda like the pyramids, we've seemed to lost the know-how to get back to the moon. SLS or Artemis aren't even brand new and improved designs... all based on salvaging shuttle parts... and yet it took us this long and this much money...

Anyway, just glad it's under way...

3982

[Dicknose]

Crazy to think that most of us weren’t alive when the Shuttle first launched, and some of our kids weren’t alive the last time Shuttle landed!

Some of us were alive when the Apollo missions happened!!
(ok Im not going for Mercury)


As for the slow progress since Apollo or at least the Shuttle, amazing what a difference dollars makes. And needing it to be more safe/robust.
We are lucky that this does seem like a good time for space exploration.
Oh - and watching "For All Mankind" s3.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Our world is so screwed up right now but so glad we’re heading back to the moon!

Some cool photos and reads here: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/see-the-first-stunning-photos-of-the-earth-and-moon-from-artemis-1-180981173/

Hopefully space exploration can help bring people together more like last time around. However, even SpaceX is now controversial thanks to its owner.. Anyway, hopefully people can see pass all that…