Politics

[LHutton]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8645/16044251578_e31ca7501e_o.jpg

[Crazed_Insanity]

Proof that hatred begets hatred.

It's obvious that thou should not kill.

However, if you insist on making fun of and disrespect the crazy fundies, you really should make sure that your office is inside some sort of maximum security vault. They've even been fired bombed before! How can they be so careless? You're dealing with crazy people here. Even if Islam doesn't exist, I'm sure crazy Christian could also cause such tragedy if they continually draw up cartoons disrespecting Jesus. Anyway, just continually draw up cartoons disrespecting something or someone that some people love dearly, surely some crazy reaction will turn up.

Yeah, you'd rather die standing than live on your knees by continuing to exercise your right to free speech, but now you're dead and I don't see Islam going away anytime soon.

For future aspiring cartoonist who wants to fight the extremists with his pen, make sure you take sufficient precautions. Don't let the nutcases find you!

[21Kid]

:lol: Awesome headline.

GOP Begins Assault on Elderly, Poor, Disabled, Math, and Reason (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-zombeck/gop-begins-assault-on-eld_b_6436640.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592)

[thesameguy]

Well, that's a lie. The assault on the poor, math, and reason started years and years ago. They've just added the elderly and the disabled to the list is all.

[thesameguy]

Thanks for posting that. Now I'm afraid of everything again.

[FaultyMario]

A summary of all my posts (http://www.theonion.com/articles/raped-environment-led-polluters-on-defense-attorne,817/)

I agree!

[overpowered]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/16812_1031542503539063_3927066386189083914_n.jpg?o h=3f0bbd4127ffdb116227c20e6b57da50&oe=552E8E67&__gda__=1428445594_c1f877fb35050ceec4cfa9278de4da8 2

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS0lz7jKJaM

[overpowered]

Bomb explodes outside NAACP building in Colorado Springs

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/07/us-usa-naacp-explosion-idUSKBN0KF1WM20150107

[Crazed_Insanity]

I agree!

Dude, com'on. Forest didn't pen any disrespectful cartoons nor did it dress up like a whore. It's just sitting there and didn't do anything. So it absolutely shared 0% of the fault.

As for murderers, rapists or whatever criminals who engages in hurtful crimes, they will always share more than 50% of the fault. I'm certainly not trying to say that those cartoonists asked for it.

However, one can always insist that you can leave your purse or ipad in your parked car in plain sight as your God given right to do so..., but due to human nature, chances are high that you'll return to your car with your personal belongings missing and with a broken window. Did you ask for it? No, of course nobody's asking for bad things to happen to us, but one's gotta use one's brain and try to prevent this type of things from happening in the 1st place.

[21Kid]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS0lz7jKJaM
<3

[21Kid]

Bomb explodes outside NAACP building in Colorado Springs

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/07/us-usa-naacp-explosion-idUSKBN0KF1WM20150107

http://40.media.tumblr.com/c07376397820c071112b06dd3d76b076/tumblr_nhtqa3jt7x1ql6jblo1_1280.jpg

[FaultyMario]

As for murderers, rapists or whatever criminals who engages in hurtful crimes, they will always share more than 50% of the fault.

Your honor, members of the jury, I rest my case.

[Crazed_Insanity]

What exactly is your case?

[LHutton]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/16812_1031542503539063_3927066386189083914_n.jpg?o h=3f0bbd4127ffdb116227c20e6b57da50&oe=552E8E67&__gda__=1428445594_c1f877fb35050ceec4cfa9278de4da8 2
I'm fundamentally impressed that a person stupid enough to write that even knew that 'fascist' had a 'c' in it.

[21Kid]

Your honor, members of the jury, I rest my case.

If anyone ever should plead the 5th, it would be Billi.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Am I being arrested or charged with something?

[overpowered]

Phyllis Schlafly: Campus sex assault is on the rise because too many women go to college

http://www.salon.com/2015/01/06/phyllis_schlafly_campus_sex_assault_is_on_the_rise _because_too_many_women_go_to_college/

[overpowered]

George Zimmerman arrested:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/george-zimmerman-arrested-aggravated-assault-charge-28133121

[overpowered]

Fun with open carry in Texas:

http://conservativetribune.com/armed-gangs-black-panthers/

[Freude am Fahren]

I honestly couldn't tell if that was legit or satire.

[overpowered]

According to realorsatire.com, it's real.

http://realorsatire.com/conservativetribune-com/

[LHutton]

George Zimmerman arrested:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/george-zimmerman-arrested-aggravated-assault-charge-28133121
It's almost like a comedy now. Not content with getting away with murder, he's intent on making sure everybody knows the verdict was wrong.

[speedpimp]

That fucking idiot is going to kill another person and this time his ass will fucking fry.

[MR2 Fan]

I need some popcorn, this is good:

https://twitter.com/hashtag/foxnewsfacts?src=tren

This screencap is especially entertaining

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B7J1b-vIIAA1Zyi.jpg:large

I'm glad the tide is turning against Fox News, in some places at least.

[Freude am Fahren]

It's always an intern...

[LHutton]

The great thing is that David Milliband isn't even the deputy leader, he's the leader of the opposition. Nick Clegg is the Deputy Prime Minister. So in pointing out the mistake, they made another.

[Kchrpm]

That's a parody account.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/the-foxnewspress-account-tweeting-lawsuit-threats-is-a-fake/

[thesameguy]

Great few days for Twitter... Aziz Ansari has started his own ruckus @rupertmudoch

http://www.buzzfeed.com/rossalynwarren/murdoch-probably-doesnt-even-know-who-ginuwine-is#.td9Ny4ZN2w

[LHutton]

Apparently 'the whole' of Birmingham (UK) is Muslim and a no-go area for non-Muslims, according to an 'expert'.:lol:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/fox-news-mocked-after-expert-says-birmingham-is-totally-muslim-9971378.html


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwq8Bwr9wUg

[speedpimp]

That guy looks like the Fox News version of an Oompaloompa.

[LHutton]

:lol:



That fucking idiot is going to kill another person and this time his ass will fucking fry.
His track record is very impressive, two domestic abuse incidents and a road rage incident in the last 6 months alone.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/george-zimmerman-life-after-shooting

[speedpimp]

Don't forget the time he played Good Samaritan and saved a family after a nasty accident. What's not widely known is that he shot out one of their tires.

[overpowered]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10931143_801609913210040_325087257196589367_n.jpg? oh=3cc508b6f25804c62dff6c955d0cc602&oe=5532B462&__gda__=1428816939_84fb9c5070b085e832f22ac46bec6c6 1

[21Kid]

They are just trolling on purpose. :(


Ted Cruz takes over Senate Science and Space Subcommittee overseeing NASA

[Rikadyn]

Somebody needs to go Ferdinand on them...

[LHutton]

Don't forget the time he played Good Samaritan and saved a family after a nasty accident. What's not widely known is that he shot out one of their tires.
Really?

[speedpimp]

Here. (http://gawker.com/family-saved-by-george-zimmerman-afraid-to-be-associat-897321026) I was just joking about the shooting the tire out though.

[Crazed_Insanity]

He really should become a police officer. Probably missed his true calling that's why he's now so frustrated and doesn't know what to do with his life...

[speedpimp]

More than likely he can't pass the psych exams to become a cop.

[21Kid]

Who is CNN polling? Do most Americans really think this way?!?


Poll (http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/15/politics/poll-majority-of-americans-back-keystone-pipeline/index.html): Majority of Americans back Keystone pipeline. The 1,179-mile Canada-to-Texas pipeline is backed by 57% of the 1,011 Americans surveyed on Dec. 18-21. Just 28% oppose it, while 15% say they are unsure.

CNN surveyed Americans on several other hot policy issues. Here are some of the key findings:

GLOBAL WARMING: A majority of those polled, at 57%, say global warming will not pose a serious threat to their way of life, while just 43% expect global warming to threaten them. Meanwhile, only 50% of Americans believe global warming is caused by man-made emissions, while 23% say it's caused by natural changes and 26% say it isn't a proven fact.
OBAMACARE: Forty-six percent of Americans would still like to see Obama's signature health care law repealed and replaced -- though even more favor keeping it in place or expanding government's role in health care. Twenty-one percent say they'd like to leave the bill as it is, while 30% say they prefer increasing government involvement.
WATERBOARDING: Sixty-six percent of those polled say the United States should use waterboarding as it interrogates suspected terrorists, while 34% say it should not. At 71%, more men favor the tactic than women, who were at 60%. And while 70% of those under 50 years of age favor the tactic, just 60% of those over 50 support its use.
SAME-SEX MARRIAGE: Fifty-seven percent of Americans now say gays and lesbians have a constitutional right to get married, while just 41% disagree. At 60%, even more people say marriages between same-sex couples should be recognized as valid. That number has ticked upward in CNN/ORC polls from 44% in 2008.
At least that last one is encouraging. But, is this really how most people think? :?

[Crazed_Insanity]

Who cares about what stupid Americans think.

I find this mind boggling: http://news.yahoo.com/congress-moves-toward-easing-bank-wall-street-rules-083625057--finance.html

Loosening regulations on the evil bankers can be done so swiftly in the House. America is doomed. I guess stupid people elect stupid politicians.

I guess the saddest thing is that the rest of the world also buys into our crazy investments and our fiat currency. The end is near.

[LHutton]

^So when's the next one? 2020-2025 sounds about right for another big old economic clusterclown.

[Yw-slayer]

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30829917

[thesameguy]

Somehow I hope this adversely affects Nestle.

[Yw-slayer]

You hatez da Clooney?

[LHutton]

LOL. You get negative interest when you hold Swiss Francs.


It also cut a key interest rate from -0.25% to -0.75%, raising the amount investors pay to hold Swiss deposits.

The Milky Bar Kid will be skint.

[overpowered]

http://www.newscorpse.com/Pix/FoxNews/terrorist-color-chart.jpg

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=24478

[21Kid]

:smh: Sooooooo wrong.

:|

:lol:

[overpowered]

When we get Keystone, we can have even bigger oil spills. Yeah!

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2015/01/19/3612952/montana-yellowstone-river-oil-spill/

[LHutton]

So eating while driving.

https://gma.yahoo.com/man-gets-ticket-driving-while-eating-cheeseburger-190930891--abc-news-Recipes.html


Man Gets Ticket for Driving While Eating a Cheeseburger

Driver seems shocked. In the UK it's pretty much normal.

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcWm4qQaPpE

[overpowered]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10926389_1073299956030410_7635222057318534938_n.pn g?oh=b58bb48b89a79a56cf2819ad21e08cff&oe=5569ABC0&__gda__=1428920907_88d0d97d73d5c3a92e6826cb758bc7f 3

[TheBenior]

:lol:

[LHutton]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/03/flip-off-police_n_2403563.html


Flipping Off Police Officers Constitutional, Federal Court Affirms

Can't say I agree with this decision. It's pointlessly insulting.

[JoshInKC]

So you think being pointlessly insulting is (or should be) unconstitutional?
Thats a pretty weird stance to take.

[Tom Servo]

Yeah, that's a really weird stance. That's basically saying "I'm all about the First Amendment, unless I personally don't get the point or just don't think it's necessary, then no free speech for you."

I personally think that all of those "Scary Movie/Date Movie" movies are pointlessly insulting, but they're not unconstitutional.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Flipping the bird at US police officers nowadays is probably comparable to yelling fire in a packed theater when there's actually no fire. Somebody could lose their lives unnecessarily.

Anyway, right to free speech or right to remain silent? Which one trumps the other one? Tough call.

Whatever. It's pretty sad that taxpayer money had to be used to decide on this...

[LHutton]

So you think being pointlessly insulting is (or should be) unconstitutional?
Thats a pretty weird stance to take.
I don't see pointless abuse as free speech or expression. Would you really be happy to walk down the street with your family and be randomly abused by gangs, with police simply overlooking the situation?

It's not that I don't get the point, there simply is no point in this case. If I walk or drive past a policeman and give them the bird for no reason, then where is the point? Maybe if I'm part of a protest movement then there's more logic but random abuse wasn't what The Constitution had in mind.

And Billy does actually make a valid point above, although I'm not sure the two are really equivalent, but yeah, yelling 'fire' or phoning in a bomb hoax, is that free speech/expression? How about phoning the fire brigade and reporting hoax fires, or reporting hoax murders to the police? Absolute freedom of speech just turns into Planet of The Apes, and there are sensible limits. Just as a 'free' market needs regulation, so does 'free' speech. Without some regulation both are jeopardised.

[speedpimp]

Yelling Fire in a crowded theater creates panic. Flipping off a cop does not, although its a pretty stupid thing to do. Now if you yell "I hope you get shot" while flipping the cop off is a whore of a different color.

[LHutton]

What message or point does a finger convey? "Fuck you"? Are you going to fuck them? Are you hoping they get fucked up, e.g. "I hope you get shot"? I think we can sensibly protest any conceivable political or civil rights issue without using the middle finger.

Panic? Just a form of distress. If a cop, or anyone else, has 1,000 wise-arses per day flipping them off and hurling abuse, doesn't that cause distress? The only purpose of a flipping someone off is to cause annoyance, harassment and distress.

Public nudity? Freedom of expression?

[thesameguy]

Here's a question: If you can flip off a cop, can you also throw gang signs at them? Because I got pulled over for that. Sounds like my rights were violated.

[Crazed_Insanity]

You're gonna have to ask a federal judge and waste taxpayers money to get your question answered.

Logically speaking, what difference does it make whether if it's a bird or gang sign? Might as well pretend we're holding a gun and pretend to shoot at the cops. I'm sure constitution protects us for that. Not even really showing real "arms" there... If I want to express myself with my fake hand gestured gun, I should be protected no matter how stupid I am.

[thesameguy]

Probably true.

As much as I like free speech, I kinda feel like this should have gone the other way. Cops have to endure a lot. Adding insult and ridicule to the list kinda sucks. Maybe if people showed some respect, they might receive some as well.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Seriously, I think it's a tough call. I'm not sure how I'd rule if I were the judge. Probably toss it out so that I can spend time on more important issues.

If push comes to shove, I guess I'd rule bird flipping protected by free speech as well. If I do it to the president, secret service shouldn't be on my back. If I do it to fire fighters, they shouldn't come burn my house down or refuse to fight for my house when my house caught on fire...

When one deliberately provokes the enforcer of laws for no particular reason while violating no laws whatsoever, I guess police should also be able to flip the bird back and hopefully that'll cause road rage to happen and then some how cause the person to violate some sort of traffic laws... then perhaps he can be pulled over and have his butt probed.

Uncivilized behaviors really shouldn't be protected, but I guess it's difficult for all of us to agree on what is uncivilized. Some people in other cultures do point things out using middle fingers... my father in law does that. I certainly wouldn't want him to be arrested just because of the use of the middle finger... ;)

[thesameguy]

That's how it ends up working in GTA. Maybe a lesson to be learned there. :P

[overpowered]

Not the Onion.

U.S. Senate set to vote on whether climate change is a hoax
http://news.sciencemag.org/climate/2015/01/updated-u-s-senate-set-vote-whether-climate-change-hoax

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slNMObuRcHk

[Freude am Fahren]

:lol:

Would have been even better if they said FOX "NEWS"

[MR2 Fan]

I've heard Shephard Smith is one of the more moderate people on Fox....having said that, does he look like he's nearly a cross-dresser with how much makeup he has on?

[21Kid]

I mean it's pretty clear that isn't not a "news" channel any more... if it ever was.

[overpowered]

Sen. Joni Ernst’s family actually received more than $460,000 in federal subsidies

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/sen-joni-ernsts-family-actually-received-more-than-460000-in-federal-subsidies/

[overpowered]

Blogger who uncovered GOP leader's white supremacist ties had home Internet lines cut

http://www.dailydot.com/politics/lamar-white-cable-cut-steve-scalise/

[overpowered]

https://scontent-a-lax.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/10933888_806248472746184_8953691626982984184_n.jpg ?oh=7716befbcac34912231135a96a81c601&oe=55240A8D

[21Kid]

NEW ORLEANS (Reuters) - Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal, a potential 2016 presidential candidate, was criticized on Wednesday by his state's two largest newspapers over contentious remarks referring to Muslim-controlled "no-go zone" areas in European cities.

Jindal, a Republican who is courting evangelical Christians and other conservatives ahead of a possible run for the White House, defended his comments about neighborhoods in Europe he said were under the effective control of "non-assimilationist Muslims" as accurate.

"You can call them whatever term you want but absolutely there are neighborhoods where we have communities of people that don't want to integrate, don't want to assimilate," he said in a Wednesday interview on Fox News. "They're actually going in there to colonize, to overtake the culture. That's what's going to happen in America if we're not careful." :erm: wow.

[thesameguy]

Wow, can you imagine if a bunch of people from another place came to North America and displaced the people living there and/or supplanted the existing culture with new? That would be totally crazy!

[speedpimp]

Makes you wonder that since Jindal is the son of Indian immigrants, how many people look at him with a suspicious eye just because of his skin tone?

[George]

Wow, can you imagine if a bunch of people from another place came to North America and displaced the people living there and/or supplanted the existing culture with new? That would be totally crazy!

I just heard this song this morning for the first time in ages...

Run To The Hills on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZlDZPYzfm4)

[JoshInKC]

Wow, can you imagine if a bunch of people from another place came to North America and displaced the people living there and/or supplanted the existing culture with new? That would be totally crazy!
QFMFT!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Hey, gotta learn the lesson from Pocahontas, right?

[21Kid]

Rather than retreat from the massive tax cuts that are crippling his state’s finances, Gov. Sam Brownback (R) wants to cut classroom funding for Kansas schools by $127 million and push pension fund payments off into the future.
The defining characteristic of the governor’s various proposals for fixing the nearly billion-dollar deficit is that they will create larger problems down the road. The proposed budget would replace the state’s current financing formula for schools with block grants that districts could use as they see fit. But that flexibility masks a significant cut in classroom resources for a state that has already been accused by judges of falling hundreds of millions of dollars short of the bare-minimum level of education funding required by the Kansas Constitution.

Is he trying to destroy his state? I really can't tell. :erm:

[neanderthal]

Were we discussing World War II (http://io9.com/10-shocking-ways-the-second-world-war-could-have-ended-1558135375) here? I forgot.

Where Billi was saying undoubtedly, the US entry into the war was the main reason we beat the Axis powers.

[neanderthal]

Rather than retreat from the massive tax cuts that are crippling his state’s finances, Gov. Sam Brownback (R) wants to cut classroom funding for Kansas schools by $127 million and push pension fund payments off into the future.
The defining characteristic of the governor’s various proposals for fixing the nearly billion-dollar deficit is that they will create larger problems down the road. The proposed budget would replace the state’s current financing formula for schools with block grants that districts could use as they see fit. But that flexibility masks a significant cut in classroom resources for a state that has already been accused by judges of falling hundreds of millions of dollars short of the bare-minimum level of education funding required by the Kansas Constitution.


Is he trying to destroy his state? I really can't tell. :erm:

Doubling down on stupid.

We have taxes for a reason. Taxes get shit done. Maybe not the most efficiently, but they get the ugly stuff done that makes society function better. This notion that taxes are basically evil and nothing more than a big government reach into your pocket is a false flag, implemented by people who are looking to take over some of those same dull mundane government functions, in order to raise prices. When Kansas no longer functions, the first thing they will say is "look, government is inept. They can't educate the kids, keep basic safety, maintain the roads, etc. We need to privatise it."

Which means all the money that goes to education, police and fire depts, parks, maintenance, etc, ends up going to private entities, who are going to implement pay to play, which will punish the poor who won't be able to pay, and just make the whole society much worse.

I'm glad I live in Commifornia although I could probably afford to buy a house in Kansas. Here in So Cal it's hilarious what real estate is going for.

[thesameguy]

I'm glad I live in Commifornia although I could probably afford to buy a house in Kansas. Here in So Cal it's hilarious what real estate is going for.

I was looking into the possibility of helping the gf's mom out and maybe buying a place in her neighborhood that she could live in for little or nothing. Her ghetto house in a neighborhood I would *never* live in is worth somewhere between $350k and $500k. The cheapest place in a 10 mile radius is an 800 sq ft townhouse in a development that hasn't been rehabbed in 20 years for $236k. :down:

[JoshInKC]

Is he trying to destroy his state? I really can't tell. :erm:

As far as most people here can tell- Yes, that's exactly what he's trying to do.

The past several months here have been bonkers. The lead up to the 2014 election was pretty crazy, with polls indicating that both he and Sen. Pat Roberts might very well go down in flames. People, including some deeply conservative ones, were saying that he was taking everything way too far. This included dozens of prominent republicans, and a few organizations with "republican" in their names that endorsed brownback's democrat opponent.
Then election day came and shocked the hell out of everybody who paid any attention. In both the gubernatorial and senatorial races, the polls turned out to be off in the double digits. Brownback (and Kris Kobach, his Secretary of State/aide decamp) have taken this as a mandate(which it arguably is, although one should consider the state Democratic party's complete incompetence), and are doing their best to get as radical as humanly possible.
It's not pleasant.

[MR2 Fan]

Then there's this gem

Republican Senator decides he is above the law when facing DUI charges.

http://www.lex18.com/story/27919989/senators-lawyer-delays-dui-case-argues-privileged-from-arrest

[neanderthal]

Good explanation Josh.

[neanderthal]

I was looking into the possibility of helping the gf's mom out and maybe buying a place in her neighborhood that she could live in for little or nothing. Her ghetto house in a neighborhood I would *never* live in is worth somewhere between $350k and $500k. The cheapest place in a 10 mile radius is an 800 sq ft townhouse in a development that hasn't been rehabbed in 20 years for $236k. :down:

Welcome to Southern California. :(

I can move to Phoenix or just about anywhere outside of So Cal, Bay Area, Boston, Chicago, New York, and buy a house outright with a small (well, a significant!) withdrawal from my 401K.

Real estate here is stupid.
It's cheaper for me to continue to rent and buy a rental property than to try and buy my own home where I live. Median property price in Northridge Ca, $631000 and trending up.
North Hills, right next door; $461000
Chatsworth, $533000 etc etc etc

It's just disgusting.

For half a million dollars, I expect an acre of land, a swimming pool, a tennis/ basketball court and a safe neighbourhood.

[overpowered]

John McCain: ‘Everything I’ve predicted … has come true’

except for the fact that it hasn't, at all.

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/john-mccain-everything-ive-predicted-has-come-true

[TheBenior]

For half a million dollars, I expect an acre of land, a swimming pool, a tennis/ basketball court and a safe neighbourhood.
Yeah, though Chicago can be expensive if you don't want to live somewhere where gunshots are regular occurrence, there is a lot of variety.

Hell, my 1300sq ft house built in 1959 that's had some updating over the years was $250k, in a rather suburban area of Chicago that happens to be the lowest crime zip code in the city limits. Mine's on a main street however, so similar houses on side streets typically go for $275-325k.

My parent's house in a former working class and now totally gentrified neighborhood would erupt into a bidding war in a day if they listed it at $500k. Meanwhile, there's a similar house decked out with luxury finishes listed for $1.1M a couple blocks away.

Meanwhile, plenty of houses on the South and West sides are worth considerably less than it would cost to re-build them, similar to what you'd get in Detroit, but not quite that bad.

[JoshInKC]

Good explanation Josh.
Thank you.
In just the past 2 weeks (budget proposal, inauguration, state of the state address, and new state legislature session began) there have been some really fun developments:

Brownback said (paraphrased) "Kansas would be a utopia, if it wasn't immorality(gays)."
Proposed a 190% increase in sin taxes to cover the massive budget shortfall.
Proposed eliminating the home mortgage tax deduction.
Proposed a plan to completely revamp how the state supreme court justices are appointed - Basically, this could amount to him saying "Sure, he doesn't have a law degree or anything, but my landscaper agrees with me on most stuff, put him on the supreme court." And then not being required to submit another candidate if the first is rejected. (This is due to the fact that the supreme court made several decisions he doesn't agree with- education funding, gay marriage, next item on list.
Kobach (SecState, asshole)'s first move is to try to rewrite election laws so they won't have any trouble with independent candidates again. (In the senatorial race last year, an indedendent ran and put up some good numbers. The democrat candidate dropped out of the race (because he had no chance) and Kobach spent several million dollars of the state's money to try to force him onto the ballot in hopes of splitting the vote.)
And finally, the state legislature will be debating a bill that eliminates any need for permit or training classes to carry a concealed firearm.

I'm kind of surprised that grinding up the state highway system and selling it as gravel hasn't been proposed.

Wild and wacky times. Assuming I'm still here in 4 years, will I be living in some sort of religious/Somalia/Mad Max dystopia? It's anybody's guess.

[Jason]

Re: Kansas... let me guess, he's one of those guys that rails on how evil government is, and that the services it provides always fail?

I really despise these guys. They do everything in their power to undermine services, they basically destroy any quality involved, then they turn around and say "see, government sucks! told you! vote for me again!" The masses stupidly see it and go, "yeah, government is kind of broken, this guy's right."

[thesameguy]

Wild and wacky times. Assuming I'm still here in 4 years, will I be living in some sort of religious/Somalia/Mad Max dystopia? It's anybody's guess.

If so, XB Falcons are legal under the 25 year rule, so you might want to look into that.

[LHutton]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW1JdOXdJkU

[21Kid]

Sarah Palin's Bizarre Iowa Speech (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/25/sarah-palin-iowa-speech_n_6543762.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592)

Shortly after declaring that she's "seriously interested" in running for president in 2016, Sarah Palin delivered a confusing speech that was panned by many, even some on the right.

"Things must change for our government. Look at it. It isn’t too big to fail. It’s too big to succeed! It's too big to succeed, so we can afford no retreads or nothing will change with the same people and same policies that got us into the status quo. Another Latin word, status quo, and it stands for, ‘Man, the middle-class everyday Americans are really gettin’ taken for a ride.’ That's status quo, and GOP leaders, by the way, y'know the man can only ride ya when your back is bent. So strengthen it. Then the man can't ride ya, America won't be taken for a ride, because so much is at stake and we can't afford politicians playing games like nothing more is at stake than, oh, maybe just the next standing of theirs in the next election."


Palin also referred to President Barack Obama as "an overgrown little boy." And in a clip posted online by Right Wing Watch, Palin attacked the left for being racist and sexist.
"Really, it's kind of Orwellian, observing how that works, that rule of Saul Alinsky's, no doubt, that the left employs. Disgusting charges, from the left. Reverse them -- for it is they who point a finger not realizing that they have triple that amount of fingers pointing right back at them, revealing that they are the ones who really discriminate and divide on color and class and sex. We call them out. We don’t let them get away with it.” :? OOOoookkk??? :erm:

[LHutton]

I've heard more sense from people with Tourette's mid-attack than Sarah Palin.

[thesameguy]

That is drug induced. It has to be. Dan Quayle at his worst made more sense than that. That doesn't even hold up grammatically!

[MR2 Fan]

It seems like she's just memorizing random quotes to sound edumacated

[LHutton]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/s480x480/10923234_10152541619725685_3827405954886263373_n.j pg?oh=53526558e6ebeae85f8734ee2d064c62&oe=556F66FA&__gda__=1432681537_4bc7eefa94ea012686ccf7f37640282 0

[overpowered]

I don't think that's completely fair. Chris Kyle was clearly a dick. I'm not disputing that, but he actually was on the front lines of the war. He was flawed to be sure, but he also put his life on the line for his country.

Not everything is as black and white as we would like.

[LHutton]

I think he certainly intended to put his life on the line for his country when he signed up, but that's not what he ended up doing, through no fault of his own. He ended up just taking part in an arbitrary foreign policy conflict 6,000 miles away that ended up costing several thousand American lives, <insert latest estimate> Iraqi lives, plunging the region into chaos and gifting an entirely new state to terrorists. The war on terror has been the greatest benefactor of terrorism in the whole of human history.

[overpowered]

You can't put that on one soldier, no matter who they are. You can put it on top level politicians who told us all a lot of lies to get the country to go along with the war. He was risking his life and he almost certainly thought he was protecting his country, in contradiction of the graphic.

[LHutton]

I did say, "through no fault of his own." The graphic does not address what he thought he was doing, only what he actually did. Of course you can't pin it on one person and that isn't the intention, the graphic is merely to draw a contrast.

[thesameguy]

The war on terror has been the greatest benefactor of terrorism in the whole of human history.

Not entirely unlike the war on drugs.

Weird, right?

[LHutton]

Not entirely unlike the war on drugs.

Weird, right?
True to a point, but Columbia has shown that even without drugs, the drug cartels continue with criminality. They've mainly moved into sex trafficking (often underage), kidnapping, people smuggling and other heinous shit now and the drugs have mainly moved to Mexico. They're the sort of problems that you can't legalise but pursuing their end too tenaciously is counter-productive and ineffective. I wouldn't say the war on drugs produced more drug dealers though (they just swapped around a lot), which is where the war on terror differs.

[thesameguy]

The US is a huge market for drugs, and aggressive law enforcement has resulted in increased resistance and increased prices which ultimately puts more money and more tools into the hands of the cartels - and like any organization of size the cartels have branched out into vertical markets. We saw the same behavior during Prohibition. The efforts against drugs have resulted in businesses being forced to grow to keep equilibrium - it's not like people are going to stop buying drugs any more than they stopped buying alcohol. In hindsight, it probably would have been better to work on establishing equilibrium pre-escalation - but of course law enforcement loved the big budgets and once it began escalation was inevitable. While it's possible that drug cartels could have been squashed and flamed out, it just seems really unlikely that was going to the result.

While it's certainly not the same process that caused anti-terrorism to lead to terrorism, I think the lessons are the same: Unless you are 100% confident you can win a fight quickly, you really need to think about what the long-term effects of a continual back-and-forth are going to be. "We" could someday win out against terrorists and "we" could someday win out against drugs, but is it likely in a reasonable period of time? What are the mid- and long-term effects of the fight? In both cases, it's ultimately the creation of a huge power vacuum that someone is going to fill...

[overpowered]

The Koch Attack on Solar Energy

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/27/opinion/sunday/the-koch-attack-on-solar-energy.html

[thesameguy]

:up:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/27/us/politics/kochs-plan-to-spend-900-million-on-2016-campaign.html?smid=pl-share


The political network overseen by the conservative billionaires Charles G. and David H. Koch plans to spend close to $900 million on the 2016 campaign, an unparalleled effort by coordinated outside groups to shape a presidential election that is already on track to be the most expensive in history.

The spending goal, revealed Monday at the Kochs’ annual winter donor retreat near Palm Springs, Calif., would allow their political organization to operate at the same financial scale as the Democratic and Republican Parties. It would require a significant financial commitment from the Kochs and roughly 300 other donors they have recruited over the years, and covers both the presidential and congressional races. In the last presidential election, the Republican National Committee and the party’s two congressional campaign committees spent a total of $657 million.

[LHutton]

The US is a huge market for drugs, and aggressive law enforcement has resulted in increased resistance and increased prices which ultimately puts more money and more tools into the hands of the cartels - and like any organization of size the cartels have branched out into vertical markets. We saw the same behavior during Prohibition. The efforts against drugs have resulted in businesses being forced to grow to keep equilibrium - it's not like people are going to stop buying drugs any more than they stopped buying alcohol. In hindsight, it probably would have been better to work on establishing equilibrium pre-escalation - but of course law enforcement loved the big budgets and once it began escalation was inevitable. While it's possible that drug cartels could have been squashed and flamed out, it just seems really unlikely that was going to the result.

While it's certainly not the same process that caused anti-terrorism to lead to terrorism, I think the lessons are the same: Unless you are 100% confident you can win a fight quickly, you really need to think about what the long-term effects of a continual back-and-forth are going to be. "We" could someday win out against terrorists and "we" could someday win out against drugs, but is it likely in a reasonable period of time? What are the mid- and long-term effects of the fight? In both cases, it's ultimately the creation of a huge power vacuum that someone is going to fill...
Did it put more money in the hands of drug cartels? The reason the price went up was because it was costing more to produce and deliver, largely because people were getting arrested/shot and shipments were being seized. The overall profit didn't necessarily increase. If new recruits joined the drug gangs it was due to local poverty. Nobody said, "hey, look what America is doing, this is terrible, let's help these drug lords out." It was more a case of desperation and vacancies created by the war on drugs. Ultimately you can't win against drugs whilst there is still a market for it though, and the cost of fighting it often hasn't been worth it. Where there is demand without supply that represents a market opportunity. So whilst the war on drugs succeeded to a point in Columbia, it just sprung up elsewhere in Mexico when people spotted the opportunity. Drug running has moved from boat to plane to mule and finally to small submarines. It's just a problem that continues to move and mutate.

Why is there a market for drugs? Well that depends on the drugs but it's often been said that cocaine is nature's way of telling someone that they have too much money, which is particularly prevalent in the case of people in the financial sector, who persistently get away with other larger crimes like global financial fraud, with no legal response other than a pitiful fine on the parent company. Perhaps if some people started going to prison it would begin to fix two problems.

[LHutton]

:up:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/27/us/politics/kochs-plan-to-spend-900-million-on-2016-campaign.html?smid=pl-share
Oh that's gold, US opts out of UN FCCC and Emissions Trading Schemes, but taxes solar energy. Now I understand that solar panels cause problems on a grid that's designed for centralised power generation but ultimately that grid needs to be changed anyway because the future will necessarily involve more distributed power generation and grid interconnections lower down the distribution tree. Perhaps if they had adopted an ETS, that would have produced the funding for such changes from polluters instead of taxing individuals who are trying to produce clean energy.

[thesameguy]

Did it put more money in the hands of drug cartels?

It did, in the same way we ended up accidentally installing dictators in foreign countries. DEA (or whomever) makes deals with one group to help take out a competitor or one individual to take out another or they wipe a player off the board and they end up building one up while tearing one down. Instead of two small players, now you have one big one. Rinse and repeat for 30 years. Druggie Darwinism.


It's just a problem that continues to move and mutate.

Yes, and just like in your example where these guys once used old Chevys to move drugs, now they use subs and these capital investments are funded by their customers. When drug manufacturers have Chevys they really aren't in any position of power - lots of people have Chevys. But now they have boats, airplanes, and subs and suddenly they are in the position to do a lot more than just run drugs. Combined with the power vacuums we created in Step 1, we've created opportunity for a few to grow very large and have LOTS of tools. Of course they're going to use them.


Why is there a market for drugs?

Because people like drugs? People have liked drugs for thousands and thousands of years, before there was a financial sector or drug cartels. People wanna get high, people wanna feel different. We have a strong survival instinct and a strong recreation instinct - the two are often incompatible and drugs bridge the gap.


Perhaps if some people started going to prison it would begin to fix two problems.

It might. Or it might contribute to an already out of control prison industrial complex and just keep on feeding that financial sector. Perhaps a better approach is thoughtful legislation that not only gives people leeway in their lives, but also sets up guidelines with increasing punitive powers that act as warning signs along the route to self destruction. Maybe instead of waging war on people that wanna get high or people who got high, you wage war on people who wanted to get high, got high, and then actually broke a law that impacted someone else. As we saw 100 years ago, outlawing booze didn't work. Instead we've taxed it, regulated it, and created pretty stiff penalties for people who go too far. It's imperfect, but we don't have Rum Cartels and millions of people can enjoy a drink after work. It's a reasonable compromise.

[thesameguy]

Oh that's gold, US opts out of UN FCCC and Emissions Trading Schemes, but taxes solar energy. Now I understand that solar panels cause problems on a grid that's designed for centralised power generation but ultimately that grid needs to be changed anyway because the future will necessarily involve more distributed power generation and grid interconnections lower down the distribution tree. Perhaps if they had adopted an ETS, that would have produced the funding for such changes from polluters instead of taxing individuals who are trying to produce clean energy.

I have a deep hope that the Koch Brothers aren't evil and are just pushing this machine as hard and as fast as it will go until it's so obviously broken the people will demand reform.

Ha, yeah, right.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Look at it this way LHutton, American also declared war on alcohol once. Price of liquor for sure went up during those days and it also didn't really get Americans off alcohol. Once it's legalized, things weren't as out of whack. Of course alcoholics will continue to cause problems, whether its domestic abuses or drunk driving..., but overall cost to society is much less by NOT declaring war on alcohol.

I'm pretty sure same could be said for drugs or terror.

And considering the likes of Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden were creations of the CIA, I wouldn't be surprised to find out that our government has some sort of connections with the current terrorist groups.

Similar to Koch Brothers. Some of those shadowy rich and powerful folks might just be manipulating all of us behind the scenes so that they can keep more of their wealth and power... or scare us into giving them more of our money and freedom...

We really should revise our constitution a bit. Unless a war is of matter of our nation's survival... US government should defund and declare truce for all form of wars if it cannot be shockingly and awesomely won within 1 yr.

Any more of these long, costly wars..., surely we'll be bankrupt soon...

[LHutton]

That's because they legalised alcohol in the first place, hence creating a market that they then tried to dissolve overnight.

I don't think we should judge everything in terms of cost. It may well cost less to have no law at all but that wouldn't necessarily be a good thing.

[thesameguy]

I often wonder about what would actually happen if we let crazy countries do crazy things and simply not do anything about it. There's always that justification - "stop them before they come here" or "stop them before they unbalance the world" and I get that fear, but we managed to not fight the USSR for *decades* despite all that fear, and what happened? Eventually it just wasn't so bad anymore. I just can't see any unstable group rising to such power that they would simultaneously be willing to engage in all-out war with any 1st world country while actually having the resources to do it. I mean, once your country is big enough and strong enough to present a legitimate threat to, say, the US, are you still actually crazy enough to pick that fight? I don't think so - at that point you have things you need to protect, and a big war is gonna put all that in serious jeopardy, if not actual peril. Maybe on a global scale. I also don't think you can really use the WMD excuse very thoughtfully, either, because we all know were nukes get us leaving the *real* threat biological or chemical. And you really don't need to be all that well-funded or technologically advanced to excel in either arena. If we can be legitimately afraid of bunch of assholes hiding out in a barren desert *probably* by the time they're a legitimate country it's already well past too late - and then you circle right back into the "is some nutball with an actual functioning country really going to attack?"

Quite possibly, the answer is yes. Undeniable. But holeeeeeeee fuck the repercussions of that would be staggering. Staggering. If NK launched a nuke at the US we would glass that entire region over in *moments*. I really think the "best defense is a good offense" approach is, and probably never was, appropriate. I'm okay with building laser satellites and giant walls and stockpiling whatever it is we need to stockpile to feel safe (which is also probably not the right approach), but let's just fucking pull the troops home, stop meddling, and focus on managing our situation and not everyone else's. The "our way or the highway" attitude is bullshit and globally unwelcome. Maybe consider that it isn't, hasn't, and never will be successful.

[LHutton]

It might. Or it might contribute to an already out of control prison industrial complex and just keep on feeding that financial sector. Perhaps a better approach is thoughtful legislation that not only gives people leeway in their lives, but also sets up guidelines with increasing punitive powers that act as warning signs along the route to self destruction. Maybe instead of waging war on people that wanna get high or people who got high, you wage war on people who wanted to get high, got high, and then actually broke a law that impacted someone else. As we saw 100 years ago, outlawing booze didn't work. Instead we've taxed it, regulated it, and created pretty stiff penalties for people who go too far. It's imperfect, but we don't have Rum Cartels and millions of people can enjoy a drink after work. It's a reasonable compromise.
The rest I didn't respond to but financial fraud must be killed, regardless of drugs. Drug market reduction is just an added bonus.

[thesameguy]

That's because they legalised alcohol in the first place, hence creating a market that they then tried to dissolve overnight.

Historically untrue.

Alcohol and drugs were never explicitly legal, but since their widespread introduction and use were subsequently declared illegal. Coca Cola had cocaine, 7up had lithium citrate. Doctors prescribed weed well into the '30s. Now they're all controlled substances. It wasn't until the '20s-'40s that the US government truly actively involved in what people ingested, and it wasn't until the '70s and especially the '80s that the government started dramatically up-funding anti-drug activities.


I don't think we should judge everything in terms of cost. It may well cost less to have no law at all but that wouldn't necessarily be a good thing.

No law is probably a bad thing, but again, aggressive attempts to eradicate things people want is probably a bad thing too. Personal responsibility, legislative moderation, and reasonable penalties - compromise in the middle - sure seems to work better, as we've seen with alcohol.

[LHutton]

I often wonder about what would actually happen if we let crazy countries do crazy things and simply not do anything about it. There's always that justification - "stop them before they come here" or "stop them before they unbalance the world" and I get that fear, but we managed to not fight the USSR for *decades* despite all that fear, and what happened? Eventually it just wasn't so bad anymore. I just can't see any unstable group rising to such power that they would simultaneously be willing to engage in all-out war with any 1st world country while actually having the resources to do it. I mean, once your country is big enough and strong enough to present a legitimate threat to, say, the US, are you still actually crazy enough to pick that fight? I don't think so - at that point you have things you need to protect, and a big war is gonna put all that in serious jeopardy, if not actual peril. Maybe on a global scale. I also don't think you can really use the WMD excuse very thoughtfully, either, because we all know were nukes get us leaving the *real* threat biological or chemical. And you really don't need to be all that well-funded or technologically advanced to excel in either arena. If we can be legitimately afraid of bunch of assholes hiding out in a barren desert *probably* by the time they're a legitimate country it's already well past too late - and then you circle right back into the "is some nutball with an actual functioning country really going to attack?"

Quite possibly, the answer is yes. Undeniable. But holeeeeeeee fuck the repercussions of that would be staggering. Staggering. If NK launched a nuke at the US we would glass that entire region over in *moments*. I really think the "best defense is a good offense" approach is, and probably never was, appropriate. I'm okay with building laser satellites and giant walls and stockpiling whatever it is we need to stockpile to feel safe (which is also probably not the right approach), but let's just fucking pull the troops home, stop meddling, and focus on managing our situation and not everyone else's. The "our way or the highway" attitude is bullshit and globally unwelcome. Maybe consider that it isn't, hasn't, and never will be successful.

But I would point out that at this moment we don't have a well-proven ABM system capable of shooting down ICBM warheads and we should therefore not deliberately try to piss people, who are already assholes, off.

[LHutton]

Historically untrue.

Alcohol and drugs were never explicitly legal, but since their widespread introduction and use were subsequently declared illegal. Coca Cola had cocaine, 7up had lithium citrate. Doctors prescribed weed well into the '30s. Now they're all controlled substances. It wasn't until the '20s-'40s that the US government truly actively involved in what people ingested, and it wasn't until the '70s and especially the '80s that the government started dramatically up-funding anti-drug activities.



No law is probably a bad thing, but again, aggressive attempts to eradicate things people want is probably a bad thing too. Personal responsibility, legislative moderation, and reasonable penalties - compromise in the middle - sure seems to work better, as we've seen with alcohol.
If we could decide whether to legalise tobacco again, would we?

[thesameguy]

If we could decide whether to legalise tobacco again, would we?

Again, tobacco was never illegal and thus has never been legalized, either. The difference between tobacco, alcohol, and cocaine is that one of them was a ginormous cash crop that had a sufficient lobby to avoid ever being labeled a controlled substance. And for the same reason I think trying to wholly deprive people of things they want to do and demonstrate that they will take sometimes drastic steps to do them, I would not subject tobacco to any sort of ban.

[LHutton]

Even though it causes cancer?

[Crazed_Insanity]

If we could decide whether to legalise tobacco again, would we?

Tobacco isn't illegal like the so called illegal drugs.

We could use tobacco and alcohol as a guide. Allow legal sales of such substances, but have restrictions on their use. Such as no driving under the influence. No public smoking of marijuana or no public snorting or shooting up. Basically just have some decent common sense. Tax money also need to be saved and use for educational and rehabilitation purposes. If people want help to quit, help should also be available.

As a Christian, I can definitely be the judgmental one declaring what is right and what is wrong..., but another thing is clear... That is we can't use laws to ban things away. It won't work. If it works, Old Testament laws would be sufficient to guide humanity into utopia and there'd be no need for Jesus to come as a Savior. Seriouly, the more we try to ban whatever sins away, such sins will become more powerful in our lives. Of course I'm not promoting anarchy or lawlessness. We do need laws and regulations most of the time to ensure smoother operations, but any attempt to ban certain bad things away, you can count on it to fail miserably or spectacularly.

On a more theological level, is it a good idea to declare war on Satan? Nope. No way we can win against Satan by fighting him ourselves. I'd only fight him with God by my side. For those who are atheists, just substitute God with love. Are you fighting this thing/these people out of love or out of hatred? If you're fighting out of hatred for others, it'll surely fail. Sins cannot be banned away. Evils cannot be destroyed with hatred. Doing so, you're only feeding the other side.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Even though it causes cancer?

Sun light can cause cancer.

Not saying smoking is good for us, but reality is that there are also people who are very very old who smoke daily.

Why should scientists dictate law makers to make laws and then dictate all of us on how we should live our lives?

I'd allow people to quit smoking willingly.

[LHutton]

T
On a more theological level, is it a good idea to declare war on Satan? Nope.
Are you seriously going to turn that way? I would strongly suggest think again!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Hey, if you really think we should ban sunlight too, go ahead! :p

Which ever way we turn, I think it's obvious that banning things or declaring war on things don't really work very well most of the time.

[LHutton]

True.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Rocky fights with love and passion! He's no hater! That's why he wins!!! :D

[Dicknose]

Hey, if you really think we should ban sunlight too, go ahead! :p

We dont ban sunlight, but here school children can not go outside unless they wear sun protection, typically a large brim hat.

We are serious about the sun causing skin cancer.

google "australian school children" (alert!) and grabbed first image
http://resources3.news.com.au/images/2012/03/29/1226313/848223-120330-marri-grove-primary-school.jpg

[Dicknose]

While Im here - whats people's take on USA/Cuba?

Obama says he wants to improve relations.
Castro says he wants Guantanamo Bay back!

[overpowered]

I think that the 50+ year embargo has completely failed to accomplish anything good and normalizing relations will be a good thing for both countries.

I don't see why we need to keep Gitmo. Give it back.

[Jason]

The sun is still hitting their faces, whats the point of wearing the hats if they don't wear them correctly?!

[thesameguy]

I think that the 50+ year embargo has completely failed to accomplish anything good and normalizing relations will be a good thing for both countries.

I don't see why we need to keep Gitmo. Give it back.

Yeah, pretty much onboard with that. I guess it's nice to have a nearby, but off-premises, um, facility, but is it essential? Worth arguing about? Nah.

[LHutton]

May even be able to sell it back and get some cash, plus the money to be made from the resumption of trade.

[Dicknose]

Sell it?
It's Cuban land that is leased, although Cuba has refused to accept payment since they want the U.S. out.

[LHutton]

Oh. Probably best not then. They might get a bit peeved if we tried sell them their own land. Either way there's still money to be made on trade and money to be saved by not having a pointless base in Cuba.

[LHutton]

Is someone threatening witnesses?

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-george-zimmerman-wont-be-prosecuted-20150130-story.html


“While it is clear that the officers had probable cause to arrest Mr. Zimmerman which was affirmed by the circuit court judge at initial appearances, the subsequent recantation by the victim of her initial statement along with new documents provided by the victim and her attorney precludes my office from proceeding further,” Archer said in a prepared statement.

[thesameguy]

For that guy? Not likely.

More like, he's a questionable person who spends time with questionable people and they create questionable circumstances together. When you bring in the law and you need things like "proof," providing it becomes... questionable. The only thing that separates Zimmerman from a million other low class wastes of space is that he has eyes on him. The rest of them just do what they do outside the public vantage.

[TheBenior]

Yep, I've been to court on maybe 5% of the domestic battery arrests I've made. Occasionally, somebody pleads out immediately, but usually the victim either gets the charges dropped or doesn't show up to court.

[LHutton]

For that guy? Not likely.

More like, he's a questionable person who spends time with questionable people and they create questionable circumstances together. When you bring in the law and you need things like "proof," providing it becomes... questionable. The only thing that separates Zimmerman from a million other low class wastes of space is that he has eyes on him. The rest of them just do what they do outside the public vantage.
I guess. Hopefully someone soon will put his questionable arse, in a questionable cell, with a questionable person, who will do questionable things to his questionable arse.

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntjsAuLn5OM

http://mashable.com/2015/01/30/seattle-school-teacher-pepper-spray/

[overpowered]

https://leadershipmattersforamerica.org/

Leadership Matters For America dot Org = LMFAO

[FaultyMario]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/01/29/1360934/-Native-American-school-children-taunted-with-slurs-sprayed-with-beer-at-South-Dakota-hockey-game#Elementary school students who achieved academic and classroom behavior are rewarded with abuse.

[JoshInKC]

That's pretty fucked up, I'm sure going to see some hockey was a huge deal for those kids.
Years ago I dated a girl from Pine Ridge for like 5 minutes, and went up there with her for a week. It's one of the most economically depressed areas of the US with unemployment somewhere in the 80s and rampant poverty, so those kids probably don't get a ton of opportunities for off-res fun. Even with all that, the people were really nice and it's one of those places on earth that are just beautiful pretty much wherever you look.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Why were the kids whisked away? Shouldn't the police be called instead and have the asshole arrested on the spot?

Interesting that it took a 3 hour closed door meeting to finally realize that a crime had occurred!

Anyway, hope the president of Eagle Sales of the Black Hills would step up and not only apologize to the kids for his guest's poor behavior, but also let the kids to be able to come watch the game in its entirety from his skybox suite!

[LHutton]

Hopefully he'll provide video evidence too.

[LHutton]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/03/nypd-eric-garner-jail_n_6351244.html?hpcrime=y


Both Anthony Baez and Eric Garner, in their final moments, were put into chokeholds by officers from the New York City Police Department. Both of the cops involved were white, while Baez and Garner were minorities and unarmed. Both men’s deaths set off protests across the city, their names added to a long list of black and Latino men who have died in altercations with police.

But Francis Livoti, the officer who killed Baez, ultimately spent seven years in a federal prison. In December, a Staten Island grand jury decided not to indict NYPD Officer Daniel Pantaleo in Garner’s death.

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9Zut2k-cmw

[LHutton]

http://www.pravda.com.ua/rus/news/2015/02/5/7057631/



The Verkhovna Rada has banned the broadcasting of films produced by the Russian Federation.
For the corresponding bill №1317 voted 259 deputies.

"In Ukraine is prohibited distribution and public display of films produced by individuals and legal entities of the Russian Federation, as well as films that promote (including supply of positive information) law enforcement, armed forces and other military formations or power of the Russian Federation or their representatives, and movies , the plot of which is directly or indirectly related to the activities of these bodies or groups "- said in the law.
So 'Red Heat', 'Eastern Promise' and 'Battlefield 3' are effectively banned, as well as some missions in CoD.

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvjIYl_Nlao

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GH-uoyilK0

http://photographyisnotacrime.com/2015/02/video-shows-austin-cops-firing-bean-bag-rounds/

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT3Px11xN-0

[FaultyMario]

Awesome series by the NYT on corrupt 3rd world money-launderers now driving the NYC real estate game.


http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/08/nyregion/stream-of-foreign-wealth-flows-to-time-warner-condos.html?module=RelatedCoverage&_r=0

[LHutton]

So who's at fault here?

http://news.yahoo.com/bruce-jenner-deadly-multi-car-crash-003040146.html

[Freude am Fahren]

Ray-J

[speedpimp]

Ray-J

Golf clap.

[Freude am Fahren]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kJP-Et_ofI

[Tom Servo]

So who's at fault here?

http://news.yahoo.com/bruce-jenner-deadly-multi-car-crash-003040146.html

I know that section of road really well, we drive it regularly to get to one of our favorite hikes. It's wide, straight, and you can see forever.

I honestly can't imagine how anyone could possibly manage to rear end someone there unless they were screwing around on their phone.

[LHutton]

I know that section of road really well, we drive it regularly to get to one of our favorite hikes. It's wide, straight, and you can see forever.

I honestly can't imagine how anyone could possibly manage to rear end someone there unless they were screwing around on their phone.
Allegedly the car Jenner rear-ended had already rear-ended another car. Phone records are pretty easy to check, so the police should be able to prove that one way or the other.

[George]

Phone records are pretty easy to check, so the police should be able to prove that one way or the other.

They are? I've always heard they have to be subpoenaed and that's a huge legal headache. Heck, as part of my job I've had to call a couple phone companies to get copies of invoice for phones my employer owns (or pays for), and you'd think I was trying to get inside the White House with a sword or something the way I've been treated by these companies: "YOUR NAME IS NOT ON THIS ACCOUNT! WE ARE DISPATCHING POLICE TO YOUR LOCATION IMMEDIATELY!!!1!"

But mostly I wish Bruce Jenner would go away. Who continues to give a shit about this guy...um...person, anyway? Sure, he was a childhood hero most to most guys my age, but then again, so was OJ Simpson.

Enough, already.

Edited to add...not a "hero", but you know what I mean...a superstar athelete that everyone could admire. I guess all that fame at a young age just twists some people to the point that they'll do anything to stay on the front page of tabloids. :thppt:

[LHutton]

They are? I've always heard they have to be subpoenaed and that's a huge legal headache. Heck, as part of my job I've had to call a couple phone companies to get copies of invoice for phones my employer owns (or pays for), and you'd think I was trying to get inside the White House with a sword or something the way I've been treated by these companies: "YOUR NAME IS NOT ON THIS ACCOUNT! WE ARE DISPATCHING POLICE TO YOUR LOCATION IMMEDIATELY!!!1!"

But mostly I wish Bruce Jenner would go away. Who continues to give a shit about this guy...um...person, anyway? Sure, he was a childhood hero most to most guys my age, but then again, so was OJ Simpson.

Enough, already.

Edited to add...not a "hero", but you know what I mean...a superstar athelete that everyone could admire. I guess all that fame at a young age just twists some people to the point that they'll do anything to stay on the front page of tabloids. :thppt:
Oh right, sorry, I forgot you live in the US. Here the police just look at them, an RTA automatically gives them that right. Not sure whether they get the phone numbers called, or just periods of activity.

[Freude am Fahren]

That can't tell you if and wehn he was looking at Twitter or something though, only when a text would be sent, or call made. Hell, he could have been in the middle of typing an email.

[thesameguy]

They are? I've always heard they have to be subpoenaed and that's a huge legal headache. Heck, as part of my job I've had to call a couple phone companies to get copies of invoice for phones my employer owns (or pays for), and you'd think I was trying to get inside the White House with a sword or something the way I've been treated by these companies: "YOUR NAME IS NOT ON THIS ACCOUNT! WE ARE DISPATCHING POLICE TO YOUR LOCATION IMMEDIATELY!!!1!"

We subpoena cell phone records *all the time*.

I just subpoena'd the office's phone records - it wasn't that big of a deal all said and done. Some boilerplate language and a process server to deliver it.

I have subsequently learned that if your phone has some sort of bulk calling plan, there are no records. Thus, if I'm going to start harassing people over the phone I am definitely doing it from work.

[thesameguy]

That can't tell you if and wehn he was looking at Twitter or something though, only when a text would be sent, or call made. Hell, he could have been in the middle of typing an email.

This is true, data is not tracked to the second or even the minute. So don't text and drive, email and drive.

[LHutton]

That can't tell you if and wehn he was looking at Twitter or something though, only when a text would be sent, or call made. Hell, he could have been in the middle of typing an email.
A call alone will leave you in the shitter but they can also look at the person's phone itself I believe. I'll check on this.

[thesameguy]

They can, but that's why you should put a passcode on your iphone so the filesystem is encrypted and the cellbrite can't get the info. It's gone both ways in court, but as often as not you cannot be compelled to reveal the passcode under the 5th Amendment (because revealing it might cause you to incriminate yourself).

[LHutton]

They can, but that's why you should put a passcode on your iphone so the filesystem is encrypted and the cellbrite can't get the info. It's gone both ways in court, but as often as not you cannot be compelled to reveal the passcode under the 5th Amendment (because revealing it might cause you to incriminate yourself).
Police can hack that fairly easily.

[thesameguy]

Nope. Not since IOS4 when Apple started encrypting the file system on a file-by-file basis. Local PDs virtually all use cellbrites, and cellbrites do not support decrypting iphones. The only way to get data off a locked iphone is to jailbreak it, acquire the filesystem image, retrieve the keys (borderline impossible), and decrypt all the files. It isn't easy, and isn't reliable. It's well beyond what most police departments and even most specialists can do. This is FBI-level hacking for the most part.

eg: http://www.darthnull.org/2014/10/06/ios-encryption

[Tom Servo]

Allegedly the car Jenner rear-ended had already rear-ended another car. Phone records are pretty easy to check, so the police should be able to prove that one way or the other.

When I was younger, I rear ended another car after that car rear ended someone else. I was at fault for my portion, though I still maintain that I was keeping a safe distance and if the car in front of me had stopped in a normal distance, I never would have been close. However, since it really quickly went from about 35mph to 0, I couldn't stop in time.

I don't think that applies here though. The view from an Escalade's driver's seat should be high enough to see ahead of the Lexus to the Prius in front of it. I think his impact on the Lexus was completely avoidable.

[George]

This reminds me of General Motors cars having "ABS" badges on their trunks back when anti-lock brakes first came out.

At the time, I was driving a rear-engine car with four drum brakes and the gas tank above my knees, so I paid attention. :eek:

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPE_sRhZp6M

http://anonhq.com/anonymous-hacktivists-strike-blow-isis/

[mk]

However, since it really quickly went from about 35mph to 0, I couldn't stop in time.
We have a thing called situation speed.
Your's was too fast so it's a fine.

[overpowered]

However, since it really quickly went from about 35mph to 0, I couldn't stop in time.Which proves that you weren't maintaining adequate distance. Q.E.D.

[Tom Servo]

Yeah, I know it's pretty much impossible to argue that and I didn't try to argue the finding that I was at fault for that portion of a 10-car pileup. I was 18 at the time, I like to think I'm a little more cautious these days.

[LHutton]

Nope. Not since IOS4 when Apple started encrypting the file system on a file-by-file basis. Local PDs virtually all use cellbrites, and cellbrites do not support decrypting iphones. The only way to get data off a locked iphone is to jailbreak it, acquire the filesystem image, retrieve the keys (borderline impossible), and decrypt all the files. It isn't easy, and isn't reliable. It's well beyond what most police departments and even most specialists can do. This is FBI-level hacking for the most part.

eg: http://www.darthnull.org/2014/10/06/ios-encryption
Not in the UK. I just checked on the UK traffic answers site, which is ran by traffic cops, and they do this stuff on a routine basis. Since the 'terrorist threat' they have the encryption of every single known comms device in the civilian sector.

[overpowered]

Can You Solve Slate’s Gerrymandering Jigsaw Puzzle?

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/map_of_the_week/2013/08/gerrymandering_jigsaw_puzzle_game_put_the_congress ional_districts_back_together.html

[mk]

Yeah, I know it's pretty much impossible to argue that and I didn't try to argue the finding that I was at fault for that portion of a 10-car pileup. I was 18 at the time, I like to think I'm a little more cautious these days.
Around here and back in the day I was 18 last one paid it all.

[thesameguy]

Not in the UK. I just checked on the UK traffic answers site, which is ran by traffic cops, and they do this stuff on a routine basis. Since the 'terrorist threat' they have the encryption of every single known comms device in the civilian sector.

Sorry, that's lies. Apple doesn't have the info to decrypt the device. It's random and unknowable. Without the seed, the algorithm is useless. It's that simple. You're entitled to believe whatever you want to, but these are the facts.

[LHutton]

Sorry, that's lies. Apple doesn't have the info to decrypt the device. It's random and unknowable. Without the seed, the algorithm is useless. It's that simple. You're entitled to believe whatever you want to, but these are the facts.
All codes are crackable and as a result of terrorism they have people working to decrypt every single encryption, the results then get disseminated to the wider force. There really is no such thing as a fail-safe encryption, which is why militaries take great care, especially during cross-party training, not to even expose foreign nations to the encryption, because that gives them something to work on and they regularly change the encryption just in case. The only way to keep data safe is to keep it completely isolated from all networks and persons.

That's the real fact, but believe what you want to.

Developments in quantum encryption are in progress, where the encryption changes whenever someone looks at it.

[Dicknose]

Cracking encrypted data is not as simple as cracking the encryption.
Generally your attack will be just for a single set of data
Eg
- brute force an attack (try every seed/password)
- smart guess the seed/password
- physical attack at the storage of the seed

It is possible in some cases to find a weakness in the algorithm. These rarely break the whole encryption, mostly just reduce the effort to,do a brute force attack. Plenty of algorithms have been made public and no one has found a weakness.
Anything where someone has come out and shown, once I do this crack then every use is unsafe, well they tend to get thrown out and replaced quickly.

The statement "all codes are crackable" is wrong. It's not some law of mathematics or physics. It is possible to make uncrackable codes.
And most encryption systems are safe, in that the only method is a brute force attack which is not feasible with current computers (would take too long, cost too much)

Sure some have had weaknesses found. Some rely on hardware to hide unique keys and access to pull apart the device (and probably remove parts) can allow it to be cracked.
But plenty are considered safe even from the best agencies.

[thesameguy]

All codes are crackable and as a result of terrorism they have people working to decrypt every single encryption, the results then get disseminated to the wider force. There really is no such thing as a fail-safe encryption, which is why militaries take great care, especially during cross-party training, not to even expose foreign nations to the encryption, because that gives them something to work on and they regularly change the encryption just in case. The only way to keep data safe is to keep it completely isolated from all networks and persons.

If you actually read the article (and follow the link to Matthew Green's post) you will understand why it is very difficult to crack the iPhone's encryption. Maybe take some time to do that.

What you're saying above was true in the '80s to some degree, but possibly only in movies. Modern algorithms are so complex they are for all intents and purposes uncrackable. What's at risk are the keys and the passwords, because those are simpler series that could be relatively easily compromised, and that is what people change regularly. That is what governments protect. They don't "change encryption." The stuff your wifi is protected with (and has been for almost ten years) could not be cracked in hundreds of billions of years on the fastest supercomputers. The stuff governments use is tougher than that. It's for reasons like these that governments typically disapprove of encryption for consumers - because they *know* they can't break it without cooperation. Their best hope is you used a dumb password and a dictionary attack works. Failing that, even the government is hosed.

As this applies to the iPhone, the UID is part of the encryption's seed value. You don't know the UID, Apple does not know the UID. Nobody knows the UID. The seed is generated by and does not exist outside of the phone itself, so the only way to compromise an iPhone is by hacking against the phone. You cannot image the phone and hack against its data or you're right back to the billions of years angle. Since there is no way to extract the UID, the only thing you can do is brute force it, which Apple suggests can take up to 5.5 years. That's half a decade of asking an iPhone "Is this it?" over and over again.

So, yeah, the police can crack your iPhone, but do you really think they're going to throw five and a half years of supercomputer time at it so they can issue you a ticket? No, they're not.

[LHutton]

What can I say, they say that they've done it. The bit about military exposure is still very much true, especially for AESA radar and encrypted datalinks.

The police don't throw 5 years of supercomputers at it to issue a ticket, hell no. They throw the time at it so they can decode the information on Johnnie Jihad's iPhone/Blackberry/Whatever. That was one of the reasons they asked for more time in such prosecutions. However, once they beat the encryption, it's disseminated for wider use and not necessarily made public. And it isn't really for the sake of 'issuing a ticket', someone has been killed, that makes it a 'death by dangerous driving' charge, which carries much the same sentence as manslaughter here.

[LHutton]

Noooooooooooooo!

https://tv.yahoo.com/news/restless-jon-stewart-talks-daily-050028171.html

[Crazed_Insanity]

Sad for us, but hopefully good for his family! Thanx Jon!

[FaultyMario]

The people who reign o'r me. (http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/11/nyregion/jose-murat-casab-mexico-pri-luxury-condos-us.html?module=RelatedCoverageBottom)

[Dicknose]

"Beating the encryption" is rare.

Cracking an encryption algorithm is rare, but can happen in some cases. It's done by mathematicians, since all the encryptions are based on one way mathematics (like multiplying two large primes is easy, finding the primes from the answer is very hard)
It is also rare. Even then, it's usually just weakening it (like reducing a 5 year search to 2 years)

Most cracking for physical devices is about how to bust the hardware that is hiding a unique key.
This can never be 100% secure. But it can be put inside the same chip the does then encryption so that it is never seen, even if you looked at connections from the cip to the rest of the circuit board.
Of cause this makes manufacturing very hard, every chip must be unique.

The company I work for does this, they end up with chips in TV sets. It's our companies chip inside another companies tv, even that other company doesn't get to see the unique id that goes into their tvs.

As for the iPhone, it is considered secure.
Apple can't decrypt your phone. There is no backdor or master key.
I can't find any details of anyone breaking the encryption system.
There are weaknesses, you can backup data to a PC and it's optional if that is encrypted. It does skip some data if you don't encrypt, like passwords.

And it's totally different cracking the 4 digit pin and getting access to normal stuff like, Sms or call logs.
It's 4 digits, that's not keeping anyone out for long.

[Dicknose]

One last comment on encryption.
The systems considered secure never rely on the algorithms being a secret. It's best to publish the algorithm!
It should only rely on secret keys, unique or generated by the user.

If you rely on secrecy of the algorithm, then if that leaks out, the system is busted everywhere (ie it's cracked)

This also means a secure system can not have a backdoor or master key. Since that would be the same for every device, then it's a single shared weakness, if it gets leaked then again all devices are cracked.

[Kchrpm]

However, once they beat the encryption, it's disseminated for wider use and not necessarily made public.
You're still missing the point that the 5 years isn't to beat the encryption, it's to get the password for that device (as long as it's a good one). After 5 years, you can get into that one device. Have a new device? You're starting over from the beginning, that's another 5 years.

[thesameguy]

One last comment on encryption.
The systems considered secure never rely on the algorithms being a secret. It's best to publish the algorithm!
It should only rely on secret keys, unique or generated by the user.

I think this may be the issue - I'm not sure lhutton grasps this notion based on his comments of "beating encryption." Nobody beats encryption anymore - as DN points on all the best algorithms are published. There is nothing to "beat." What you need are the keys and without them your only hope is to crank through every possible combination. There is no shortcut. AES - a very common algorithm - is no secret. But without the keys, it would take billions of years to iterate through the possible keys. The only realistic failure of AES would be a poor password that is subject to a dictionary attack as that significantly reduces the possibilities and would take far less than billions of years. That is why the *keys* are guarded. The algorithm ("the encryption") is not the weak point and hasn't been for a long time.

Relying on the secrecy of the algorithm is, what Enigma Machine-era stuff? Okay, maybe that's an exaggeration, but it's definitely not even remotely current technology.

[overpowered]

23 Shocking Photos Reveal How Bad China’s Pollution Problem Has Become (http://www.earthporm.com/23-shocking-photos-reveal-bad-chinas-pollution-problem-become/)

[LHutton]

You're still missing the point that the 5 years isn't to beat the encryption, it's to get the password for that device (as long as it's a good one). After 5 years, you can get into that one device. Have a new device? You're starting over from the beginning, that's another 5 years.
What I'm saying is that the story from professionals in that business is different. I haven't tried it myself so I can't say with authority but I doubt it takes 10 years for police to access a mobile device if they desperately want the information on it. You're entitled to believe otherwise. They apparently have internal staff and firms permanently contracted for such activities.

5 years just for a password? Now that I really doubt. There just aren't that many possible combinations.

The other problem is that most mobile devices, regardless of whether you want them to, continuously broadcast periods of activity and give out information about you and what you're doing anyway. So it could be that the encryption is completely useless in this regard. All the police need to establish is that you were using your phone, regardless of what for, which isn't really the same as decoding all the data on it by any stretch.

Put simply, in the UK, if you were driving and killed someone whilst using a mobile device, and the police find the device in your car, or on your person, I can guarantee you'll be found guilty of death by dangerous driving, regardless of what exact methods they use and how encrypted your phone is.

[Rikadyn]

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/password_strength.png

[LHutton]

23 Shocking Photos Reveal How Bad China’s Pollution Problem Has Become (http://www.earthporm.com/23-shocking-photos-reveal-bad-chinas-pollution-problem-become/)
As regards bullet-point 2, is pollution a chief cause of algae? I ask because over the last 10 years the local canal has suddenly become covered in algae during the summer period.

[LHutton]

[IMG]http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/password_strength.png[IMG]
Or a few hours at 1 billion guesses per second, or a lot quicker if they just look for frequent matching bits of data entered on a regular basis.

Perhaps more relevant still:

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/bits/2014/01/27/apple-nsa/1


Apple has denied claims that its software comes with a built-in back-door at the request of the National Security Agency (NSA), but admits that it operates under a gagging order that prevents it from revealing too much about its work with the spook outfit.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/catalog-reveals-nsa-has-back-doors-for-numerous-devices-a-940994.html


After years of speculation that electronics can be accessed by intelligence agencies through a back door, an internal NSA catalog reveals that such methods already exist for numerous end-user devices.

[overpowered]

As regards bullet-point 2, is pollution a chief cause of algae? I ask because over the last 10 years the local canal has suddenly become covered in algae during the summer period.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=water+pollution+algae

[Dicknose]

The newer Apple devices can do 1 attempt every 5 seconds, the delay is built into the chip that hides the internal key.
You could take the data and attempt to decrypt it by guessing that internal key, but it is much larger than the passcode. It could take years.

Yes there is a lot of information that can get easily, even without the phone.
Call records, cell towers for approx location, recent Sms. That is information the phone company has.

I'm sure some devices do have back doors. But apples history and the known info about its security seems to indicate that is doesn't have a back door.

Everyone must have seen stories about companies that are hacked and their customers passwords are stolen.
That is poor security. Not that they were hacked, but that the passwords are even stored "in the clear"
A secure system doesn't store your password, it encrypts it and stores the encrypted password. This encryption is one way, there is no way to get your password back.
Ok so how do they use your password? When you login, you give the password, they encrypt this attempt and compare it against the stored answer (encrypted original password)
That is what Unix computers have done for 30 years. It's no amazing new concept.
But it means if someone gets the encrypted answers it doesn't help them as they still don't have your password.
They good try to crack the file of passwords, but they would typically have to try each password separately (the encryption key usually includes the username/id). Brute forcing one password is unlikely to help you
From that point of view the encryption can not be "cracked", there is no secret you can get that will help you to break it. Getting one password doesn't help for another in the same file. Even if you get the main key, it doesn't help with another set of passwords from another computer.
This system is generally considered I breakable. Hence most attacks are not against the encryption, but against poor choice of password.

How do you know if they use the encrypted password method on a website/system?
If there is a "forgot password" option and it emails you your password, then it's not encrypted and this system has very poor security.
If it can only do a "set to new password" then it probably is using encrypted passwords and is more secure.

[LHutton]

The newer Apple devices can do 1 attempt every 5 seconds, the delay is built into the chip that hides the internal key.
You could take the data and attempt to decrypt it by guessing that internal key, but it is much larger than the passcode. It could take years.
I'm assuming someone would take everything off the phone at the electronic level, stick it on a supercomputer and remove the delay. And the cracking would also involve going at it at the electronic level rather than just the software level. So things well hidden in software would appear as consistent strings of 1s and 0s.

That aside I think the problem's a lot easier than this. If the phone's on, it's broadcasting and probably relaying to some extent what it's doing. Aside even from that, failing to provide a breath specimen in the UK is an offence in itself, so I wouldn't be surprised if failing to give your password was also an offence.

[LHutton]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=water+pollution+algae
Interesting, thanks. Even if a little patronising.:lol:

[Dicknose]

I'm assuming someone would take everything off the phone at the electronic level, stick it on a supercomputer and remove the delay. And the cracking would also involve going at it at the electronic level rather than just the software level. So things well hidden in software would appear as consistent strings of 1s and 0s.

Not that easy.
The key inside the hardware is huge, so the supercomputer still has years of work.
To break a single iPhone.
And the hardware keeps all the work inside a single chip, so not only does the iPhone software not see anything that can help, the circuit board also doesn't see it.
It's all inside a chip and they never let the secret get outside.
This sort of stuff is a well known problem, mostly from securing pay TV with smart cards.
If your secret key can be read then someone can burn a new card that is a clone. This was possible with some older designs, but they now use the "all in one chip" method. So you would need to bust open that chip without destroying it.


That aside I think the problem's a lot easier than this. If the phone's on, it's broadcasting and probably relaying to some extent what it's doing. Aside even from that, failing to provide a breath specimen in the UK is an offence in itself, so I wouldn't be surprised if failing to give your password was also an offence.
Access to your computer that does the sync with the phone can be a weakness.
And it is illegal to not give a password if they have a warrant. But depending on what's on the phone, you might not want them to see it and rather risk what a judge will give you for claiming you forgot the code.

[LHutton]

You can certainly copy the assembly/machine code from a chip with the right hardware, hence how it gets on there in the first place. If we're talking a sequence of physical hardware gates, they can be examined too. Maybe I'm wrong but I don't see this as completely uncrackable. At hardware level there really isn't much protection at all, off-the-shelf chip does what OTS chip is told to do. Code/gate configuration taken from chip into supercomputer and simulated/analysed and that does get around the software delay, which is the main issue with brute force cracking time. If it's all hardware, get the chip design straight from the manufacturer, we've seen how government pressure has worked previously in this arena. If engineering it to scale in the first place was possible, then so is reverse engineering. These days there's even 3D nano-scanners that can take the design straight into an electronics-based CAD package to simulate the design. Anyway, I've taken up enough thread space on issue. Final post from me. Back to politics.

[thesameguy]

You can certainly copy the assembly/machine code from a chip with the right hardware.

Not true. That is only true in the case of FPGA, etc., where the chip is generic and a specific soft or firmware causes it to do what it's supposed to do. In the case of the iPhone, the chip that handles the encryption is only capable of one thing, it does not run any code, there is no soft or firmware to harvest from it. Again, read the article I posted way back when to understand how this works. There is no effective way to determine what specifically the chip does once its assembled. Even if you could reverse engineer a modern processor (not feasible due to scale, and there are specific devices which exist to try on simpler devices), or even given access to the chip's design you *still* need to know the seed for the encryption, which only exists ethereally inside the phone. Once it has been submitted to the chip which handles the encryption, there is no way to get it back out. Not even for Apple, who designed the effing thing.

You are broadly talking about things that were true 10 or 20 years ago. None of that is relevant anymore. Failing a design flaw (I'd name the bluray system on the PS3) once things are built, they are not reasonably unbuilt.

[MR2 Fan]

so....politics then...

[thesameguy]

If governments stealing your porn isn't a political problem, I don't know what is.

[overpowered]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10996169_611202302345737_754314880645414167_n.jpg? oh=cdd0852eecd958f57bc6c9117e23b8d3&oe=554D750E&__gda__=1431633301_171ec24a1bf7166eae5a51081a2d408 7

[FaultyMario]

I really wish Netanyahu would eat shit for breakfast.

For the rest of eternity.

[overpowered]

When letting your kids out of your sight becomes a crime (http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/raising-children-on-fear/2015/02/13/9d9db67e-b2e7-11e4-827f-93f454140e2b_story.html)

[Crazed_Insanity]

While I don't believe that should be a crime, but there are a lot of neglectful parents out there.

[LHutton]

I really wish Netanyahu would eat shit for breakfast.

For the rest of eternity.
In relation to this?

http://www.timesofisrael.com/netanyahu-to-french-jews-israel-is-your-home/

Pretty much feel the same way. Come away from Europe to the Middle East, where it's safer:rolleyes:, so that I can expand my settlements and put you in nice safe houses, where half the neighbourhood will want to kill you because of me.

[MR2 Fan]

While I don't believe that should be a crime, but there are a lot of neglectful parents out there.

a lot of abusive ones too...:snap:

[George]

When letting your kids out of your sight becomes a crime (http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/raising-children-on-fear/2015/02/13/9d9db67e-b2e7-11e4-827f-93f454140e2b_story.html)

That might be the most infuriating thing I have ever read.


A few hours later, a Montgomery County Child Protective Services (CPS) social worker coerced my husband into signing a “temporary safety plan” for our children by threatening to take the children “right now” — a threat she backed up with a call to the police. In the weeks that followed, another worker from the agency appeared at our door with the police and insisted that he did not need a warrant to enter our home. He also interviewed our children at school without our knowledge or permission.

And this!


My son told us that the social worker who questioned him asked, “What would you do if someone grabbed you?,” and suggested that he tell us that he doesn’t want to go off on his own anymore because it’s dangerous and that there are “bad guys waiting to grab you.” This is how adults teach children to be afraid even when they are not in danger.

What would you do if a GOVERNMENT WORKER grabbed you? That appears to be what happened here, if not literally.

I'm a really good Dad with regards to taking my kids to parks all the time and being with them and watching and playing. Hell, some of the parents I see just sit there and stare at their smart-phones and don't interact with their kids at all. Now that's child abuse. But evenutally kids need to go explore on their own. My son is six and I've been letting him ride his bike around the block lately. He's well out of my sight, but still in a quiet and safe residential area, and I trust him to come back in a couple minutes. Should I be imprisoned for this?

The Nanny-State must be overthrown.

[speedpimp]

I wonder how "States Rights" people would feel about a law that made all states recognize other states firearm carry permits (http://personalliberty.com/senate-bill-give-concealed-carry-across-state-lines-reciprocity-drivers-license/) if it became law? You know how they hate the federal government meddling in the affairs of the states. Oh wait, since this would benefit them I'm pretty sure they'd stay silent on the issue.

[TheBenior]

You mean like how they rail about "activist judges" but don't condemn things like handguns and concealed carry being made legal by court decisions in certain areas?

[speedpimp]

Ex-fucking-zactly.

[overpowered]

Don’t Know Much About History, Rick Perry edition (http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/dont-know-much-about-history-rick-perry-edition)

[thesameguy]

That made me feel good, because I don't actually know all that much about history but even *I* knew that Lincoln was strongly pro-Federal Government. What a fucking tard. And sadly most people that listened to him probably nodded along in agreement. I feel like there needs to be an actual punishment for politicians that lie. Telling people flat-out, indefensible untruths about American history is no different that omitting the "may contain peanuts" label from food as far as I'm concerned. No politician would support Pepsi or Ford from lying in their ads, but that's exactly what they themselves do. There needs to be accountability for political brands just like there are for household products brands.

[overpowered]

Prosecute Torturers and Their Bosses (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/22/opinion/prosecute-torturers-and-their-bosses.html)

[thesameguy]

That is a fucking terrible idea. Asking underlings to evaluate their tasks and giving them the freedom to choose not to execute orders is crazy. What would be the point of any security organization if there was no guarantee the grunts were going to carry out their missions? An army with an infantry that was not reliable? A CIA whose operatives could choose not to return information? That's a positively insane notion.

Frankly I think we've wasted enough time on these investigations - I'm 100% not okay with torture, but any new investigation is going to get roadblocked like all the others. Let it go, move on, and draft some pretty strong laws banning torture and setting up significant punishment for those who order the law be broken. We can't get Chase or AIG properly prosecuted, does anyone think the head of the fucking CIA is going to be?

[neanderthal]

While I agree with you, 100% blind obedience is what allows the concentration/ death camps to happen.

And to me, "I was only doing my job!" is NOT a defense.

[Freude am Fahren]

Aren't they already allowed to ignore illegal orders? Maybe just better education on what they are legally allowed to do.

[thesameguy]

While I agree with you, 100% blind obedience is what allows the concentration/ death camps to happen.

And to me, "I was only doing my job!" is NOT a defense.

Yeah, sure. It also allows a-bombs to get dropped and smart bombs fired. There is - hopefully - no scenario where wartime stuff is so obviously The Right Thing To Do that someone wouldn't and shouldn't be questioning it. But if the people in the field get to make calls about what the people with the plans are executing the whole thing falls apart - up to and including morale and the safety of all involved.

I agree it'd be great if there was some overarching morality that could be instilled in people so that we could guarantee the crazies don't get to execute their crazy plans, but there isn't. Everyone making "this doesn't feel right" judgment calls is a bad idea. Everyone worrying that years later someone might prosecute them for following orders is a bad idea.

We put people in charge because we trust they are going to guide our people and pursue our interests as morally and ethically as possible. Those are the people that should be held accountable, not the people who had the misfortune of falling under their command.

[LHutton]

Yeah, sure. It also allows a-bombs to get dropped and smart bombs fired. There is - hopefully - no scenario where wartime stuff is so obviously The Right Thing To Do that someone wouldn't and shouldn't be questioning it. But if the people in the field get to make calls about what the people with the plans are executing the whole thing falls apart - up to and including morale and the safety of all involved.

I agree it'd be great if there was some overarching morality that could be instilled in people so that we could guarantee the crazies don't get to execute their crazy plans, but there isn't. Everyone making "this doesn't feel right" judgment calls is a bad idea. Everyone worrying that years later someone might prosecute them for following orders is a bad idea.

We put people in charge because we trust they are going to guide our people and pursue our interests as morally and ethically as possible. Those are the people that should be held accountable, not the people who had the misfortune of falling under their command.
Film quote:

"Conduct onbecoming of a marine."

The charges laid against someone following an order.

[thesameguy]

Except only in the movies. Conduct unbecoming does not apply to following orders unless the orders are obviously coming without authority.

[LHutton]

Except only in the movies. Conduct unbecoming does not apply to following orders unless the orders are obviously coming without authority.
Even if the orders contravene International Law on Human Rights?

Oh yeah, Guantanamo... dope.:o

[LHutton]

Oh no, our worst fears...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KF-d1imlK8s

[Rikadyn]

We have always been at war...

[Crazed_Insanity]

Prosecuting the lowly grunts are fine as long as the head huncho is also prosecuted. It's stupid to prosecute just the nazi soldiers and let Hitler go.

I do believe we have failed miserably on Wall Street and in Guatanamo bay. Our 'Hitler' is still in charge. It's weird that our regime change from W to O made little difference. Something is seriously fucked up about the us govt. I wouldn't be surprised to eventually learn that ISIS extremists are direct/indirect creation of US govt just like Hussein and bin laden...

[neanderthal]

Prosecuting the lowly grunts are fine as long as the head huncho is also prosecuted. It's stupid to prosecute just the nazi soldiers and let Hitler go.

Something that Billi and I agree on.


I do believe we have failed miserably on Wall Street and in Guatanamo bay. Our 'Hitler' is still in charge. It's weird that our regime change from W to O made little difference. Something is seriously fucked up about the us govt. I wouldn't be surprised to eventually learn that ISIS extremists are direct/indirect creation of US govt just like Hussein and bin laden...

CONGRESS has to authorise funds to close. GITMO. Funds requested by the administration; guess where that is languishing?

Read this. (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/21/us/politics/21detain.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0)

If you're gonna be a hater, at least be educated about what you're hating.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don't hate Obama, if I can do over, for sure he gets my vote again. Its not just gitmo, do you really think we're safer from Wall Street and the terrorists? W got us into these holes and do you think we're in the process of climbing out or are we getting deeper into it?

By me saying our govt changed very little with a complete change from W to O is basically saying that our commander in chiefs are not really the ones in charge. Some one or something else is controlling our govt. forget about the ineffective 3 branches. Federal reserves(which technically isn't even part if our govt), NSA , CIA, or homeland security or whatever other parts of our govt that we the American people have no access to, but can nevertheless still easily be bought by rich lobbyists.

I think We are becoming the evil empire in star war movies...

Anyway, stay tuned and we'll see how things turn out. I just don't get why those beheaders all spoke fluent English. How convenient.

[neanderthal]

I don't hate Obama, if I can do over, for sure he gets my vote again. Its not just gitmo, do you really think we're safer from Wall Street and the terrorists? W got us into these holes and do you think we're in the process of climbing out or are we getting deeper into it?

And do you think the problem in government right now is the White House or the House of Representatives?


By me saying our govt changed very little with a complete change from W to O is basically saying that our commander in chiefs are not really the ones in charge. Some one or something else is controlling our govt. forget about the ineffective 3 branches. Federal reserves(which technically isn't even part if our govt), NSA , CIA, or homeland security or whatever other parts of our govt that we the American people have no access to, but can nevertheless still easily be bought by rich lobbyists.

I think We are becoming the evil empire in star war movies...

Anyway, stay tuned and we'll see how things turn out. I just don't get why those beheaders all spoke fluent English. How convenient.

WTF is that supposed to mean? :confused

[Crazed_Insanity]

I used to think those terrorists are disenchanted Arabs. Why are there westerners there at all? Westerners nowadays mostly find Jesus unbelievable yet find allah all that fascinating? Those westerners involves are either mentally ill or perhaps just financed by somebody to stir up more fear and hatred around the world so they can sell more weapons.

Anyway, as for White House and congress, I don't expect them to solve any of our problems any time soon. Whoever's in office will authorize more funding for war and eventually the evil empire will collapse and drag the entire world down with it too... Then the rebels will cheer and they'll start over...

[speedpimp]

Hey, Billi/y, this might come as a shock to you, but Muslims don't just live in the Middle East and they aren't all Arabs. There are plenty of Muslims who were born and raised in the US, Canada and UK that speak just like the locals do but they have retained their religion and customs.

[Crazed_Insanity]

If you were a radicalized Muslim, you would fight the western governments in the Middle East? Once you fly there once, you'd probably be black listed by your govt. might as well stay here and just cause some damage here in the US in the name of Allah. I'd think that'd be way more effective than fighting US military in the Middle East.

Anyway, I find it increasingly less believable that ISIS is driven by Allah. Most likely by some sort of international banker that's financing both sides of the war. I'd bet whoever lends money to the US govt is the same that's financing ISIS.

[overpowered]

Local Fox anchor complains about Lady Gaga’s ‘jigaboo music’ during Oscars coverage (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/02/local-fox-anchor-complains-about-lady-gagas-jigaboo-music-during-oscars-coverage/)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJLplLOKf_4

[thesameguy]

I can't watch that now, but it sounds totally awesome.

[Freude am Fahren]

I'll be honest, I had to look up that word, never heard it before. I'm 90% sure that she heard it once to describe pop music, and just reused it, having no idea it was even a racial slur.

[speedpimp]

The look and smile on her co-workers face when she says the word is priceless.

[thesameguy]

This seems about right...

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/9d/9d488c4dd6b949416c85906c5bd7a4c3d3163632d5606a6a06 8e487c0f3a2d73.jpg

[21Kid]

Republican Sen. Ted Cruz of Texas used a speech at the Conservative Political Action Conference on Thursday to rail against the party establishment, calling himself a “disruptive app” such as Uber that would upend the political system. Delighting the assembled conservative shock troops, Cruz castigated the Republican leadership for selling out its principles by separating a funding bill for the Department of Homeland Security from a measure that would roll back President Barack Obama’s executive action on immigration.
:erm: It's barely working as it is... WTF would we want it even more disrupted?!?!? :smh:

[Phil_SS]

This seems about right...

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/9d/9d488c4dd6b949416c85906c5bd7a4c3d3163632d5606a6a06 8e487c0f3a2d73.jpg

Pretty much explains Foxnews in a nutshell.

[neanderthal]

I'm not one to take joy in someone else's sorrow but this one (http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/02/27/uninsured-bigoted-anti-obamacare-sheriff-now-begging-for-money-to-pay-medical-bills-screenshots/) makes me want to point and laugh.

The comments on the gofundme page are gold.

[overpowered]

North Carolina has made it legal for lobbyists to have sex with politicians.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/02/n-carolina-officials-sex-between-lobbyists-and-lawmakers-has-no-monetary-value/

So in essence, a lobbying firm can hire prostitutes as lobbyists and send them to service lawmakers.

[Crazed_Insanity]

No monetary value doesn't necessarily mean it's legal. Basically meant sleeping with scumbags are less than $10 in value so you don't need to report that. But once your cheap date is found out, I'm sure careers will suffer still.

Conservatives really should push for banning adultery much harder than banning gay sex/marriages..., but of course it's always easier to pick on minorities and be more judgmental with others rather than self.

[overpowered]

Apparently Girl Scout cookies are lesbian and communist. Who knew?

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/kevin-swanson-begs-you-not-buy-communist-lesbian-girl-scout-cookies

[speedpimp]

Yet if the Boy Scouts sold cookies he would defend them as being "All-American, defending and promoting family values and the Christian faith!"

[Freude am Fahren]

As long as the women did the baking, of course.

[speedpimp]

Of course we wouldn't want the boys to learn a radical feminist trait such as cooking.

[overpowered]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/18421_824729690898062_1340658677141716179_n.jpg?oh =2515af1afec64da3ad334ee42533203b&oe=5585DF40&__gda__=1434846891_82c21738bbd3b63f581a22715383c99 0

[FaultyMario]

Yesterday this guy rode home from work in his VW. He used to be a president.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/B_HTqTpUQAAz29K.jpg

[George]

^ that's how I'd want to leave town!

[overpowered]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpzvaqypav8

[overpowered]

This is interesting. Too bad that it has zero chance of actually becoming law. The republicans love their shutdown tactics.

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/house-democrat-introduces-bill-to-end-all-government-shutdowns-forever/