Novi's Proletariat Garage

[novicius]

Future DIY to fix my damn seatbelts. (http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/99-04/104802-how-fix-your-crappy-seatbelt-retractors.html) :smh:

[dodint]

That looks like a severe pain in the dick.

[novicius]

Yep but for the price of "on the house" I'm gonna dive in and do it. :up:

::

This is a good pic to summarize my evening last night:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/269/33179917895_308cb800de_b.jpg

:lol:

Both rear shocks were all barnacle'd-up like this. You get what you pay for, kids! #cheap>performance

[dodint]

That's exceptional. Did you buy the car in WI?

[novicius]

Lake Michigan, I think.

[dodint]

Ah, probably off of this same lot:

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Z37lT_axMRY/WJduCFxg79I/AAAAAAABiLQ/y4oDSDtp_W0gJk8nMqB8DzFhr6RcTN0_ACLcB/w800/Audi2.gif

[novicius]

:lol: :up:

[thesameguy]

So, does all that corrosion save weight or add weight? :erm:

[novicius]

new driveshaft (as you can see the u-joint is a push-in, no replaceable snap rings)
I took a closer look at the driveshaft last night and it turns out I was wrong -- there are snap rings on the u-joint! :up: :up:


Looking up on how to clean up a rusty a driveshaft:

Personally if i was inclined to treat my drive shafts, I would do a steel wool scrub to get off the surface rust then clean with acetone.

Once that's dry, I would do a phosphoric acid wipe and let sit for a while then steel wool again. Two or three times with that treatment should attack most of the rust without throwing off the true of the shaft that painting would.
So eventually I will take the factory driveshaft off, scrub it down and then have it balanced by a shop. Then I'll pop for the FRPP U-joints. (http://www.americanmuscle.com/frpp-1310-1330-ujoint.html) :up:

[thesameguy]

I spent HOURS cleaning up the driveshaft on the Falcon, then more hours painting it. It was really pretty! Then I diligently took it to a shop to get balanced, and they tanked it and painted black. FML! If I'd known cleaning was part of balancing I wouldn't have wasted my time.

If you do decide to clean it, a Rubbermaid underbed storage box and a gallon of Eastwood Gel Rust Dissolver works a treat. "Paint" the gel onto the driveshaft with a foam brush every 30 minutes or so for a day and it'll get pretty darned clean. It's a good, easy $30 solution.

But, seriously, check with your shop - they may just clean it as a matter of course. (They will also, almost certainly, replace the u-joints as a matter of course, especially if you provide them).

[novicius]

Win and win. :up: :up:

[dodint]

Buy an aluminum one.

[novicius]

:lol:

[thesameguy]

Once you factor in balancing and u-joints there might not be that much money on the table. The Ford Racing driveshaft on the XR was $230 on ebay. The balancing on the Falcon's driveshaft was a hundred bucks, plus new u joints at I think $30. For the $100 spread, aluminum is probably worth it.

[dodint]

That was my thought too but didn't want to push it. Maybe he really wants to get to scrubbing that thing.

[novicius]

Once you factor in balancing and u-joints there might not be that much money on the table. The Ford Racing driveshaft on the XR was $230 on ebay. The balancing on the Falcon's driveshaft was a hundred bucks, plus new u joints at I think $30. For the $100 spread, aluminum is probably worth it.
That's a $100 savings! C'mon man, that ain't no way to sell me! :lol:


EDIT: Ok the rear shocks are in but now the lower rear control arm/axle housing-side nuts are absolutely seized onto the bolts. Did some googlin' for tips:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home/how-to/a5754/how-to-free-a-rusted-bolt/

A locking wrench (http://www.irwin.com/tools/locking-tools/the-original-locking-wrenches) is also recommended. Or maybe a straight-up 24" Jumbo Harbor Freight Monkey Wrench (http://www.harborfreight.com/24-inch-jumbo-steel-pipe-wrench-39645.html)?

[21Kid]

Man... this thread has taught me a lot.



To buy a newer, less broken car. :finger:

[novicius]

All it takes is mo' money. :)

[Kchrpm]

Man... this thread has taught me a lot.



To buy a newer, less broken car. :finger:

PREACH!

[thesameguy]

Order some Kroil - it's expensive, but it really is the best. Repeated spraying over DAYS. A cheapo torch from Harbor Freight or Home Depot can be useful - apply heat at the last moment, as you're taking it off. Make sure you have a 6-point socket, hammer it onto the nut for good engagement, and use an impact wrench in controlled bursts - shock loads will help break any rust that survives the Kroil; turning with your hand will just fatigue the bolt. I sometimes blast a stuck fastener with an impact shortly after each Kroil application. Unless one side is captured and irreplaceable, your fallback is an angle grinder/Dremel - just take off one head or the other and then hammer the rest out. Depending on the situation/clearance, you could also use a nut splitter. If it's really gnarly, you might just skip ahead to cutting & replacing. You don't need crappy hardware going back on. :) When you order the Kroil, order some anti-seize as well - just don't go nuts - anti-seize affects tightening torques and (I'm assuming this is a pivot bolt of some type) you don't want to bind anything up. So, use a small amount of high quality stuff. I would avoid adjustable tools at all cost - they just damage fasteners... either commit to saving it or just destroy it up front. :D

[Godson]

I'll echo all these statements from the post by tsg.

On really frustrating things, I've used MAP gas and water to help break things loose.

Or I just cut the fucker out like cancer.

I don't like wasting time with shit like this.

[novicius]

LoL well I'm patient so I will look for some Kroil in this town and apply it over a few days. Hopefully I can pop this nut (and the other one!) off this weekend. :D :up:

[thesameguy]

Amazon has Kroil at a fair price, fwiw. :)

https://www.amazon.com/Kano-Aerokroil-Penetrating-aerosol-AEROKROIL/dp/B000F09CEA/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1488920192&sr=8-2&keywords=kroil

Click the button. Make it come to you.

[novicius]

Yep -- trigger pulled, thanks! :D :up:

[21Kid]

All it takes is mo' money. :)

How much do you have into it at this point?
How much more are you going to spend fixing it?

[thesameguy]

1. Some.
2. All.

[novicius]

How much do you have into it at this point? How much more are you going to spend fixing it?
Eh, $6800ish over the last two years after the surprise clutch-death (which was $900 for clutch/flywheel/labor; it felt good on my first test drive, what you gonna do?) and my last suspension bits purchase. Probably looking at another $2000 for new head gaskets, oil pan, 4.10's, tires, quadshocks (http://www.americanmuscle.com/bilstein-quad-shock-8604.html?utm_content=Handling%2B-%2BShock%2FStrut%7CBilstein&utm_campaign=79-04%20Years&utm_source=Google-pla&utm_medium=Shopping&utm_term=%7Bkeyword%7D&AMID=bilstein-quad-shock-8604-GSBasicFitmentV1&year=2004&T5_Var3=blue&GID=52057) and miscellaneous cleanup? Do I sound like Tyler yet? :lol: #hugztyler


But Kid you forgot to ask the all-important 3rd & 4th questions:

3. How much cash was I willing to spend up front? My self-imposed limit was $5K and I planned from the start to commit money from future paychecks vs spending more upfront from my personal savings. I will bump up the starting amount now if I flip the Bananastang. Can you buy more value by committing more money to the intial purchase vs fixing it yourself? Absolutely yes. Buying any car for under $5K USD is going to bleed money unless you win the Craigslist lottery.

4. How much fun am I having? Lots. :D This is the first car I'm really wrenching on by myself. I'm taking my time to learn new things and getting my ass out of the chair from behind my XBONE, win-win. :up: How much is that worth? :assclown:


EDIT: Also keep in mind that the PO paid $6,000 cash + traded in his old F-150 to a dealer who was selling this car for $9000 in 2013! :lol: I have that receipt! #insanity

[thesameguy]

4. How much fun am I having? Lots. :D This is the first car I'm really wrenching on by myself. I'm taking my time to learn new things and getting my ass out of the chair from behind my XBONE, win-win. :up: How much is that worth? :assclown:

Not surprisingly, IMHO it's priceless. Anything that gets you out of the passive consumption rut is a positive step. If you get to learn something and enjoy practical benefits from your accomplishment so much the better. Everyone needs some decompression with passive entertainment every so often, but trading production for consumption is a shitty habit, and all too easy to do.

[21Kid]

:lol: I wasn't serious. :p

#4 ???? Is what it's all about.
#5 Profit. is never in my mind when dealing with cars. Completely defeats the purpose.

I have a super rare 1960's Porsche!
Cool! How does it drive?
Oh... I don't DRIVE it!
:erm:

[thesameguy]

WRONG.

It's all about the Benjamins.

[novicius]

:lol: I wasn't serious. :p

#4 ???? Is what it's all about.
#5 Profit. is never in my mind when dealing with cars. Completely defeats the purpose.
Well you're a finance-type guy so I figured you were serious! :finger:

[Kchrpm]

Everyone needs some decompression with passive entertainment every so often, but trading production for consumption is a shitty habit, and all too easy to do.
Meh. You can keep on rebuilding a dozen cars every year, but you don't need to tell me that what I do instead is shitty.

[thesameguy]

I don't think nor am I suggesting you are unproductive, and I know factually from your posts you're not. I'm saying it's way too easy to be a couch potato and spending some cash and some time on a Mustang instead of doing that is better for pretty much everything.

[Kchrpm]

Oh, I'm unproductive as shit :D I'm definitely a couch potato. I spend ~triple what Carlo did on his car, including an extended warranty, specifically so I could just sit on my couch and watch TV/play video games instead of wrenching on something. In a year or so I will hopefully spend considerably more on a purely fun car for basically the same reason.

[thesameguy]

Don't sell yourself short man - you share a lot of knowledge and well-formed opinions around here. You don't get that from doing nothing - I gotta believe you spend a completely reasonable amount of time reading etc. and thinking - not to mention taking the time to type it. ;)

[Kchrpm]

You'd think that, but no, I'm just a fucking genius :D

[thesameguy]

Showoff.

[GB]

your fallback is an angle grinder/Dremel - just take off one head or the other and then hammer the rest out.
My Dremel gave its life in a blaze of blue-flamed glory and acrid smoke cutting through some exhaust bolts not long ago. Use something more powerful.

Man, I don't miss living up north at all. The undersides of my cars are all spotless by comparison, I remember when I thought it was 'normal' for everything to corrode. ;)

[novicius]

:lol:

Ah well, 'tis what I gots. I do agree tho', I would only flip this car due to rust. It's a cheap beater toy, I'm replacing all of the wear items, gaskets & bushings and eventually stiffening the chassis so at this price point I don't care about mileage. But the rust... :twitch:

That said, I did order new Bilstein quad-shocks (http://www.americanmuscle.com/bilstein-quad-shock-8604.html)today. 1/3rd the price of replacing the rear LCA's. #shrug #rabbithole

[novicius]

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3719/33483193645_587588f3c2_c.jpg

Alright this can o' magic came in the mail this week. Last night was my first application. :up:

I did give the bolt head a few experimental tugs after two thorough dousing across a 60-minute period. No dice but my leverage is pretty bad (the rear of the car are on the shorter/smaller jackstands unfortunately). Saturday morning I'm going to go over there with a torch and start heating that bolt up before putting the impact wrench on it. #donefuckingaround #fire

[thesameguy]

Like. :up:

You've pre-sourced replacement hardware, yeah?

[novicius]

No but there's a both a Home Depot and a Fastenal shop nearby. I'll get some fresh stainless-steel bolts.

[thesameguy]

You may not need 'em, just always good to have a backup plan when things get real. :D

[Godson]

I'd avoid stainless on suspension. It's tensile strength is actually quite low. Stick with grade 8 (10.9 metric) and above on things that keep your vehicle under you.

When you heat it up, don't forget to cool it off too. You can also slightly tighten it before backing it off.

[Yeti]

Kroil is a great product. I use the non-aerosol one myself.

Godson is right. Grade 8 on suspender bolts.

[novicius]

Alright will do guys, thanks! :up: :up:

[novicius]

Ok the bolts are still in there -- I spent last night re-arranging my jackstands and re-jacking the rear of the car up as high as it would go. Surprising amount of work, actually.

These rear LCA bolts are pretty notorious in the Mustang world (http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/99-04/250966-lower-control-arms-bolt-rear-end-stuck.html)for being next-to-impossible to get out if someone previously hasn't yanked them out of there. Very commonly fused/rusted to the inner bushing case. I did come across this tip (http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/99-04/250966-lower-control-arms-bolt-rear-end-stuck.html#post4292491):


Put the car down, take off the rear shocks and jack the car up. Should have the springs fall out.
I almost can't tell if they're serious or not but it should work since I am NOT replacing the lower LCA nor am I tackling the bushings at this time. I just need to pivot the LCA's/solid axle down, drop the springs out, put the new ones in and then sandwich the thing back together. However my spring-replacement directions say not to do this. Thoughts? :lol: :up:

This will make re-assembly a royal PITA for re-lining up the shocks & springs and putting the rear-end back together... but if I leave the *tops* of the shocks in and undo the bottom bolts, that would be so much easier. Hmm... #lightbulb


EDIT: Another vote for dropping the springs out before wrestling with this bolt.


all you gotta do is drop the springs out, put the jack under the rear end and keep adjusting the jack up in down while wiggling the bolt out, i did that when i installed my springs, and when i took my rear end out to rebuild it....never had one bit of trouble.

Never try taking the bolts out with the springs still installed.

[dodint]

*pops popcorn*

[thesameguy]

If removing the limit (shock) will drop the axle far enough to get the springs out, by all means go for it! That's how I get springs out of a c900. With the car on jack stands, support the rear axle with a jack, remove the lower shock bolts, lower the jack. On a c900 the springs won't fall out, but they're adequately unloaded to pop them out with a prybar. No drama on reinstall - place the springs, jack up the axle, reattach lower shock bolts. Easy!

I assumed you were replacing LCAs or bushings and that's why you were messing with the pivot bolt!

[novicius]

Nope, just want to replace the springs/shocks/quad-shocks. Leaving the rear LCA's & old bushings on.

My directions from H&R say pull the solid-axle-housing bolt. They say don't do both side simultaneously. I plan on breaking both rules tomorrow night because frustration. :erm:

Now I don't know how much flex there is in the drivetrain system. I don't know what the driveshaft/rear pumpkin is going to do. But based on those simple comments I found, apparently there is enough flex in the system to exceed the stock springs' height so... profit?

[thesameguy]

The D/S has front & rear u-joints, right? You should be able to drop that thing at a full 90 degree angle and be fine. :lol:

I wonder what H&R's logic about not doing both sides at once could possibly be. If you were replacing the rear end you would be doing the same thing (unbolt shocks, drop axle, etc.) so it's not like this isn't a valid operation. Maybe fear that someone would hurt themselves on the big heavy axle, or just drop the axle without support?

When I replaced the Falcon's shocks & springs, I used a 2x4 with some small blocks of wood to support the axle at the edges rather than at the pumpkin to help keep it balanced - Falcon has no LCAs, just leafs. You may not need that since you do have LCAs, but it's not a bad idea. Basically, I made a shitty one of these out of Home Depot wood:

http://www.harborfreight.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/i/m/image_25291.jpg?01RI=9ED86291D254BF7,cm:akamai.mat htag.com%2fevent%2fimg%3fakam_state%3d0%26no_log%2 6mt_nsync%26mm_bnc%26relay%3dhttp%253A%252F%252Fak-sync.datasvc.mediamath.com%252Ffcgi.insight-drp%253Furl%253D-%2526referer%253Drelaytest%2526ip_address%253D127. 0.0.1%2526cpcode%253D52202%2526akid%253D3Oc6IeuGcw U3MXaOJ4DHOQMTfAyH1ZeT3pO1qjCT_8Jo1y5qRbU4pzA%2526 blob-id%253D7%2526blob%253D%255BMM_UUID%255D%255Cr%255C n&01NA=ck&

Definitely remove both wheels if you haven't already, but carry on!

[21Kid]

*pops popcorn*

:popcorn:

[Godson]

Fuck the instructions from HR.

Do as tsg said.

[novicius]

What's fun about working on cars is the puzzle-aspect. It's usually a filthy puzzle but a puzzle nonetheless. :D

So I'm throwing away H&R's instructions and jacking the rear of the car up off of the solid axle & rear tires. Ok, first things first: I gotta take off the old rusty quad-shocks. Pulling out the axle-housing pivot bolt did not require these to be removed before but dropping the entire axle does. This of course necessitates more swearing, more laying on the floor dropping rust flakes on my face, more blowtorch and more swearing.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3857/33592514326_c97d730552_b.jpg

Fine, they're off. I have the fresh Bilstein replacements waiting so these needed to come off anyway. :up:

Now I'm ready to unbolt the rear shocks and lift the car... oh wait. With all of my jacking up and jacking off, the ass-end of the car has walked laterally towards the driver's side wall of the garage. I really should pull the car out and re-center it as there is no longer comfortable room to move my jack into place.

Ok get in and... battery's low. Turns over slow but doesn't start. Fine.

As I begin to pull the battery, I see that the PO just left the battery sitting on the tray. The puck-style locking base of the battery tray used to secure the battery doesn't have a bolt on it. My late grandpa always stressed the importance of having a secure battery so I figure I just need to find a bolt that'll fit. Pull the battery, set it up on the charger and look at the threads for the locking puck:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2928/33668753785_9355a97fec_b.jpg

Ah. :lol:

Ok so I need to just swap in a fresh washer-bolt-nut combo under the battery tray. But the tray itself is kinda loose. Looking at the bolt that should be securing the tray:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3788/33539236811_a1ceaeaffb_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/728/33668753535_1fe5017af5_b.jpg

Ah. :lol:

Ok, no threads. I have neither a bolt in my assorted nuts 'n' bolts case to fit this old U-clip nor a fresh U-clip to put a fresh bolt through, so I gotta get in the daily driver and run to Home Depot... only Home Depot has an absolutely shit in-store selection. :smh: Jump in the car and drive to WI-based Menard's, they do have what I need. :up:

Come back, secure the battery tray. Put the battery on the tray and secure the battery with the locking battery puck and fresh hardware. Get the Bananastang started, let her warm up and then back it out 12' and pull back in to the center of the garage, huzzah!! #missionaccomplished

Maybe tonight will be the night I can jack up the car again? :lol: #winning

[dodint]

Menards ftw.

Reading this post was like reading If You Give A Mouse A Cookie.

More like If You Give A Carlo a Mustang.

[thesameguy]

LOVE IS PAIN.

[21Kid]

LOLWisconsin

[novicius]

Reading this post was like reading If You Give A Mouse A Cookie.

More like If You Give A Carlo a Mustang.
I just call it yet another tumble down the rabbit hole.

This car will be done someday, right?! RIGHT?!?! :lol: #never

[thesameguy]

You need a wire wheel and a bucket of POR-15 stat.

[Godson]

Bucket? He needs a fucking swimming pool

[novicius]

Yo momma! :finger:

The actual body of the car isn't 100% terrible. Only the torque boxes and absolute rear of the car under the back bumper are rusty.

Rusty/leaky/crudded-up components will be replaced over time. Body rust is the only thing that truly matters -- and as you can see in this pic, the underbody is largely fine. :up:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3843/33535062462_edf5e48721_b.jpg

That said, this is the suspension at full flex. The upper control arms do not lean down far enough to allow the rear springs to "fall out". :thppt:

I'm going to hit up my local O'Reilly's and see if the urban myth that they loan out spring compressors for free is true. #littlebylittle


EDIT: Looks like it just requires a refundable deposit. (http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/RentalTools.oap) :up:

[Yeti]

I bought Harbor Freight compressors. They're cheap as hell and they haven't killed me yet. Maybe a worthwhile investment for the toolbox?

Also, that Mustang isn't even rusty for WI, lol!

[thesameguy]

Yeah, that is not what I expected based on the previous samples!

How much load is still on those springs? Can you pry them out?

[novicius]

Still a pretty significant load. I couldn't budge them with my pipe wrench.

I picked up the free coil compressor from O'Reilly's at lunch, looking forward to trying it out tonight. :rawk:

[Godson]

I've used ratchet straps in a pinch...

[novicius]

The art of living dangerously, Tyler! :D

[Godson]

Hey, I've said for many years that I was shocked I've lived this long. People thought I was joking.

[thesameguy]

The art of living dangerously, Tyler! :D

Pshaw.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads14/924s+Struts+2008+037+Large+1229400934.jpg

[novicius]

:lol: :up:

Ok duly noted! I will bring my zip-ties along with tonight!

[Godson]

That's bloody brilliant. Why didnt I think of that

[GB]

One of my patients last week was a guy who was doing springs and shocks on his old Toyota of some sort. The spring compressor shifted while he was holding it... and somehow his index finger ended up BETWEEN the compressor and the spring. No one around to help. With his finger caught, he had to wrestle the stuff out so he could get at the adjuster to finally free his hand. Lots of pins needed to be inserted to put his finger back together.

:(

[novicius]

Ouuuuuuuuch! :sing: :(

I try to remain very cognizant of what I'm doing -- I'm as jumpy as a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs when it comes to mechanical work. Breakage and/or injury is a very real possibility. Exciting tho', ain't it? ;)

::

So I checked out O'Reilly's coil spring compressor last night. Yep, it compresses coils, that's what it does:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2809/33553738462_82f3233042_c.jpg https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3795/33553741192_7f0cf71fe2_c.jpg

Now, how's about somebody tell me how I'm supposed to T-1000 this thing into the OEM spring that's there?? :lol:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2850/33710001165_1d73db45fb_c.jpg

There is no way you could get that sucker into there. The compressor shoe, sure -- but not the rod and hooks, nuh-uh. I watched a few videos to see how the pros do it and in every case they were working on an older car (or an SN95 Mustang) on the *front* suspension. There's a hole in the front lower control arm under the spring where the engineers have curled the metal for a base of strength, allowing the rod, collar and hooks of this thing to pass through. Not so on the rear springs.

So I packed it up and drove back to O'Reilly's and rented this instead:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3718/33555704382_ab2240f274_b.jpg

The external spring compressors. :up: I will give them a spin (heh) on Thursday night.

[21Kid]

:lol:

[Godson]

I've never used an internal spring compressor. Only external.

[novicius]

It's like they're playing a joke on non-mechanics -- this must be where IT guys inherited their dickishness. :lol:

<--- longtime IT guy

[thesameguy]

I have both, plus the giant jaws

http://i983.photobucket.com/albums/ae316/gabeancounter/compressor2.jpg

90% of the time it's the shady external ones as that's what most modern cars expect, but sometimes - sometimes - the other ones come into play. The internal ones work on c900s and the XR4Ti... or did... don't need them anymore since all those springs are so short they threaten to fall out over bumps in the road. :lol:

Edit: Remember you don't need to capture all the coils, just enough of them to get the spring small enough to get out. And, be SURE you keep the compressors as opposed to each other as possible. If they are not, or shift closer together the spring *could* shoot out sideways and that's terrifying. A friend did that on our Lemons car and put a huge dent in the side of a '63 Galaxy that was in the shop!

[novicius]

Edit: Remember you don't need to capture all the coils, just enough of them to get the spring small enough to get out.
That is my absolute goal: as little compression on these springs as possible in order to get them out. :up:

[thesameguy]

I only mentioned it because the same guy that shot the Ford also felt compelled to squish the springs into these tiny half-sized things. Unnecessary and unnecessarily dangerous! That's a lot of force balled up there! Using an impact wrench on the compressors (both on and off) is a good idea too, as it limits the levering action on the compressors so they don't tend to twist in random directions. Also keeps your hands away from the whole affair, and that's highly desirable. ;) Speaking of, my approach typically is to use the suspension to compress the spring, then just "hook up" the compressor in position rather than using the spring compressor to do it. Takes less time and seems safer to me. Then just unload the suspension to get the compressed spring out. Sometimes there isn't room to do that, but usually there is.

[novicius]

Yep I've got the jackstands under the rear axle right now so the suspension is fully compressed (unless I load up the trunk with concrete bricks o' course).

I'll put the compressors on, move the jackstands to the torque boxes, put the 2nd jack under the rear axle, pull the shock bolt and see if the flex is enough to pull those springs out. #fingerscrossed

[thesameguy]

Good luck! :up:

[novicius]

Success!

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2927/33379605210_d73ee0b5f5_b.jpg

So the steps are:

Rent Strut Spring Compressors.
Go home and jack up rear of car.
Put jackstands on the frame rails/torque boxes for maximum droop.
Remove rear tires.
Jack up one side of axle housing/LCA bracket as high (compressed) as it will go (just off jackstands).
Put Strut Spring Compressors opposite each other and tighten slightly onto compressed OEM spring.
Remove shock nut & bolt.
Lower jack to allow for maximum rear suspension droop.
Compressed spring will detach from the bottom perch.

I wish I could have found this list o' steps a month ago. :angry:

::

The compressed OEM spring is roughly 11" tall at this point. So I didn't have to compress the new H&R spring all that much since it starts out shorter.

Here's a pic that deeply deeply disappointed Random:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2880/33625611872_91687c5ccf_b.jpg

:lol:

As I said in the GTXF Hangout (https://hangouts.google.com/group/49xhiWRRBEJd5tII2), if I could have done the spring swap properly by removing the axle housing bolt and dropping the LCA, I would have. I tried for several wrenching sessions across at least two weeks in March to get that bolt out. No dice.

Ergo, zip ties. #shrug

Worked great TSG, thanks for showing me that pic. :D :up:

Once the H&R was compressed to 11", I then removed the coil spring compressors and was just left with the zip tied spring. Pop on the isolators and get the spring into position:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2909/33652770261_a61c5cbb66_b.jpg

At this point make sure your spring pigtail is oriented to the driver's side of the car and that it's seated properly on the perches. Jack the axle back up and finesse the shock back into its mounting. Bolt it into place and then jack the axle the rest of the way up, making sure the spring stays on its perches. At this point begin clipping the zip ties -- the last one will snap pretty hard when you cut the 2nd-to-last one, but the spring is already into place at that point. Worked like a dream, there was no place for the spring to go once the rear axle is bolted into place.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2889/32939092524_d2b99178dd_b.jpg

At this point begin bolting everything back together. I could probably do this job in two sessions now.

Onto the fronts!

[Godson]

Sweet. Quad shocks are d-to-the-umb

[novicius]

But also cheaper than buying new LCAs. :lol: #cheap>performance

[thesameguy]

And, what are you really going to gain for all that money on the street? Probably a lot of better bang for the buck options before doing full on suspension replacement.

Now that it's in the past, I can disclaim that zip tie pic was intended tongue in cheek, but mechanically there just isn't a reason it doesn't work. Not sure I'd employ it for such massive compression as in the picture I posted, but for a couple of coils compressed an inch or so, meh, I'd do it. Good zip ties will have tensile strengths of 50+ lbs each - the big ones I have are 100lbs. Getting an inch of compression on a 600lb/in spring is seven zip ties. 20 or whatever is a big safety margin.

Glad it's sorted, glad no digits were lost! Looks a lot better in there with shiny new stuff, and I think it's going to look awesome back on the road!

[novicius]

Exactly. I feel like we're all getting waaay too amped up on having "the best" of every solution. The quad-shocks are cheap and I can put that sweet bling-y NHRA Pro Street LCA money towards what a Mustang REALLY needs: subframe connectors and a god-forsaken Panhard bar! :lol:

cheap>performance

::

Yeah I know we were all joking about that zip tie pic -- but seriously? It worked out great! I could maneuver the compressed spring around in that space *easily* at that point.

I knew I had more than enough zip ties for what little compression I was doing once I (slowly) undid the spring compressors while the spring was on the concrete. Such a freakin' relief after the weeks of wrestling and disappointment of trying to do it the right way. :up: :up:

[dodint]

*shrug*

We've had this discussion before, but 'the best' solution for my setup is the IRS swap. I have more interest, and enjoyment, by maintaining the car in the factory style and just learning to to optimize that setup. And that might not necessarily mean billion dollar adjustable coilovers, either.

You did good, mate.

[thesameguy]

I think I've mentioned my friend's dad's '82 GT before - the one with the modded, injected 5.0 HO swap. It was a disaster to drive until it got a panhard bar. I was shocked at the difference it made, a huge improvement. It still wasn't going to win any (road) races, but the car was infinitely more stable and positive feeling. It should have been there from the factory.

I've unintentionally driven a c900 without one, and I would not recommend that. :P

[novicius]

Thanks Nate!

:up: :up: to keeping it mostly stock. :D

[novicius]

Started the rust-penetrating step of the process on the fronts last night.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2923/33697061861_063b74823b_b.jpg

The size of the wheel wells on this car always amaze me. They're cavernous!

Kroil smells toxic AF. :| Seriously, whenever I spray Kroil on the car I feel like I'm at the end of my night. No way I can work in the garage after that! I can feel the tumors sprouting out of my sinuses & lungs like a black carbon snake on the 4th o' Ju-ly!

Hmm...

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/581/32982987404_93bbc51ef2_b.jpg

Isn't there supposed to be a nut on that bottom bolt? :lol: #smh #thiscar

[thesameguy]

What is that supposed to be holding together? The strut???

(I have seriously never noticed how Kroil smells in particular - maybe you're using a lot?)

[TheBenior]

(I have seriously never noticed how Kroil smells in particular - maybe you're using a lot?)
Well, he is working on a Midwestern car.

[thesameguy]

True, true - but this is where Dockonomics really pays off... you will get a better result with less Kroil over a longer period of time than more Kroil over a shorter one. You just need it between the moving parts, not on the outside of the fasteners. :up:

[novicius]

Yeah that's the bottom foot of the strut. One-bolt Sally. :smh:

My technique for applying Kroil:

https://media.giphy.com/media/lF5bH6enH9F1m/giphy.gif

[thesameguy]

:lol: :up:

But, seriously, try a wire brush to remove loose rust and get access to the threads, and just a spritz applied to the top and bottom every so often over a long period of time. Excess will just evaporate, so more than enough isn't better. :)

[Yeti]

I use the Kroil in the old-fashioned metal oilcan. Less Kroil vapors that way :lol:

[novicius]

This week has been busy with fam so I haven't been able to get out to the Bananastang. :(

Tonight I'll go back, look things over and see if I can start unfastening things (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68PbbVtYU-Q).

[dodint]

Hurry up, you have about one day to get that thing track ready.

;)

[novicius]

Got after it last night. :cool:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2908/33922980166_24b686a97d_b.jpg

Tackling the front suspension now. I want to get everything situated and unbuttoned before I re-rent the coil spring compressors again as well as the ball-joint extractor tool.

So first things first: remove the two bolts off the back of the aluminum two-piston PBR caliper:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3736/33807056252_46ed18ce7d_b.jpg

Successfully did that for both sides using plenty of propane blowtorch. Then tackled the strut base bolts, again with the torch:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2926/33924449586_2cc772f749_b.jpg

Russ projectile vomited in chat at this point. :lol: #Wisconsin

Backed 'em out on both sides. :up: :up:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3946/33152963863_f911da9157_b.jpg

Lastly, I was stopped by the shock tower tops.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2937/33153305703_53b1e0f353_b.jpg

The bolt is pretty well rusted to the shaft and would just turn the shaft when I cranked on it. I tried hitting it with fire as well; no dice.

But! Russ said I should put a jack under the A-arm and see if easing some pressure off the shock helps. I'll try that tonight.

[thesameguy]

Oof. Faced that one on a Saab 9000 from back east.

Since you're dumping the struts you can brutalize them! Use a Dremel or a nut splitter (or a Dremel and a cold chisel) on the top, use a pipe wrench on the shaft, or grind flats into the shaft to grip them with a wrench. I'll bet a pipe wrench and an impact driver will get it done.

(On the 9000, I had no intention of replacing the strut... but I ended up replacing the strut :lol: )

Hey, did you buy some anti-seize?

[novicius]

Yep I bought anti-seize, white lithium paste & red threadlock all at the same time.

I already tried putting a toothy vise grips on the top of the shaft there. That's why it's torn up a bit.

I'm trying to think about what I can put in that groove that's burly enough. I tweaked a flathead screwdriver already. :smh:


EDIT: When I tried putting the blowtorch on that nut beforehand, I alternated between opposite sides. Just can't get a good grip on it last night. Off to YouTube! :D

[Yeti]

I'd probably Kroil that for a day and then try to knock it loose with my impact gun. Usually that initial shock (or several shocks in quick succession) will get the nut loose before the strut shaft starts to spin.

That's pretty shitty that they only give you a slot for a flat screwdriver. Most of the cars I've worked on have wrench flats there.

[thesameguy]

Vice grips probably won't have the grip you need - the shaft is hardened and vice grips don't have enough leverage to bite in. A gigantic Mario-style pipe wrench is a hilarious tool to own and might get it done. :)

http://www.harborfreight.com/24-inch-jumbo-steel-pipe-wrench-39645.html

So much fun! I'm always happy when I have a reason to use that monstrosity. You'll need someone to hold it while you abuse the nut with the impact wrench.

Not sure if the Mustang has one, but the lug wrench that comes in Saabs has what I think was intended to be a tire iron at the opposite end that can be used like a big-ass screwdriver. You could probably use a prybar in the same way, but leverage or fitment may be a problem. Something like this:

http://www.harborfreight.com/15-1-2-half-inch-flat-pry-bar-2529.html

Also a hilarious tool worth owning, but this approach prevents using the impact, which I think will be important.

A nut splitter should eliminate the nut entirely:

https://www.amazon.com/Steelgrip-2265015-Nut-Splitter-Piece/dp/B003MQIVZA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1491935042&sr=8-1&keywords=nut+splitter

Or, you can use a Dremel to either stress-relief or section the nut and remove it, or to slit the nut so you can hit it real hard with a big ass sledgehammer and chisel and split it. But, if you've already got the Dremel out that's probably all you need.

http://www.robotroom.com/Straighten/SplitNut.jpg

and then just pry the nut open... or cut the other side and it'll fall off. :)

[thesameguy]

I'd probably Kroil that for a day and then try to knock it loose with my impact gun. Usually that initial shock (or several shocks in quick succession) will get the nut loose before the strut shaft starts to spin.

This too, plus go forwards and backwards.

[novicius]

All good tips -- tho' I was hoping someone would give me a simple tool that does it all for me. :D Like a steering wheel puller or somesuch.



I'd probably Kroil that for a day and then try to knock it loose with my impact gun. Usually that initial shock (or several shocks in quick succession) will get the nut loose before the strut shaft starts to spin.
Yep the Kroil has been hosed on there so it should be doing... something. :lol:

[Yeti]

The liquid Kroil doesn't dry up as fast as the aerosol kind :p

TSG, I have 36" and 48" pipe wrenches left from my days as an HVAC tech. I have yet to find an excuse to use one on a car but here's hoping!

[thesameguy]

All good tips -- tho' I was hoping someone would give me a simple tool that does it all for me. :D

The Dremel is the answer. If you don't have one, just do yourself the favor! I'd save the money and get the corded version - the cheapest is $60. I like the EZ Lock attachment:

https://www.amazon.com/Dremel-EZ688-01-Cutting-Metal-Plastic/dp/B002Q8T4OM/ref=sr_1_4?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1491942039&sr=1-4&keywords=dremel+ez

It's very effective at murdering metal. Probably take 3-5 minutes or so to just get rid of the nut.


TSG, I have 36" and 48" pipe wrenches left from my days as an HVAC tech. I have yet to find an excuse to use one on a car but here's hoping!

YEAH! I think I have a 36" which I bought for what I will loosely call "body work" - I "fixed" a fender and a bulkhead with it. At $14 or whatever, I don't mind using it as a hammer or anvil and once - only once - as a pipe wrench.

[thesameguy]

And, actually, a nut splitter is a cheap simple tool that does it for you - just slip it over the nut, whale on the screw with an impact.

http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/tools/pics/ns2a.jpg

[novicius]

I've already got the big-ass pipe wrench -- but what do I do with it? Clamp it to the nut and turn? Won't that just turn the shaft like I'm doing with my breaker bar?

[thesameguy]

Grab the strut shaft with the pipe wrench and the nut with the impact (or a box wrench and put your back into it).

Kinda like this:

http://www.toyota120.com/assets/images/image007.jpg

[novicius]

Well at first I tried tackling the nut up top again.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2807/33172374793_0ce8a2e641_b.jpg

Just couldn't do it. I was able to chew up the metal of the strut with both the screwdriver head and also a crowbar claw with the nut secured by the monkey wrench. No dice.

So then I did try to get at the shaft from underneath.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2908/33141780494_2e3997869d_b.jpg

But the sumbitch is way too slick to get a grip on it. I tried locking it down with vise grips and using the pipe wrench, and I just couldn't get a hold of it. :smh: How do I get a better grip on it with the pipe wrench??

I'm going to try renting a different impact wrench (https://www.atozrentall.com/rentals/impact-wrench-1-2-electric) since my stepdad's tired old one is no where near able to wrestle with this.

[thesameguy]

That sucks. If you think the impact you're using a weak the challenge may be solved with a better one. If it's of value, I have a big-ass DeWalt electric impact I'm happy to send you until the project is done. I keep it for emergencies in the Suburban/motorhome but it hasn't really been used in years.

The Dremel/nut splitter approach is still the somewhat painful but guaranteed approach.

Don't get too frustrated - the fasteners that won't unfasten due to corrosion, access, or damage is a recurring theme in working on cars. It's just a matter of plowing through techniques til you find the one that works. :)

[novicius]

Cool! But hold off on sending me your tools, I still owe you for this clockspring! :D

I know that I need a beefy cordless impact wrench. I've got my eye on the Milwaukee Tool M18 "Big Dick Richie" (https://www.milwaukeetool.com/power-tools/cordless/2763-22) but that'll be a purchase for a few months from now... or later this week, depending. :lol:

[thesameguy]

I still cannot believe there is a battery-powered 1100lb ft torque wrench!!!

The ability to apply big force quickly is the key to all things, especially working on cars. :lol:

[Godson]

Vice grips can't hold the shock shaft? That's a new one.

[JoshInKC]

Yeah, are they small or something? Properly applied, a decent set of vice grips will damage almost anything into having traction.
Then you put you big-ass pipe wrench on the newly created scars.

[novicius]

Ok I'll give 'em the serious crimpage tonight, see if I can't scar the shafts.

But I was slowly and carefully dialing in the wheel on the vise grips to maximum squeeze. I felt like I was cracking a safe! :D

I'll be picking up the rental impact wrench today for use tonight, too.

[Godson]

Yeah. Just manhandle that bitch. Put the vice grips on so hard you are afraid to take them off.

[novicius]

I already was afraid I'd break 'em! :twitch:

Ok renting the impact wrench tomorrow. They have a weekender's special where they only charge the 1-day ($25) fee for Friday afternoon through Sunday. :up:

[thesameguy]

Fingers crossed for you!

[dodint]

I wonder if it killed him.

[novicius]

Yo Momma! :lol:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2829/33881729422_8247c8cb67_b.jpg

Got 'em off! :finger:

This weekend was booked for me -- all I was able to do was zip these off with the rental electric impact wrench. Tonight I'll go over and swap out the springs. :up: :up:

[thesameguy]

Weak tools strike again!!!!

[novicius]

Passenger side is in!

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5658/33298231603_0c849f0781_b.jpg

This was... interesting. These are installed without the top isos but with the OEM rubber base still in. I didn't see a way to peel or pull it out -- tear it out bit by bit with a set of pliars? :lol:

Also I did not put in the bushings or ball joints so I fully expect the handling to still be garbage. But I think I'm going to hit the Easy Button on those once I've got the ride height dialed in with these dampers. Need to see if they need to be revalved or not (and I suspect they do).

Little by (very) little! :finger:

[thesameguy]

No isolators could lead to some NVH - I wonder if they're left out to give maximum drop? I had to custom-make some for the XR to get the rear to an acceptable level.

[novicius]

Yep NVH could definitely increase but a lot of SN95 guys report little to no noise increase.

If it's intolerable I will put them in in the future. #shrug

[thesameguy]

I drive a 1986 Merkur with 750 lb in springs. There could be a dude running a jackhammer in the trunk and it would be drowned out by road noise. So, no judgment. ;)

[novicius]

Yeah my absolute #1 concern right now is damper-to-spring match. I just feel like these re-valved Bilsteins are waaay too beaucoup for these springs.

I'm mighty curious to see how the fronts sit but the rears are gonna get yanked in short order if they don't settle. :smh:

[dodint]

Cut 'em, like a boss, yes.

[novicius]

Cut the dampers? :lol:

[thesameguy]

Springs. :lol:

[dodint]

Yeah, thought we were talking springs.

You're the one that said lowering Mustangs was easy.

[Godson]

It is...

[novicius]

Yeah, thought we were talking springs.
If you re-read my comment, I said that the springs were fine and that it's the dampers that were the problem. What would cutting the springs help with in that case?? :lol:



You're the one that said lowering Mustangs was easy.
Even in jest I never said that -- I've ALWAYS said it's a god-damned rabbit hole to properly lower a Mustang! :angry:

Speaking of passing a watermelon pass your sphincter, I hit another roadblock last night trying to get the front driver's side spring into place.

First off, what the blue-blazes is this stuff?! :twitch:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3853/34129561255_eacb1cd882_b.jpg

But yeah, the coil spring compressors are *just* a literal 1/8 too long. I don't know why/how the passenger-side spring went in so easy but the driver's side wasn't having any of it. I think I'm going to try the zip ties again tonight... :o

The Titanic called -- they want their strut back.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3850/33286410474_3a53010318_b.jpg

:lol:

[dodint]

If you re-read my comment, I said that the springs were fine and that it's the dampers that were the problem. What would cutting the springs help with in that case?? :lol:

I can't read; don't cyber bully me.




Even in jest I never said that -- I've ALWAYS said it's a god-damned rabbit hole to properly lower a Mustang! :angry:


Bullshit, you said it was easy, just cut the springs. Heed your own advice.


It is...

Perfect post, btw.

[novicius]

:lol: :up:

[thesameguy]

If you re-read my comment, I said that the springs were fine and that it's the dampers that were the problem. What would cutting the springs help with in that case?? :lol:

It should work. The shocks only lift the car because they work with the preload on the springs. Reduce that preload and you will eliminate most of that force. The shocks are not going to hold up the car by themselves.


First off, what the blue-blazes is this stuff?! :twitch:

It looks like wheel bearing or maybe assembly grease.

[Yeti]

Please pull the spring isolator and sand/POR15 that control arm :lol:

[novicius]

It comes out? How?

[thesameguy]

Gawd, I didn't even see it down there. It should just be rubber that has been mashed into oblivion. You can buy ok Energy Suspension replacements for $20... and you'll need to, because the only way it's coming out is in pieces! You could always just mission-creep this into new LCAs. :D

[Yeti]

They usually just set in place, no fasteners or adhesive.

Yours might be fused with rust to the arm though.

[thesameguy]

Mmmmm... Wisconsin.

[Yeti]

You know how we do.

http://i.imgur.com/oQLVv3e.png

[thesameguy]

I really like how the rust just gave up a couple feet in. "They know what's up around here."

[Godson]

What the actual fuck. Jesus that's sum rust.

[Cam]

That's just what happens to cars up north. :(

[novicius]

They usually just set in place, no fasteners or adhesive.

Yours might be fused with rust to the arm though.
Yeah that shizz is NOT coming out without some serious muscle. :smh:

[thesameguy]

FIRE.

But, seriously, it'll probably come out pretty easily with a screwdriver. Once you get in there and break some free the rest will probably follow without too much work.

I wonder if you could pour some brake fluid or ATF or something on it. That usually does a number on rubber quick-fast.

[novicius]

Yeah I poked at it with my longnecked screwdriver and it was NOT budging. Stuck so hard & fast that I thought it was riveted in place! :lol:

[Yeti]

Yeah that shizz is NOT coming out without some serious muscle. :smh:

Eat your Wheaties :p

Srsly though, it'd be best to get that nasty thing out of there, POR the control arm, and spend the $29.99 on some new poly ones. Even O'Rly's Auto sells poly ones.

[thesameguy]

What was the lower ball joint outcome? I don't recall. I ask only because new LCAs with ball joints (and I presume inner bushings) are only about $75ea. Me, personally, I'd rather spend that than dick around with dead rubber and POR15 but it's not my $20 vs. $150 decision. ;) I would agree something should be done. Waiting for the spring to go through the bottom of the control arm ain't great, and neither is taking it apart twice. I would caution that it could be gnarly getting the LCA off, but I don't know precisely how they're attached.

https://www.amazon.com/Moog-RK620899-Control-Joint-Assembly/dp/B00CCK9LH4
https://www.amazon.com/Moog-RK620900-Control-Joint-Assembly/dp/B00CCK9LLU

About the same price overall at rockauto.

[thesameguy]

Just realized those are the "RK" line of parts, which means they're the less expensive option and don't have serviceable ball joints. I wouldn't do that on a race car, might not do that on a daily driver, but would definitely do it on a limited use vehicle. They will probably only last several tens of thousands of miles rather than another 15 years of daily use. The "better" options add another $40 to the equation. Guessing you don't plan to own the Bananastang in a decade and it doesn't matter, but it's a point of consideration, full disclosure, blah blah.

[novicius]

neither is taking it apart twice.
Oh this is definitely going to happen -- probably 2-3 more times until I get things just the way I want them. :lol:

Last night I had to thrash; my folks came home for the summer and I had* to get the M00stang out of there. So in preparation, I went to Menard's tool & supply store and bought the biggest zip ties I could find: 175 lbs tensile strength. :hard:

The rest is academic: crush the springs down to an acceptable height, put on 9 of these suckas to a side, release and slot the shorty in.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2902/33339560503_379173bbec_b.jpg

Easy. When I did get everything bolted in and was clipping off the zip-ties, even just one of these thick white straps was enough to keep the spring compressed much less 9 of them. :lol:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2867/33994108652_2c8020183a_b.jpg

At this point I put the strut in, slipped the caliper over the rotor and bolted everything together. Brakes worked, car drove and I can hear a little clatter going over broken pavement but that's about it right now. :up:

I have Steeda balljoints and urethane bushings that need to go in along with getting that rubber out of there. Still on the fence about doing that myself but now that I have zip ties from Krypton I might be ok.

Now to figure out why my headlights didn't work... :lol:

*I guess I didn't have to get out of their garage but I feel shitty taking up their garage space with my toy, natch.

[novicius]

Bullshit, you said it was easy, just cut the springs. Heed your own advice.
Also the spring & shock combo seems to be working out. Decently paired after all -- if anything, I still need MORE damper! :lol: :up:

Might be a situation where this winter I send them in to be re-checked by Maximum Motorsports two at a time. They should be as hard as railroad spikes.

[dodint]

:up:

[novicius]

Eat your Wheaties :p

Srsly though, it'd be best to get that nasty thing out of there, POR the control arm, and spend the $29.99 on some new poly ones. Even O'Rly's Auto sells poly ones.
I will be running no isos on this car to start. If its too harsh then I'll put them on -- but anecdotal Mustang forum posts makes me want to run without them to start.

Coating the control arm with POR 15 (and fresh Grade 8-10 hinge bolts) is on my list now -- and coating the arms in silver, too (http://www.por15.com/POR-15-Top-Coat_p_102.html). :up:

[novicius]

I did disconnect the battery earlier this year, I wonder if the headlights (aftermarket HIDs) need to be reprogrammed or something?

Putting this here for some future reading: HIDs stopped working (http://www.vtxoa.com/forums/7-vtx-1300-riders-board/294876-help-please-hid-lights-stopped-working.html?action=thread) (motorcycle forum but some good tips) and HID Planet ideas (https://www.hidplanet.com/forums/forum/general-discussion/general-discussion-aa/995-please-help-hids-stopped-working)

I definitely need to check the fuse first.

[thesameguy]

Nice work on that rapid completion! Send some of that juju my way. :P

[novicius]

Hey I just had to bolt together some basic components -- you're off on another Marco Polo automotive adventure over there! :lol:

::

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2922/34004604882_1876d64125_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2856/34004655682_f5cce9b128_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2828/34124248316_68356e7d9f_b.jpg

Still not as low as I ultimately want but I'm not lowering the rear more until I have a lower front. It all starts with the front wheel gap.

But this weekend is another packed family weekend for me -- in-laws' family is flying in for a funeral and then a birthday party for my two-year-old on Sunday. Then next weekend I'm going autocrossing so I don't dare pull it apart before then so this is the height she's gonna roll at for a few weeks.

Lastly here is a driving vid I made to test out my cheap-o phone camera mount for autox: Camera vid 1 (https://flic.kr/p/SPtccr)

Yes-yes, I know that the amount of crackling plastic is hilarious. :finger:

[Yeti]

That sounds awesome! Like it's powered by mustaches and Miller High Life :p

[thesameguy]

Yeah it does - I'd not be mad at any of that. I see how you might want a little more low, but OTOH you might also emerge successful with some wider wheels & tires or the spacers you'd mentioned. It might turn out just right.

Also, the Bananastang is incredibly bright for that neighborhood. :lol:

[novicius]

That sounds awesome! Like it's powered by mustaches and Miller High Life :p
Hey thanks!! Dat 2V lyfe, y0. :lol: :up: #thankyou

That cam placement is right at the top of the dashboard so it's a little low. I just took another vid but this time high up at the top of the windshield and it looks (and sounds) better. I should have them up tonight.

[novicius]

Yeah it does - I'd not be mad at any of that.
A-thank you. :D

The car condition is rough right now due to age and neglect but there are also some OEM fabrication decisions that are just straight low-quality. The ridiculous OEM rear wheelwell spot welds all the way around the inside of the lip, for example. Just fucking shoddy -- what engineer thought that that was a good idea?? :twitch: But I'm not driving this thing with an eye towards fine German/Japanese engineering, I'm completely focused on the Roadkill Americana aspect: shitty, loud & slow, just like our President. #sadlulz



I see how you might want a little more low, but OTOH you might also emerge successful with some wider wheels & tires or the spacers you'd mentioned. It might turn out just right.
The 1.25" spacers are already on the rear wheels. Honestly this car could handle 1.5" spacers easily (if not up to 2"). Again Ferd engineers, what in THE fuck? Widen the axle!! :smh:

Damper tuning and scraping off the remaining iso. That is high on my To Do list.



Also, the Bananastang is incredibly bright for that neighborhood. :lol:
Yeah it's completely-totally-utterly nuclear. :cool: #ihazbadtaste

[thesameguy]

Meh... I think that wheel/fender situation is exactly what you'd expect on a car engineered in 1990 and styled to evoke a classic American car. The whole #somewhatflush thing is much more recent invention.

https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/camaro/2000/oem/2000_chevrolet_camaro_coupe_z28_fq_oem_1_500.jpg

http://car-pictures.cars.com/images/?IMG=U9CHGEA2.JPG&HEIGHT=600

Plus, you know, it's Ford... the "never leave a parts bin full" and "we'll redesign it when we have to, and maybe not even then" people. :lol:

(I would still take most Fords over most GMs most any day. Most. :lol:)

[novicius]

Yeah but I wants it. :D #moarlow

18" rims would help out somewhat. Proper coilovers would fix it immediately.

When I strip/sand/paint these rims back to proper polished-lip Bullitts then maybe I'll be a bit more mollified with my American Graffiti stance.

[thesameguy]

Totally fair, and you're talking to the guy who hit his skidplate on a parking lot manhole cover, but you just gotta know it's all on you. Ford didn't even know your wackadoo concept of aesthetics even existed, much less cared about them. :P

Also, cost be damned, seriously consider just buying new wheels... strip/sand/paint is THE. WORST. I will never do that again. Like, a quick rattle can touch up sure, but I restored one wheel on my old, old SPG and threw in the towel.. same painted center, polish lip scenario...

http://www.wheelcollision.com/wccpix/68157.jpg

NOPE.

I used up probably 43% of my lifetime patience allotment.

[novicius]

Nice! :D

I've been looking at a few YouTube vids so I have an idea of what goes into it. ;)

As usual, I'll be reporting in with pictures of my shoddy ghettoriffic work and my frustration over what minor steps are holding me up, I'm sure. :up:

[thesameguy]

This conversation reminds me: You know what would probably get that spring isolator off? Aircraft stripper.

[dodint]

I was going to make an Erika Eleniak joke but Under Siege was on a battleship. Different kind of stripper.

[novicius]

TSG, here's the artsy version of that pic for people that aren't curmudgeonly and have Facebook & Instagram:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2819/34124689116_3daabe1b8d_b.jpg

[dodint]

What kind of blower do you have under that scoop?

[novicius]

The best kind: my imagination. :hard:

[thesameguy]

TSG, here's the artsy version of that pic for people that aren't curmudgeonly and have Facebook & Instagram:

Don't confuse laziness with curmudgeonliness. I just don't have interest in managing the automatic relationships that come with social media. I get plenty of second-hand bullshit from the girl "My friend commented on my post and then my other friend commented and now they're arguing and my grandmother saw it all and so I have to explain it to my mother so she can explain it to my grandmother." And forget about the fallout that comes from coworkers getting an eyeful of your personal life or making assumptions about your personal life when it's all withheld from them. We had a situation at work where two people had a mutual friend, Coworker A said something not great about Coworker B and Mutual Friend A relayed that to Coworker C who then told Coworker B. FUCK. THAT. NOISE. You know what I tell you because I tell you, not because you overheard some drunk-ass post. :smh:

:angry:

Edit: But I do appreciate the GTXF share - that feels super personal! :D

[novicius]

Yeah but I want to see your monkeywrenchin' glitternipple lifestyle. #cry

[thesameguy]

https://www.southwest.com/

[novicius]

Sweet! Me and my six-demon shibari bag are on the way! :rawk:

[thesameguy]

I guess I should clean out the guest wing? It's full of old bullshit computer stuff right now! Good God I need to get back on the CL... that might be the only management task worse than facebook.

[novicius]

Hey-o! :D

Did this work?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4PwyPkupV4

[dodint]

Yes.

Vroom.

[novicius]

How 'bout this one? :twisted:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdaJF4LSLnI

[Cam]

Yes.

Vroom-vroom.

[GB]

I was going to make an Erika Eleniak joke
She was hawt.

[GB]

Yeah but I want to see your monkeywrenchin' glitternipple lifestyle. #cry
Which is one reason I'm currently trying to put together my Northern California summer vacay plans!

[novicius]

:up: :up:

So those vids are with the camera mount at dashboard level. I have one with the camera mount at the top of the windshield and I think it looks better. Uploading it now.

[novicius]

Same route but camera mounted at the top of the windshield.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuaSl3d5v-o&t

[thesameguy]

Which is one reason I'm currently trying to put together my Northern California summer vacay plans!

HEY! Make it happen in August. We'll road trip down to SOC. :up:

[thesameguy]

Same route but camera mounted at the top of the windshield.

Man, I have got to make my next car purchase a Mustang. Every damn generation I'm like "that's the one I'm going to buy" and I never do. :smh: If not now, when???

It sounds great, and if the camera is any indication, the suspension seems sporty but road worthy!

[Random]

Could always drop a 302 in the Falcon...

[novicius]

Man, I have got to make my next car purchase a Mustang. Every damn generation I'm like "that's the one I'm going to buy" and I never do. :smh: If not now, when???
I highly recommend a 2V '99-'04 New Edge Mustang GT & 5-speed stick. They're dirt-cheap and you can find rust-free 150K mileage ones by the bushel full. :up:


It sounds great, and if the camera is any indication, the suspension seems sporty but road worthy!
The suspension in this vid is actually a mess. There was a strange oscillation that I could feel and just chalked it up to bumpsteer. So today when I was getting my headlights working (power line was unplugged), I took a monkey wrench & hex driver to the struts and put the HULK SMASH on 'em.

Turns out the passenger-side strut wasn't anywhere close to being tight! :lol: A short cruise afterwards and now it's firm with no hobby-horse action. :D :up:

[thesameguy]

Could always drop a 302 in the Falcon...

I should probably rephrase with "Every damn generation since the SN95 I'm like "that's the one I'm going to buy" and I never do." ;) Something about going actually fast in something older than I am makes me really uncomfortable. :)

[thesameguy]

I highly recommend a 2V '99-'04 New Edge Mustang GT & 5-speed stick. They're dirt-cheap and you can find rust-free 150K mileage ones by the bushel full. :up:

Around here early S197s are getting pretty cheap - it'd be a tough call (for me) between a genuinely nice New Edge or a well-worn S197. Drive-wise, I don't imagine there is a huge difference... so it'd be an aesthetic choice for me and I don't know where my loyalties lie! :D

[novicius]

Drive 'em -- the SN95 is a noticeably smaller car. :)

EDIT: But I absolutely will agree that the S197's look better! :lol:

[dodint]

EDIT: But I absolutely will agree that the S197's look better! :lol:

What the fuck.

The worst opinions, honestly.

[thesameguy]

#roflcrazytalk

https://image.adam.automotive.com/f/26514343/0608mmfp_01z+ford_mustang+front_view.jpg

There is no New Edge that can out muscle car the S197.

[dodint]

Totally changed my mind.

[thesameguy]

You best recognize.

[novicius]

What the fuck.

The worst opinions, honestly.
Shit, you don't even know Mustangs and you're stepping up to me... :lol:

[novicius]

Some good populist lists here:

Ranking the Ford Mustang by generation. (https://www.carthrottle.com/post/w8rv2lz/)

10 Best Mustangs To Own And Drive. (http://www.mustangandfords.com/news/mump-1106-10-best-mustangs-to-own-drive/)

...and the answer is: S197 ;)

[dodint]

I'm not waging this battle on two fronts.

Note that I'm not advocating for the SN95, just saying the S197 is fugly.

[thesameguy]

Some good populist lists here:

Ranking the Ford Mustang by generation. (https://www.carthrottle.com/post/w8rv2lz/)

10 Best Mustangs To Own And Drive. (http://www.mustangandfords.com/news/mump-1106-10-best-mustangs-to-own-drive/)

...and the answer is: S197 ;)

I will have to review these... I realized this morning I drove my friend's Bullitt when it was brand new, and another friend's Rousch S197 when it was - both I didn't really hammer on them. I do now have a recollection of feeling the Rousch was gigantic, but back then my big car was the 164, so not really all that big by modern standards.

I wonder what the opportunities are for mechanical basket cases S197s. I am not sure I want to give something up to add a Mustang (though the Jag is definitely on the table) but I'd be very interested and happy to find a fixer I could flip. Been a while since I've done that... if the numbers are there, I'd enjoy putting the wrench time in to get a few months of use out of one (and then make some dough).

(and, no, the Jeep doesn't count here because I've essentially already forgotten about it)

[novicius]

Shit so did we. :lol:

S197 basket cases are still expensive according to my research, even in CA.

That's why I do advocate for the SN95's. Obviously they can sound great and they can scoot. Just gotta invest in the suspensions. ;)

[thesameguy]

Yeah, but I hear those are a bitch to work on. Something something zip ties.

[novicius]

Yeah but there's two things in your favor:


No rust.
You're a better mechanic than me.


:toast:

[thesameguy]

:D

I'll have to keep my eyes open, maybe work on a fall/winter project!

[novicius]

Went to the opening Madison Sports Car Club's parking lot autox event yesterday and laid a ginormous egg. :lol: :down:

Unfortunately I was thrown right into Round 1 which didn't help me at all -- I would have preferred to work corners on the first set of runs so I could watch others do the course and mentally learn it. Ah well, I DNF'd my first and third runs by missing gates. I had to try to get my head around the course, memorize the gates, look for a line, modulate throttle and figure out what gears I should be using, etc. That's a lot of data to parse for this old brain!

Oh yeah, it was 50-degrees F and raining. #lol


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2npYiR4mb7A

That was run entirely in 1st gear which was wasteful (at best) and hard on the car (at worst). Just no burst to be had and I'm blowing up the one-wheel drive any time I stick my wooden foot in it.

Then I tried using both 1st & 2nd gear.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fb1-kjTWaC8

Hey, I don't think I hit any cones! :finger: I had to talk to the Race Organizer and write a check for $76 for a broken antenna and cable. The timer light itself handled the excursion well thankfully.

So after that I went out and worked the corners for the other racers. It was cold, my shoes and pants got soaked (I brought both a fleece and a hooded Columbia shell so at least my top was warm and dry :up: ) and I felt pretty shit of myself. Ah well.

After working the corner I went to the concession stand to eat and trying to get my head back on what I should be focusing on: smoothness. Cold track, cold tires & an unceasing wet slurry meant that I had zero traction, zero power, zero burst. So just get up to speed, get into 2nd and try to smooth through the course regardless of how slow it felt.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHxLe0lN1m0

Rewarded with my best run of the day. :up:

Also I was the slowest driver of the day out there.

There was a guy who drove a mid-'90s F-350 with a 460 big block/auto trans 4x4 there that I beat but seriously, c'mon. I lost to a shit-ton of iron that I should be faster than: a shitbox Chrysler Sebring on stock rims and a flapping beat-up nose. A shitbox Chevy Sonoma S-10 V6 pickup carrying a passenger the whole day. A 70's Camaro setup for street/strip and riding on 20-year-old tires (I drooled over his car and chatted with him for a bit; really nice guy). The guy with the MINI Countryman 4x4 made me look *so* bad. :smh:

::

Just a terrible, terrible TERRIBLE day, the kind of day that makes me question just what the fuck am I doing out here, why am I wasting my money like this, showing my ass and getting it spanked hard over and over. #sigh In a cosmic first, there weren't even any Miatas there!

So... yeah. MSCC Autox Driver's School is on May 21st. (http://www.madisonsportscarclub.com/node/432) Looks like I'm going after all.

How was your weekend? :)

[Kchrpm]

But you sounded good!

[novicius]

Loud & slow, doing my part to maintain the proud Mustang tradition. :D :up:

The Track:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2849/33983324460_fa979a2e07_b.jpg

Happy Car:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2926/33557126863_e99165006a_b.jpg

Unhappy Driver:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4171/33557148483_1e17d39b9b_b.jpg

The Damage:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2845/33988851560_bbc5cddfab_b.jpg

IMO the Bananastang should be a 0.57.xxx car right now. That means I've got 5+ seconds to shave off somewhere. :smh: #horribledriving #eternity

[novicius]

The Competition:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2868/34236908991_03140d1c63_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2942/34236917641_50a6c65eb0_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2891/34236925941_931b5c41fb_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2820/33983367210_16ab386ddd_b.jpg


The King:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2821/33525909074_309fee4093_b.jpg

This old guy could wheel but it was his son (grandson?) who set the TToD. :up:

[Phil_SS]

Why are you in F-Prepared?

And it appears you placed second in your class. ;)

[Random]

Ha, I asked the same question. Different classing system than the SCCA. :)

[novicius]

Thanks bud. :lol:

+2 points for aftermarket springs, +2 points for no mufflers. 4 points moves me out of F Stock and into F Prepared.

[Phil_SS]

Oh, it's not SCCA....... still doesn't make sense.....

[novicius]

Here's the page with the PDF on rules & vehicle classification lists (starting on page 19). (http://www.madisonsportscarclub.com/node/22)

[thesameguy]

Sorry it was disappointing, but it sure seems like the cards were stacked against you here - new car, lots of spring, wet weather, no traction control, not the world's most advanced suspension, and probably some really inappropriate gearing. It's easy to say from afar, but I wouldn't be too disappointed with those results - it was a trial run in seriously sub-optimal conditions. Some more wheel time and maybe some sensible weather and you should see some dramatic time improvements. I have zero recollection of what tires you've got on there, but that alone could be a big piece of the puzzle (given the conditions).

[novicius]

Thank ye kindly. :) :up:

I think I'm riding on Fuzion UHP Sport A/S in 245/45R17 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Fuzion&tireModel=UHP+Sport+A%2FS)'s on all four corners. Yes they're hockey pucks that hold air. #shrug

[thesameguy]

Well, shit, that could be the entire issue right there.

4.6 Hydroplaning Resistance
4.3 Wet Traction

My first track day in the CTS-V was on the horrific Supercar runflats and I felt like an asshat the whole time... Like, I'm not that good of a driver but I never thought I was that bad. Second time was in the spring, in the dry, and I still wasn't fast, but at least I wasn't playing catchup to a TurboRanger anymore. :lol: I'm sure you'll see huge improvements once the water goes away!

[thesameguy]

Pointlessly started reading reviews of those tires.


The wet handling is dangerous. I never had a problem stopping in the wet, but cornering and acceleration are terrible with these tires. When it's wet out, I don't have much trouble spinning all 4 wheel under acceleration in 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Cornering in the wet feels like driving on a light dusting of snow. The car will initially understeer and then transition to oversteer depending on the speed and driver inputs.

The best part is that this is on a WRX. If a four cylinder AWD car can't get traction how the hell is a Mustang GT supposed to??? :lol:

Edit: Man, the reviews are great! Many of them start with "if you value your life, do not buy these tires." I wonder if the suspension oscillations you commented on earlier are just these tires?


But as soon as there is a drop of rain or a single snowflake on the road these tires turn into a down right frightening experience


I found these tires dangerously awful! The real problem with these tires is wet traction. On the highway, they hydroplane, even in moderate rain


Every time it rains I fear for my safety with these tires. Just going around corners at normal speed they will break loose with the slightest application of the accelerator. Fortunately the G37 Vehicle Dynamic Control (VDC) is very good and *most* of the time can stop the car from fishtailing like a hoolligan. I once turned off the VDC on a wet turn and I got to play Rhys Millen for a few seconds, which was kind of awesome but kind of terrifying.
On that note, if you truly enjoy sliding around like a maniac every time it rains, these are the tires for you.

So good!

[novicius]

:lol:

Well I'm going back to the same track later this month -- here's hoping it doesn't rain! :D :up:

[dodint]

https://media.giphy.com/media/roHXWGn2z1Z9S/giphy.gif

I'm sorry dude. :lol:

I love you and trust you'll find (nearly as much) humor in this as I did. :twisted:

:sadbanana:

[novicius]

:lol: :up:

[thesameguy]

:lol:

Well I'm going back to the same track later this month -- here's hoping it doesn't rain! :D :up:

Seriously - reading those reviews and then watching your videos is like "Oh, of course." :lol:

Most people have indifferent or positive comments about dry traction, so even if they're not good in dry weather, at least they'll be reasonably controllable!

[Phil_SS]

:lol:

I actually have some bit of fear for you Carlo. Those tires plus a less compliant suspension could lead to not a good ending. Be safe out there.

[novicius]

Noted, I'll keep it low-key on the road. :toast:

[novicius]

Per Russ' recommendations, I saved the Falken Azenis RT615K+ in 255/40R17 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?&tireMake=Falken&tireModel=Azenis+RT615K%2B&partnum=54WR7RT615KP&i1_Qty=4&i1_Qty=4&autoMake=Ford&autoModel=Mustang+GT&autoYear=2002&autoModClar=&vehicleSearch=true) to my TireRack.com account. :up:

Current plan is to order a set this winter for next Spring.

[GB]

How was your weekend? :)

I went to a Track Weekend at Roebling Road, was about the 3rd slowest person there out of 100 drivers, developed a misfire, and roasted my catalytic converter.

Thanks for asking! :toast:

[novicius]

I was with you in spirit GB! :lol: :up: #miserylovescompany

[Godson]

Dude. That sucks.

[CudaMan]

Carlo, at my first autox I was the second slowest driver. Onward and upward from here!

You got out there and learned, which is more than anyone who didn't show up. It's a unique skill set, autox. It takes everyone time to learn it. Also that site has some hazards close to the course so it's more nerve-wracking than most autox events.

The spin looks like a result of shocking the rear tires from engaging the clutch 'spiritedly' in 2nd gear. Easy to do in the wet, regardless of tire, but based on the discussion here probably those tires needed an extra gentle shift. Most autox courses are 2nd gear affairs after the start; even if it feels slower you have more control as you found out. And that V8 has plenty of low end grunt. :)

And for what it's worth, those course markings are confusing even to me.

I see you discovered the joy of lowering your car. ;) *scraaape*

Another tire alternative - cheaper and more available than RT615K+: Nexen N'Fera SUR4 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Nexen&tireModel=N+FERA+SUR4&partnum=54YR7SUR4&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes). Not as OMGsticky as the SUR4G compound, but long lasting for the grip they have so they should be a good value for the developing driver. :up: Not for use in freezing temps or snow, though, like any tire of its kind.

Go forth and enjoy. Go for ride-alongs if you can. Accelerates the learning curve and adds to the fun.

[novicius]

Yeah I shocked the hell out of the tires! :lol:

Thanks Cuda -- the course was initially confusing and I did blow a few gates. But by the end leaving the car in 2nd and just focusing on being smooth I was able to put a few complete (slow) laps together.

When I'm ready to buy some tires I will check out the SUR4's, thank you for the rec! :up: :up:


EDIT: conventional Mustang groupthink is listing 17x9's wheels with 275/40R17s square as a good meaty setup with only a hint of rubbing at full lock.

While some guys max out at 17x10.5 with 315/35/17 in the back for maximum ego, I will be keeping it square at 17x9's all around eventually. :hard:

[novicius]

I got into the local Autocrosser's School for this Sunday finally. :up: :up:

I had sent the Steward texts, emails, phone calls, had other people text him, etc -- over the course of the past month. What a... frustrating time I had. :)

Ah well, onward. #raceyourownrace

[novicius]

This Saturday I'm heading to Kelly Moss Motorsports (http://www.kellymossmotorsports.com/) for an autocross club dyno day.

It is gonna be high-larious to put the barking/snapping/growling Bananastang on their rollers and punch out an ALMIGHTY 190ish RWD. :lol: #roar

Here's a sample of the caliber of the vehicles KMR is used to dealing with:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4163/33796027724_e22407d063_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4166/34476815872_df1a14b835_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4160/34503151081_7086773e0a_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4158/34253505150_198833563a_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4168/34253510850_93bff5262c_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4177/34476845932_228018fdda_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4185/33796064574_258946c426_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4179/33796028014_50ca287cb3_b.jpg

I snapped these shots at the local tech school car show last weekend and KMR happened to be there. :up:

[Godson]

Funny, my s2000 had as much power as a mustang. And less than half the displacement and half the cylinders....

[thesameguy]

And half the torque!

And about the same fuel economy. womp womp

[CudaMan]

Cable operated pop-up headlights on the 914?

Its seats are glorious.

[Godson]

S2000 can pull 31mpg.....

[Cam]

...and a 5 litre Mustang can get 36! (https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-news/ford-mustang-v8-wins-fuel-economy-challenge) ;)

[thesameguy]

I'm sure a Mustang GT can too under similar conditions. The EPA rated mileage is similar, and that's the only objective economy test we've got!

[Godson]

...and a 5 litre Mustang can get 36! (https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-news/ford-mustang-v8-wins-fuel-economy-challenge) ;)

That's a new body!

The 4.6 would be lucky to hit 26

[Godson]

Fuelly shows the highest recorded mileage for an 01 mustang 4.6 is 24mpg.

01 s2000 has several reding 30.

Average mpg of the v8 is in the mid teens. S2000 is 24.

[Cam]

I have no doubt that I can make my Forester get 10 mpg or 40. :rolleyes:

[thesameguy]

Fuelly shows the highest recorded mileage for an 01 mustang 4.6 is 24mpg.

01 s2000 has several reding 30.

Average mpg of the v8 is in the mid teens. S2000 is 24.

... but shows the highest for a "V8 gas" is 34. Soooo... you gotta check all the boxes. :)

2393

[Godson]

I clicked it, but I excluded it because 1 person had 5700 miles in less than a month, and put as little as 1.8 gallons of fuel in the vehicle, then proceeded to put 20 gallons on the car a few days later. Those miles are indicative of a person doing a cross country trek, but the fillups don't make sense unless it's Docksyde.

This one person also consistently pull 30mpg when nobody else out of others of similar years has. It seriously doesn't add up.

[Godson]

I'm all ok for being wrong, but having owned one, and driven countless of the others. Ain't no way a 4.6 Ford Mustang pulling 30mpg unless you are hypermilling like a mofo.

[thesameguy]

That's why I tend to rely on EPA number for comparative purposes. They may not reflect real driving, but they are repeatable, reliable numbers that are rarely that far off. Like Cam said, you can get high numbers out of any car if you try - I got a documented 38mpg in my Saab 9000 driving to Portland and Mexico, but I wouldn't suggest it's typical.

[Godson]

I completely disagree.

I'll fall back on the s2000, when the community is consistently netting 22-24mpg in mixed driving, with pretty commonly hitting low 30s in mileage, and another isn't, but is rated at the same, the system isn't accurate. 15-20% off is a large amount. Out of all the driving the s2000, I never once saw 19mpg living in the city and autocross on same tank with 3 drivers. That tank was the worst at 21mpg.


The ecoboost Ford's are another. Rated for much higher than you can get, hypermilling included.

EPA is just an estimate. Usually not correct.

[Random]

It's an estimate, but it's an estimate based on testing.

The main issue with the testing is that it's done on rollers, not roads, so (among other things) aero doesn't come into play. :rolleyes:

[novicius]

Well KMR didn't happen -- I went to my usual quickie oil change places and while the work they did is fine, they peeked at the coolant... which caused my leaking intake to burp... which poured leaking coolant into the coil-on-plug-system (COPS) on the driver's side of the engine, producing a wicked misfire. :smh:

It's not the quickie oil jockeys fault but just bad luck. I hope the spark plug chamber dries out overnight without having burned out the COPS unit. Ah well, it's only money, right? :rolleyes:

[Yeti]

Is the leaking intake something you've mentioned before? I don't remember that being one of the Banana's issues.

[novicius]

Yep-yep -- leaking intake coolant gasket, leaking head gasket, leaking timing chain cover, leaking oil pan gasket. All manageable and I'll tackle them this winter, just bad timing with the coolant-into-COPS leak. #shrug

I will let the car sit after tomorrow to dry out but I'll be taking it easy at the Autox School first.

[thesameguy]

I think the universe is telling you to quietly get to work on a 5.4l.

[novicius]

Yaaassss! :lol: :up:

So misfire & all, I cleaned out the Bananastang and rolled slowly out to Jefferson Speedway yesterday morn. Like I couldn't even use fifth gear, it would lug and shudder so bad on the highway! :lol: #roadkill

4th gear all the way to keep the revs up at 2+ K and smooth out the engine as much as possible. Should I have been driving it to a driving school? Nope -- but I bitched so much about this event that I would've shown up in my Mama's Grand Prix if I'd had to. In retrospect I probably should have. :finger:

Some 30 drivers showed up, give or take. Lots of nice cars: 370Z's, Bimmers, Miatas, a Fiata, a turbo Miata, and a '13 Camaro SS 1LE on 200TW tires -- and then the Bananastang with a chest cold.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4251/33998399493_42d84c4baa_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4191/34675468951_a62f5f46b4_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4168/34422068810_3cb6349074_b.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4194/34768083066_c0169925ca_b.jpg

Good stuff. :up: :up: