Politics

[neanderthal]

I consider myself progressive, but pragmatic, it has been frustrating being on the “side” of policy makers, working against folks who simply either want to make themselves wealthy, hurt people they don’t like, or “blow it all up”. Those slogans are way easier to push than nuanced policy details, and I have absolutely no solution for it. It sucks.

All we can do is shout into the void and bring a light to the empty slogans.

Perfect being "the enemy of good" should never be an impediment to progress.

This is why I'm fast to shit can that talk. Progress is not overnight. It's a process. And there's *active* resistance to even the small baby steps of progress.

[neanderthal]

I don't really watch news.

Is the right wing taking points machine really in a fuss about brown babies getting baby formula?

What does that say about how pro life they are?

[Tom Servo]

Yep. In another example of the outrage machine, people like Jesse Watters on Fox are calling kids "illegal babies" and Sean Hannity is showing pallets of powdered milk (labeled as not for kids under 1 year old) on his show and screaming that it's formula being kept from precious American babies.

You've also got Elise Stefanik, one of the higher ranked GOP members of the house, calling democrats "pedo grifters" while pretending to be outraged about the same thing.

The saddest part is that this outrage machine works. That, and a number of GOP people seem to be more than happy to incorporate QAnon ideas into their nonsense if it keeps their numbers up.

[FaultyMario]

That shit was medieval.

Is Buffalo changing its name to Bubalina or Bonasus?

I mean, It's gotta affirm its place in Fifth century Christendom somehow.

[Tom Servo]

Pretty amazing. You've got someone on 4chan posting a manifesto about "The Great Replacement", echoing sentiments shared by people like Tucker Carlson, Matt Gaetz, Wendy Rogers, and Elise Stefanik, killing 10 people in Buffalo, and now those same people are claiming it's a false flag staged by the FBI to take away yer guns.

I honestly don't know how we come back from this. But, for anyone invested in seeing social media become more about unabridged free speech, 4chan is an excellent example of what comes of that.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don’t think free speech is about justifying and planning to kill people. Nobody is for that kind of free speech.

The kind of free speech I want for people is to discuss rather than either shut people up or discharge firearms.

Regarding FBI, whether they staged it or failed at their job, I don’t know. Either way, it’s not good.

[Tom Servo]

You don't know if they staged it?


They didn't stage it. If you think they staged it, you have a serious case of internet brain worms.

[Rikadyn]

I don't really watch news.

Is the right wing taking points machine really in a fuss about brown babies getting baby formula?

What does that say about how pro life they are?

No they are claiming brown babies are stealing formula from white babies, when it's powdered milk "not to be consumed by children under 1 year old"

[Crazed_Insanity]

You don't know if they staged it?


They didn't stage it. If you think they staged it, you have a serious case of internet brain worms.


If they didn’t stage it, then FBI is seriously incompetent.

This is what I’m talking about regarding free speech, you can’t just claim something to be untrue without evidence. Similarly with the lab leak theory. All options have to be available and on the table until a thorough investigation is completed. There’s no need to prematurely shut anything down.

As with manifesto to murder people, I’m not suggesting we prematurely arrest and convict somebody, but social media and authorities should’ve put this guy on some sort of watch list. If we can predict when Putin will launch an attack, surely we could predict when a mass shooter is ready to kill as well? Especially when he posted his intention online?

I think you gave governments way too much credit sometimes. You still believe those who believe in the lab leak theory are nuts? It absolutely must be naturally occurring even though we have no evidence proving either way?

Allow for free speech and keep an opened mind. I don’t know if FBI staged it or perhaps they’re just incompetent. I don’t know if it’s naturally occurring or lab leaked, either way, it’s just not good. To fully investigate these things, we can’t shut anything down prematurely. If you have solid evidence to shut something down, I’ll listen.

[Tom Servo]

No, FBI wasn't incompetent. We have very, very permissive free speech laws on purpose, so you don't get watched or surveilled or arrested for thought crimes. You're trying to have it both ways. You've often expressed that people should be innocent until proven guilty, but at the same time you want everyone potentially guilty until proven innocent. You want free speech, only then you repeatedly say you want restrictions on that speech, and the won't actually commit to what those restrictions are.

The lab leak thing is particularly poignant. Despite a lack of evidence that that's what it is, especially given the prevalence of zoonotic diseases making the leaps to humans over millennia, you literally seek out facts to support your theory rather than seeing where the evidence takes you. You have an answer you want - you're not interested in finding the truth, you're interested in finding what supports the truth you want. Then, you attack people who disagree with you, ascribing motives to them that they don't have to justify your stance.

You keep saying "allow for free speech", but you also say "I don’t think free speech is about justifying and planning to kill people. Nobody is for that kind of free speech." You need to pick one. Are you for free speech absolutism or are you for restrictions on speech? If the latter, what restrictions? Stop being wishy-washy and answer.

But I will say this: Think about what'd it take for the FBI to stage this. The entire store staff, everyone who was a customer there, all the police in the area, anybody who happened to be nearby, any journalists that made it there quickly, anybody who lost a loved one - they'd all need to be in on it. They'd all need to keep the secret. It's just like chemtrails and all the rest - it's hard to keep a secret between like 5 people, it's impossible at that scale. Even entertaining the thought that the FBI staged this is an insult to the people who died and 100% beyond the pale, and it honestly disgusts me that you'd entertain it. You are directly insulting innocent people who were killed.

[Crazed_Insanity]

You tend to think that I’m already a firm believer of FBI staging and lab leak theory. I can tell you that I’m not. I’m still on the fence about it, I just find it appalling that Fauci would want to control the narrative and shut something down without any evidences.

All I’m saying is that until we have actual evidence supporting either way, there’s absolutely no need to pick a side and see the other side as enemy. Same goes for those on the other side. People jumped to conclusions too quickly based on their preconceived biases.

I see ‘both sides’ jumping into their respective conclusions too soon. We need a more bipartisan way reach conclusions.

[MR2 Fan]

Every time I see Rupert Murdoch trending on Twitter I hope for the best, but sadly he's still alive

[Rare White Ape]

I’m still on the fence about it...

All I’m saying is that until we have actual evidence supporting either way...

That's all the information we need about you. It is a disgusting position to hold.

You know who you remind me of?

You remind me of the Australian politician who demanded the evidence that human causes were influencing climate change, live on national TV, sitting at a panel opposite one of the most famous science presenters of the of the last 20 years. The evidence was immediately presented by this famous scientist (he had the graphs right there), but this guy kept pushing his nonsense narrative.

You are the politician.

This famous scientist is all of the rest of us: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lf3TGmaLXow&ab_channel=abcqanda

[Crazed_Insanity]

There are now plenty of evidences for climate change. Deniers are free to deny all they want, climate won’t stop changing.

Am I really an elected politician? Who elected me? What am I politicizing?

Just take any accident investigation, we have to have an opened mind and explore all options, right? Sure we might not have the time and resources to explore all options, but point is we need to find the root cause based on determined facts, right?

Until we made that determination, we shouldn’t shut anything down!

Naturally there will always be folks like flat earthers, but anyways, we cant always control what people think.

However, hopefully we can direct our collective actions appropriately.

[neanderthal]

No, FBI wasn't incompetent. We have very, very permissive free speech laws on purpose, so you don't get watched or surveilled or arrested for thought crimes. You're trying to have it both ways. You've often expressed that people should be innocent until proven guilty, but at the same time you want everyone potentially guilty until proven innocent. You want free speech, only then you repeatedly say you want restrictions on that speech, and the won't actually commit to what those restrictions are.

The lab leak thing is particularly poignant. Despite a lack of evidence that that's what it is, especially given the prevalence of zoonotic diseases making the leaps to humans over millennia, you literally seek out facts to support your theory rather than seeing where the evidence takes you. You have an answer you want - you're not interested in finding the truth, you're interested in finding what supports the truth you want. Then, you attack people who disagree with you, ascribing motives to them that they don't have to justify your stance.

You keep saying "allow for free speech", but you also say "I don’t think free speech is about justifying and planning to kill people. Nobody is for that kind of free speech." You need to pick one. Are you for free speech absolutism or are you for restrictions on speech? If the latter, what restrictions? Stop being wishy-washy and answer.

But I will say this: Think about what'd it take for the FBI to stage this. The entire store staff, everyone who was a customer there, all the police in the area, anybody who happened to be nearby, any journalists that made it there quickly, anybody who lost a loved one - they'd all need to be in on it. They'd all need to keep the secret. It's just like chemtrails and all the rest - it's hard to keep a secret between like 5 people, it's impossible at that scale. Even entertaining the thought that the FBI staged this is an insult to the people who died and 100% beyond the pale, and it honestly disgusts me that you'd entertain it. You are directly insulting innocent people who were killed.

billi is the Alex Jones of this shit!!!! It figures.

[neanderthal]

You tend to think that I’m already a firm believer of FBI staging and lab leak theory. I can tell you that I’m not. I’m still on the fence about it, I just find it appalling that Fauci would want to control the narrative and shut something down without any evidences.

All I’m saying is that until we have actual evidence supporting either way, there’s absolutely no need to pick a side and see the other side as enemy. Same goes for those on the other side. People jumped to conclusions too quickly based on their preconceived biases.

I see ‘both sides’ jumping into their respective conclusions too soon. [b]We need a more bipartisan way reach conclusions.[/b/]

Aren't you the stupid mutherfucker that keeps lamenting Biden/ Pelosi et al trying to work with Republicans?

You really are a dumb fuck just gaslighting us.

[neanderthal]

Every time I see Rupert Murdoch trending on Twitter I hope for the best, but sadly he's still alive

<Golf clap.> Bravo.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Aren't you the stupid mutherfucker that keeps lamenting Biden/ Pelosi et al trying to work with Republicans?

You really are a dumb fuck just gaslighting us.

It’s fine to take a stand for something based on something you believe, assuming you’re not standing on somebody else against their will.

However, I also have to be humble enough to realize that I might be wrong! I can choose to stand with Jesus, but that doesn’t mean I have to force everyone to believe the same and shut down all other religions. I can work with people of other religions for the most part but I’m not going to compromise important Christian values in the name of ‘working with’ others.

Freedoms of speech, freedom of religion are very similar that way. Feel free to choose whatever you want. We should not shut people who believe differently down. Talk and chat with each other thru speech and try to understand each other better.

[Tom Servo]

I honestly do not know how you could entertain the idea that the shooting in Buffalo was faked, but it is yet another example of how someone can apparently fall down the rabbit hole of disinformation, latching onto people like Jordan Peterson, and eventually become so detached from reality that they suddenly think they're this shining light of speech freedom and not, instead, absolutely deluded.

I'm trying to channel my emotions about this from anger to pity. I unblocked you a while ago thinking that maybe I'd been too harsh and made a mistake, but I cannot abide by someone who's going to believe that the deaths of 10 innocent people at the hands of a white supremacist might be faked because it's not the reality they want to believe in. I just can't. After all the signs that this was happening, from people chanting in Charlottesville that "Jews [won't] replace us" to Stephen Miller to multiple politicians parroting a long-standing antisemitic white supremacist theory, and everyone saying "this rhetoric will lead to people being killed." We've warned people like you, and instead of accepting reality, you're ready to re-enact the Reichstag fire.

You should feel shame. I am trying to not be angry and instead just feel sad for you, but I'm literally shaking.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Dude, ask yourself why you feel so mad and sad for Billi.

Just because I latch on to Jesus and Jordan Peterson, you think I’d eventually buy me some guns and shoot black brown Jewish people dead in order to MAGA?

Me entertaining on an idea can cause you to go thru the roof? Why should I think only in ways that won’t offend you? You don’t think that’s overreaching and overreacting?

Btw, there was another shooting in OC this afternoon. Somebody shot up a Taiwanese church. We have no clue what’s the motive there… don’t know anyone there personally, but I think we can be mad and sad about this kind of things happening so frequently in US.

I’m not the shooter. There’s really no need to get so mad and sad at Billi.

[Yw-slayer]

I don't know if by "FBI staged it" he means that the FBI set the whole thing up, or that they supported/encouraged him to do it, or that they knew he was going to do it but just let him do it anyway. The first of those possibilities is (one would hope) less likely than the second, let alone the third.

There may be other nuances, but at this stage I can't really see the point in further debating them.

[Rare White Ape]

There may be other nuances, but at this stage I can't really see the point in further debating them.

“The truth and the grace of the Gospel, are so great and so numerous to surpass thought, and to beggar belief and even conjecture until experience should have taught us to estimate them by their loss.”

I guess the same is true with real-world topics.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Putin was probably literally shaking at Ukraine for even thinking of joining NATO. Rather than opening channel for communications to debate this further, he thought it’d be better to just open fire.

The right often allowed their emotions to get out of control. The left is not always rational either.

Of course you’re not Putin, so the best solution to world peace is to blame Billi and ignoring him. Thank God for ignore feature.

[Tom Servo]

I don't know if by "FBI staged it" he means that the FBI set the whole thing up, or that they supported/encouraged him to do it, or that they knew he was going to do it but just let him do it anyway. The first of those possibilities is (one would hope) less likely than the second, let alone the third.

There may be other nuances, but at this stage I can't really see the point in further debating them.

Yeah, I'm beyond that point. Back on with ignore with no intention of ever clicking "View Post" again. Just so far beyond the pale with me that I don't think I can get past it. Any attempt at nuance is backpedaling, as all of this fits a pattern of previous comments about how it's really white people who are being oppressed at this point. It's an attempt to remove the agency of a vile white supremacist who deliberately set out to kill Black people and deflect criticism from those who have enabled this, by using white grievance as a way to maintain power.

It's someone in the process of becoming radicalized defending someone who became radicalized, and someone who has said repeatedly that any attempt to point out his own radicalization process just makes him want to get radicalized more. Nothing I say will improve the situation, and nothing he says will make me not feel ill. It's the best for both of us.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Very well. Now I can safely post without making things hazardous for your health! :)

BTW, if admins think I need to be censored or kicked off the forum, please feel free to do so. I understand that is your right.

As a proponent of free speech, I will continue to say whatever I want. I won't go out of the way to offend people, but I'm not going to allow other people to tell me how to think and say either. Hopefully the ignore feature will be good enough to maintain some sort of peace for now.

Problem with our current political polarization is precisely this... we jumped into conclusion that people on the other side are despicable, deplorable, evil people because that is what we all brain washed to believe.

It's so funny that roofer unfriended me on FB and Swervo ignores me here. Yeah, this is indeed very sad. At least Jesus still loves me. :p

[2ndMoparMan]

If only Jesus was real.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes, if Jesus is real, he loves you too! :)

If Jesus is not, then I'll be really really sad. :(

Considering that we can't prove either way, I don't think we should censor the Jesus Theory and we should let Christians believe what they want... provided that they don't actually harm other people.

That's religious freedom. Same goes for freedom of speech. You shouldn't compel others to think, talk in certain ways just because you find it offensive. We all need to learn to agree to disagree without suffering a heart attack.

[2ndMoparMan]

Bible isn't real, bud.

[FaultyMario]

But whiteness is, and Billi is trying to become white.

Much like the Irish did in order to become white, he needs to exercise violence against the dispossessed.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I self identify as a non-white Chinese American. How dare you specifying a skin color on me as if I don't have a mirror at home? :p


Bible isn't real, bud.
I don't understand how you can be so sure about a book that influenced the development of the Western world for the past 2000 years as unreal. Well, I suppose in a way, it is kinda unreal. ;) However, I can respect your opinion since I cannot prove to you with 100% certainty that Jesus is real. :p

Anyway, back to mass shootings. Just found out that the OC church shooting was politically motivated hate crime. Nothing to do with white supremacists. Just a pro-china chinese american man who hates taiwanese so badly that he decided to pretend to be a mini-Putin and declared war on a taiwanese church in a retirement community full of old people. Locked all exit doors to prevent escapes. If it weren't for the brave man who sacrificed himself and the pastor who threw a chair at the shooter, there would've been way more casualties.

Imagine that. Nothing to do with white supremacy and Trump. Just pure hatred between people of the same exact race. Unable to respectfully agree to disagree. This guy really should just stayed in Vegas and live his own life. I don't understand why he needs to come to OC to a church and intended to kill everyone. Probably some more to the story that we don't know yet...

So what's the pressing issue(s) here? The way I see it is obviously 1) access to guns being way too easy and 2) we don't even have proper healthcare for average americans let along sufficient mental healthcare.

White supremacists are definitely bad too. But it's clear USA won't be able to resolve our gun violence problems anytime soon. I'd expect things to only get worse because there's no political will to solve my issue #1 and no political money for issue #2. Introducing more hatred to the public obviously also adds more fuel to the fire.

Could government(s) be staging or planning or influencing this attack as well? Again, I'm not jumping into any conclusions too soon, but I'm also unwilling to shut any possibilities down either.

It'd really be nice if after every mass shooting, we could actually do something to reduce the chances of similar events from happening again. But that'd be too unreal.

[neanderthal]

It shouldn't have to be noted that the shooter was taken safely into custody, despite having guns on him and despite him having just killed ten people.

Tamar Rice ...

[FaultyMario]

Billi is trying to become white.

Think of this heinous phrase:

"We must secure the ex¡stence of our peopIe and a future for wh¡te ch¡ldren"

I propose some pertinent questions like: What is a "secure existence" in practical terms?, Who does "our people" refer to? is the concept of "us" different for different types of racialized societies? is "us" the same in segregationist societies versus integrationist societies?; How do the different subcultures in a multicultural society reconciliate the fact that "our children" aren't necessarily "white" in the hegemonic sense?

Racism for me has been difficult to understand because even though I come from and live in an integrationist society (southern Mexico), I first experienced and learned about it in a segregationist space (SoCal). But, from that limited understanding I think I can see why Billi is trying to interiorize this sort of racist scaffolding, he just wants to fit in and he doesn't want his children to be segregated.

[Rikadyn]

It shouldn't have to be noted that the shooter was taken safely into custody, despite having guns on him and despite him having just killed ten people.

Tamar Rice ...

And Roof, and Rittenhouse, as long as they are white the cops won't shoot one of their own.

[FaultyMario]

POC are the others for the state. It don't matter what color the person doing the violence is.

[Tom Servo]

Speaking of the heinous phrase, the shooter had "14" written on the side of his gun.

Long thread from an extremism researcher I follow (https://twitter.com/_MAArgentino/status/1526237470320361474)

[Yw-slayer]

Why is Billi not questioning the identity and motives of the church shooter, but questioning those of the Buffalo shooter?

[Crazed_Insanity]

…This guy really should just stayed in Vegas and live his own life. I don't understand why he needs to come to OC to a church and intended to kill everyone. Probably some more to the story that we don't know yet...

Could government(s) be staging or planning or influencing this attack as well? Again, I'm not jumping into any conclusions too soon, but I'm also unwilling to shut any possibilities down either.


Can you provide answers to my questions?

I just learned that OC shooter is a member of ‘Chinese for peaceful reunification (between Taiwan and China)’

Sounds well intentioned enough. I’m sure the group’s members are now worried that they may have suddenly became a terrorist organization.

Also learned that this shooter possibly had mental issues resulted in him getting his ass kicked by his tenants or the tenants kicked the shit out of him which caused his mental issue? I’ve heard conflicting stories, but point is mental issues is definitely involved.

Anyway, whatever’s the case, this guy kept notes and journals just as the 18 yr old white shooter. Rather than replacement theory of white people, his concern is Taiwan becoming independent. Anyway, he really is a mini-Putin I tell ya.

From Putin to these shooters, they’re likely suffering from the same conditions. It’s just unfortunate Putin has so much firepower. Same goes with these American shooters.

My theory is that if we could predict Putin’s move, we should be able to predict these shooters as well. However, even though we actually predicted Putin’s move, if not like we’ll be able to protect all innocent lives from being lost… :(

[Tom Servo]

Another person who, for years, has been on the misinformation/extremism beat. Six minute or so video (https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1526570997146693633) - he's worth a follow at @oneunderscore_ (https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__)

We've reached a point where this is no longer an angry loner. This is an organized thing. People are building on the actions of previous murderers. We're far from done with this.

Also, kudos to NBC for having him and Brandy Zadrozny (https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny) on the misinformation and extremism beat for all this time. They're the only major US news organization that I know of that's been covering and warning about this kind of thing for years now.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/buffalo-suspect-lonely-isolated-sign-145744273.html

At least according to this AP article, it does suggest the white shooter is a loner. He doesn't appear to suffer from any overt mental issues, but clearly the guy was lonely and depressed. A nerdy, socially awkward guy that nobody likes. Nerdy video gamer... Kinda like Billi when he was that age! In fact, I'm still the socially awkward guy who nobody likes! :p

Luckily I'm only into car games... and I do believe back then Buddhism helped gave me a more positive world view. Subsequent subscription of Christianity for sure helped me out further. That OC shooter was a Chinese American born in Taiwan just like me too, but I don't think he subscribes to any religious beliefs... That guy has wife and kids, but they're living away from him in Taiwan.

Bible is true I tell you guys. It is not good for man to be alone. (Gen 2:18)

[FaultyMario]

No, he is no lone wolf. He did follow -quite literally- in the steps of the Christchurch terrorist and other deplorables.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Not saying he operated as a complete lonewolf out of nothing, but he is socially a loner. No friends. My theory is that he probably self identified as part of that ‘group’ of loner racists. Reading journals from past shooters and hopes future shooters will be able to learn from him…

For the Chinese guy, not sure how he justified peaceful reunification by violence.

[Tom Servo]

No, he is no lone wolf. He did follow -quite literally- in the steps of the Christchurch terrorist and other deplorables.

100% he is not a lone wolf. These are people who are literally goading each other on to do this and livestream it, and a lot of our politicians and mass media are all too happy to push the narrative that feeds this. The only disassociation at this point is that the Buffalo shooter was one of the few channers who didn't idolize Elliot Rodger, the incel Santa Barbara shooter. Otherwise, a ton of his "manifesto" was lifted straight from the Christchurch shooter's one.

But hey, both sides, right?

[neanderthal]

Not saying he operated as a complete lonewolf out of nothing, but he is socially a loner. No friends. My theory is that he probably self identified as part of that ‘group’ of loner racists. Reading journals from past shooters and hopes future shooters will be able to learn from him…

For the Chinese guy, not sure how he justified peaceful reunification by violence.

Loner? Loner, ... or arsehole, who couldn't make friends because he was an arsehole?

Evidence says the latter.

But give everyone a participation medal billi thinks he was a loner. So fucking what? Being a loner is NO EXCUSE to go murder innocent people. What did the people he killed have to do with his inability to make friends?

[neanderthal]

Loner? Loner, ... or arsehole, who couldn't make friends because he was an arsehole?

Evidence says the latter.

But give everyone a participation medal billi thinks he was a loner. So fucking what? Being a loner is NO EXCUSE to go murder innocent people. What did the people he killed have to do with his inability to make friends?

It's twenty fucking twenty two. People hang out with like minded "friends" online all the time. He was no fucking loner.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Not finding excuses for him but just trying to profile and understand why would something like this happen again and again at higher frequencies.

Guns and weapons definitely can be problematic, but the human element is important too. We care for earth enough to notice climate change. Maybe we also need to understand why extreme assholes are being born and raised more and more…

Oh yeah, I know, it’s all Trump’s and Billi’s fault.

[2ndMoparMan]

Religion is one of the sources for extremism.

[neanderthal]

Not finding excuses for him but just trying to profile and understand why would something like this happen again and again at higher frequencies.

Guns and weapons definitely can be problematic, but the human element is important too. We care for earth enough to notice climate change. Maybe we also need to understand why extreme assholes are being born and raised more and more…

Oh yeah, I know, it’s all Trump’s and Billi’s fault.

You're the only one here trying to "understand" the racists, so yes. Wear that shit with pride.

That edgy, contrarian, "i'm a deep thinker" schtik that you keep trying to project, it really comes across as racist sympathiser. You're either with, or against, the racists; there is no middle ground.

[neanderthal]

Religion is one of the primary sources for extremism.

And check mate.

<edited>

[Crazed_Insanity]

As far as I can tell, buffalo shooter and the Chinese shooter are not religious. I don’t understand how religion is at fault?


You're the only one here trying to "understand" the racists, so yes. Wear that shit with pride.

That edgy, contrarian, "i'm a deep thinker" schtik that you keep trying to project, it really comes across as racist sympathiser. You're either with, or against, the racists; there is no middle ground.

You know you sound very much like George W Bush? ;)

My position is against racism but hope to convert the racists. That’s what Jesus would do. Also, Jesus is not white so white people really don’t have exclusive rights to Jesus! :p

As for the China Taiwan issue, I’m all for peaceful willful reunification, but not by threat or force. This mini- Putin is repeating the same mistake.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/roommate-no-warning-signs-deadly-053843637.html

Okay, I was incorrect. The chinese shooter is actually a self proclaimed Christian. Even used black tape to make a cross on his car. However, he never talked about christianity... or about anything else according to his roommate in the above AP article. He also picked a 'taiwanese' church at random apparently. Anyway, do you guys really believe a follower of Christ would end up shooting up other followers of Christ? Somehow the Taiwanese Christians are threatening the Chinese Christians somehow? If the Bible never existed, this tragedy would never have happened?

Sigh..., if you guys really believe the root/main cause is religion... and if only we could censor all religions of the world and the world will end up a happier place, so be it. I just don't believe religion is the root cause. I really think the problem is the current human condition. Any ideology can end up with extremists who'd turn violent. Censoring the practice of religions or whatever ridiculous 'theories' won't really help sick assholes from becoming bigger assholes because that'll probably only push them underground and read each other's journals in secret.

I think that's another reason why I want free speech. I'd like to be able to actually talk to these people rather than shunning them. Of course I know I'm no psychologist nor am I powerful like Jesus, pretty sure they will probably put me on ignore too ;), but it's the least that I could do.

[Leon]

Anyway, do you guys really believe a follower of Christ would end up shooting up other followers of Christ?

Google, what is "The 30 years war"?

Google, tell me about : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_wars_of_religion

Engage critical thinking first, engage typing fingers at a point considerably after that, if at all.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I know there can be Christian extremists. No ideology is immuned to violent extremism. I know about the past history. I think it's due to that past history that we now have freedom of religion. Founding fathers realized how stupid it was for Christians to try to shut up or wipe out other Christians who do not share the same views. However, our current conversation is about these modern day shooters. Are the Taiwanese Christians trying to wipe out Chinese Christians here? It's also very clear based on evidence that the shooter did not shoot because of their different Christian views, but because of their political differences. Should we ban politics too? It's just too offensive so let's just ban political discussions? I think it's fine if you don't want to talk about it, but do you think banning politics will fix our world?

Google cannot critically think for us. Can you seriously conclude after critically thinking this thru and reach the conclusion that if Bible never existed, we would not have these shooters? Racism and hatred and all evils of the world stemmed from the Bible? If you can, can you share with me your thought process? In your own words, not some google link.

The right likes to parrot some idiot on Fox news. The left is also stuck similarly in their false ideology. A google link doesn't explain everything, does it?

[2ndMoparMan]

I know there can be Christian extremists. No ideology is immuned to violent extremism. I know about the past history. I think it's due to that past history that we now have freedom of religion. Founding fathers realized how stupid it was for Christians to try to shut up or wipe out other Christians who do not share the same views. However, our current conversation is about these modern day shooters. Are the Taiwanese Christians trying to wipe out Chinese Christians here? It's also very clear based on evidence that the shooter did not shoot because of their different Christian views, but because of their political differences. Should we ban politics too? It's just too offensive so let's just ban political discussions? I think it's fine if you don't want to talk about it, but do you think banning politics will fix our world?

Google cannot critically think for us. Can you seriously conclude after critically thinking this thru and reach the conclusion that if Bible never existed, we would not have these shooters? Racism and hatred and all evils of the world stemmed from the Bible? If you can, can you share with me your thought process? In your own words, not some google link.

The right likes to parrot some idiot on Fox news. The left is also stuck similarly in their false ideology. A google link doesn't explain everything, does it?

Yes, I do.

[Tom Servo]

Good write-up of what the QAnon universe has morphed itself into now that Q stopped posting back in late 2020.

The ReAwaken America Tour Is the Start of QAnon 2.0 (https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2022/05/the-reawaken-america-tour-is-the-start-of-qanon-2-0.html)

[FaultyMario]

"The unjustified and brutal invasion of Iraq".
(https://twitter.com/michaeldamianw/status/1527078137582047236?s=20&t=x57Z_WvBOc1MG8LTvQFApQ)
G. W. Bush, 5/18/2022.

[Yw-slayer]

Good write-up of what the QAnon universe has morphed itself into now that Q stopped posting back in late 2020.

The ReAwaken America Tour Is the Start of QAnon 2.0 (https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2022/05/the-reawaken-america-tour-is-the-start-of-qanon-2-0.html)

Man, I read this stuff and I just lol.

[neanderthal]

As far as I can tell, buffalo shooter and the Chinese shooter are not religious. I don’t understand how religion is at fault?



You know you sound very much like George W Bush? ;)

My position is against racism but hope to convert the racists. That’s what Jesus would do. Also, Jesus is not white so white people really don’t have exclusive rights to Jesus! :p

As for the China Taiwan issue, I’m all for peaceful willful reunification, but not by threat or force. This mini- Putin is repeating the same mistake.

You clearly read a different Bible than I did, because in my Bible Jesus didn't tolerate the moneychangers and Pharisees. You don't even know the religion you espouse.

[MR2 Fan]

W seems to not give any fucks anymore

In other news, we're all gonna get monkeypox now.

Mother Nature taking care of overpopulation?

I don't remember if I posted about this here, but recent changes in birth rates have slowed the estimated peak of global population, it could be well under the 10 Billion initially projected which is a good thing. At least they're estimating the peak that humanity won't go past (Things like access to medical care, better nutrition etc. actually lowers population growth and that's what we're seeing overall...let's thank the late great Hans Rosling for that education.) and that can be one less worrying factor in the grand scheme of the climate change (yes, that can also mean more used up resources by more countries becoming "first world"...a different argument.

[Crazed_Insanity]

You clearly read a different Bible than I did, because in my Bible Jesus didn't tolerate the moneychangers and Pharisees. You don't even know the religion you espouse.

If justices can read the same constitution and come up with different interpretations, so can we as we read the same Bible. Who’s truly right? Only the founding fathers or our Heavenly Father will know… you don’t need to shove your version of Christianity down my throat, right? Jesus only refused to tolerate sin, but he died for sinners.

I see the money changers of today as the wall st bankers and the Pharisees as the evangelical religious folks so into prolife and willing to deny people choices.

Anyway, since this is a political thread, let’s stick with politics. What do you think of this commentary: https://youtu.be/XmEvn5j0z7Q

[neanderthal]

https://youtu.be/HWzvEPIwoLI

Twenny years ago I was one of the few who were adamantly against the invasion of Iraq. I reiterated that Hans Blix didn't find ANY evidence of "weapons of mass destruction" and that there was NO justification for invading. (it's kinda fucking crazy to think that was in the early days of the internet as we know it!!!!) George W Bush with the epic Freudian slip.

I love my country but i'm also quick to criticize it where it's wrong. Not in the billi "i believe in free speech" way. WE OWE the Iraqis a fully rebuilt country. We. You. Me. We. We owe. Period. I didn't vote for that invasion, or the president that authorised it. A bunch of you didn't either, but we, collectively, through our military, fucked that country up big time. I would not be averse to paying a tax that would go to rebuilding that country. But the fuckers that profited of the invasion are the ones who really should bear the brunt of any kind of ... reparations. I don't even know if that is the right word.

And I really wish President Obama had prosecuted Bush for war crimes. I do. Didn't we use depleted uranium in some of the munitions there, and they ended up with a whole bunch of children born with deformities? Did we use the same kind of munitions in Syria? I don't know. Another fucking country we devastated although the reasons are murky. President Obama should have been man enough to NOT be goaded into being "tough on terror." Should he be prosecuted for war crimes as well. It's hard to say. I wouldn't argue against it.

It's crazy to think that fucking Trump is the only president with clean hands on the international front, in the last thirty years. Then again I shudder to think about the damage done to the climate by some of the things he rolled back. Fuck Trump.

This Ukraine thing, was not really our battle to fight and i'm glad Biden hasn't gotten us involved, although our munitions are involved, which, really, means we are involved.

Anyway, rant over.

[neanderthal]

W seems to not give any fucks anymore

In other news, we're all gonna get monkeypox now.

Mother Nature taking care of overpopulation?

I don't remember if I posted about this here, but recent changes in birth rates have slowed the estimated peak of global population, it could be well under the 10 Billion initially projected which is a good thing. At least they're estimating the peak that humanity won't go past (Things like access to medical care, better nutrition etc. actually lowers population growth and that's what we're seeing overall...let's thank the late great Hans Rosling for that education.) and that can be one less worrying factor in the grand scheme of the climate change (yes, that can also mean more used up resources by more countries becoming "first world"...a different argument.

Polio outbreak in Malawi too, I think. (Mozambique maybe?)

Shit science had gotten under control is raging again. Fuck Trump and his anti science minions. And fuck billi.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://youtu.be/HWzvEPIwoLI

Twenny years ago I was one of the few who were adamantly against the invasion of Iraq. I reiterated that Hans Blix didn't find ANY evidence of "weapons of mass destruction" and that there was NO justification for invading. (it's kinda fucking crazy to think that was in the early days of the internet as we know it!!!!) George W Bush with the epic Freudian slip.

I love my country but i'm also quick to criticize it where it's wrong. Not in the billi "i believe in free speech" way. WE OWE the Iraqis a fully rebuilt country. We. You. Me. We. We owe. Period. I didn't vote for that invasion, or the president that authorised it. A bunch of you didn't either, but we, collectively, through our military, fucked that country up big time. I would not be averse to paying a tax that would go to rebuilding that country. But the fuckers that profited of the invasion are the ones who really should bear the brunt of any kind of ... reparations. I don't even know if that is the right word.

And I really wish President Obama had prosecuted Bush for war crimes. I do. Didn't we use depleted uranium in some of the munitions there, and they ended up with a whole bunch of children born with deformities? Did we use the same kind of munitions in Syria? I don't know. Another fucking country we devastated although the reasons are murky. President Obama should have been man enough to NOT be goaded into being "tough on terror." Should he be prosecuted for war crimes as well. It's hard to say. I wouldn't argue against it.

It's crazy to think that fucking Trump is the only president with clean hands on the international front, in the last thirty years. Then again I shudder to think about the damage done to the climate by some of the things he rolled back. Fuck Trump.

This Ukraine thing, was not really our battle to fight and i'm glad Biden hasn't gotten us involved, although our munitions are involved, which, really, means we are involved.

Anyway, rant over.

Not sure why you posted the video, but on this rare occasion I actually agree with what you’re saying 100%! That blew my mind too!

Anyway, foque you too!

[neanderthal]

Yep. In another example of the outrage machine, people like Jesse Watters on Fox are calling kids "illegal babies" and Sean Hannity is showing pallets of powdered milk (labeled as not for kids under 1 year old) on his show and screaming that it's formula being kept from precious American babies.

You've also got Elise Stefanik, one of the higher ranked GOP members of the house, calling democrats "pedo grifters" while pretending to be outraged about the same thing.

The saddest part is that this outrage machine works. That, and a number of GOP people seem to be more than happy to incorporate QAnon ideas into their nonsense if it keeps their numbers up.
A bunch of Republicans voted AGAINST a $28 million bill that would have gone to airboats the baby formula shortage.


The "pro life" party.

[Rare White Ape]

Aus federal election is tomorrow.

Will we get a change of government and dig ourselves out of this shit show, or will Australian voters step on their own dicks once again?

[Yw-slayer]

OK, I mean, guys, I disagree with Billi on a lot of stuff. But we can't blame him for EVERYTHING.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yes we can ! Yes we can! :hard:

[Tom Servo]

Speaking of the oneunderscore_ account I linked to earlier, thought this was a good thread from him.



I want to tell a quick story.

The Buffalo shooter had a toothache.

You may have heard this by now, but the Buffalo shooter spent the six months before the shooting messaging himself on Discord.

He did it the same way you would email yourself a reminder. It was every stray thought he had for a half-year, archived as a sort of handbook.

In that Discord archive that's over 500 pages, the Buffalo shooter wrote about where he wanted to attack, his true motivations, even how badly he needed a haircut.

Minutes before the shooting, he sent it all to people he'd talked to on Discord, plus a livestream of his shooting.

The Discord archive are more illustrative than the manifesto itself, because it's what he actually believed, and not a knockoff term paper that plagiarized past mass shooters.

And, in it, one thing kept coming up.

The Buffalo shooter had a toothache he couldn't fix.

The Buffalo shooter apparently tried to get his bad tooth treated. He went to the dentist, and whatever the dentist tried didn't fix it.

He didn't, or couldn't, go anywhere else. He alluded to insurance problems.

But instead of blaming insurance or himself, he blamed the Jews.

The Buffalo shooter blamed the dentist, who he said was Jewish, but also Jews in general, who he was convinced were the cause of all his suffering.

He openly admitted he started feeling this way at the start of the pandemic, because of 4chan.

At the start of the pandemic, the Buffalo shooter said he moved over from 4chan's gun board to the white nationalist /pol/ board out of "extreme boredom."

He was inundated with the ideas that Jews were trying to "replace" whites on 4chan and social media, and he openly admits it.

Some other shooters read white nationalist literature, the dumb books like The Turner Diaries, which are posted as PDFs on 4chan.

But not the Buffalo shooter. He was a creature of the internet.

The middle of his manifesto is just copy-pasted antisemitic 4chan memes.

This is why the Buffalo shooter said he attacked the supermarket: He was, he said, "only shitposting in real life," serving a community of white nationalists he met online.

He was killing Black people because that community thought Jews were "replacing" white people with them.

Towards the end of his Discord archive, the Buffalo shooter was getting anxious. Initially he wanted to do the attack in March, but he kept pushing it back.

He wanted to do it soon, though, because he thought he would finally get help for his tooth from the healthcare in prison.

A new thing recently is to say that "disinformation" doesn't exist, that it's a "liberal" idea, or that it's masking real problems.

But disinformation is an accelerant. It provides facile, wrong, violent solutions to real problems that need solutions in our society.

Disinformation exists, and it exists mostly to shift the blame of infrastructural decay and resource limitations from the powerful to the powerless. (emphasis mine)

You can call it "information warfare" or "information operations" if you want, but it is real.

People are dead because of it.

The Buffalo shooter had a toothache.

He blamed Jews because his online community told him that they were the root of all evil.

He shot up a supermarket for revenge, but also because he wanted healthcare in prison.

Disinformation is real. So are the problems that make it seductive.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Like I said, if only we had better healthcare, mental and dental, maybe there'd be less white supremacists.

[neanderthal]

Like I said, if only we had better healthcare, mental and dental, maybe there'd be less white supremacists.

We'd have less white supremacists if there weren't people trying to understand them like you coddling their feelings every goddamn where.

fuck billi.

[Yw-slayer]

It is regrettable that the article's analysis is within a clickbaity "hook" which is likely to stoke emotions and cause outrage, and which is repeated several times throughout.

[neanderthal]

It is regrettable that the article's analysis is within a clickbaity "hook" which is likely to stoke emotions and cause outrage, and which is repeated several times throughout.

They do that all the time to humanise them to the public. He had a toothache. Boo fucking hoo. He shot killed 10 people.

If it's a black man killed by the cops and he once took a picture with gang members, or flashing a sign, wearing gang colors (never understood why my mum was against me buying blue or red stuff until years later!) or has a mug shot, that's the picture they show the public. To dehumanise them.

"The public is fickle my lord." The sister- in Gladiator.

[Tom Servo]

I feel I should make clear that Ben Collins is a longtime extremism and disinformation researcher and journalist. It was not intended to evoke sympathy. It was meant to show how disinformation exploits actual problems and causes some people blame the powerless for those problems. That these guys, including the shooter, use it to egg each other on and recruit others. It's intended to show that unfettered "free speech" on social media platforms exploits people and causes real violence and death. He specifically refers to him only as "the Buffalo shooter" in an effort to *not* humanize him.

I'm sorry your takeaway was that it was clickbaity. I've been following this guy for years, so maybe I come at it from another angle, but I 100% guarantee you that was not the original intention. It may also be that this was one of many threads since the attack, with more context that may have been clearer.

Also, it was an unrolled Twitter thread, so it probably didn't read as well as an actual article. Apologies if it came across as attempting to humanize that guy. I think I've made it pretty clear that I don't consider him worth humanizing and that I think attempts to explain away his actions are not something I'm okay with.

Suffice it to say, Billi's takeaway which I unfortunately saw due to a non-spoilered quote is pretty much the opposite of my feeling here, and pretty sure not Ben's either. At any rate, apologies. Definitely didn't mean to share something that appeared to be humanizing this inhumane garbage piece of shit.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Have you guys ever wonder why is it SO bad to humanize a terrorist, yet we complain that terrorists dehumanize us?

We all rationally know that it’s wrong to dehumanize humans. But if somebody done or say something you disagree with, then it’s okay to reduce a person down to just a stinky asshole?

Reality is we’re all human and we all have assholes. I really think the 1st rule of reverse polarization club ought to be never dehumanize a human being. Once we violate this rule, we become ‘terrorists’ to them! And we’ll just be terrorizing each other endlessly. War on terror can never be won!

The father out there getting his son a birthday cake… and the hero who went to mom’s church that day to thank the church for taking care of his dads funeral did nothing wrong. None deserve to die and nothing can justify those crimes, but the perpetrators are still human beings though.

[FaultyMario]

It is regrettable that the article's analysis is within a clickbaity "hook" which is likely to stoke emotions and cause outrage, and which is repeated several times throughout.

That's because it's not an article, it's a twitter thread that Servo patched together.

It is written in twitter's common syntax.

[Yw-slayer]

That's because it's not an article, it's a twitter thread that Servo patched together.

It is written in twitter's common syntax.

I've seen it on twitter. That formatting makes it even worse in terms of being clickbaity and outrage-inducing, as the first post ends with "toothache". It then comes across as being some flippant "story" about a guy with a toothache.

There is also an issue with that sort of framing when, traditionally, "stories" are also told to honour and remember the victims.

Given what Tom has said about the author, i'm not sure if the above was his intent. But from my perspective, it doesn't look good.

[Tom Servo]

That was what I did, and while I thought about patching it together into a more parenthetical layout, I didn't want to take artistic license there. In hindsight, maybe not the best decision.

[Yw-slayer]

BTW I'm also not blaming or criticising Swervo (or indeed anyone here).

[Tom Servo]

Well, shit, I'm sorry you feel that way, YW. I saw it as a story of someone who was already pre-disposed to radicalization using 4chan's /pol/ board to further radicalize and attempt to radicalize others, and partially using his struggles with insurance to further radicalize rather than actually blame it on the state of US healthcare. That he was all too willing to blame others rather than the actual problem.

I can definitely see how you'd take it that way rereading it, I hope you understand how I saw it and how I meant it to come across.

EDIT: Saw your post at the same time as mine and I figure you do. It'll definitely give me another angle to view posts like this - I'm a big fan of Ben Collins, but I can see how this attempts to excuse what he did.

EDIT 2: Especially seeing your edit YW, I think given context this would not have been your and neanderthal's takeaways, but with the lack of context I can absolutely see how this would be your takeaways. I will try to do better about keeping that in mind.

[Yw-slayer]

I can see that there is some interesting analysis within, but it's the apparent framing and tone that is regrettable. Again, not criticising you as obviously I assume you had good intentions, and I accept what you've previously mentioned about his background. In fact, that's one reason I have approached it from different angles.

This is probably not a good example, but imagine someone writing an article on Sept 13, 2001 starting with "I want to tell a quick story. The man who planned Sept 9 had a [minor ailment which is somehow linked to his extreme radicalisation]."

[Rare White Ape]

In happier news, the RWNJ government of Australia is goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooone

Fucken YEETED out the door.

We will be governed by a proper left-wing government for the next three years, and hopefully for many years more.

Here's to the progressive movement!

Updates here for those who might like to follow along: https://www.abc.net.au/news/elections/federal/2022/results?filter=all&sort=az&state=all

[FaultyMario]

This is probably not a good example, but imagine someone writing an article on Sept 13, 2001 starting with "I want to tell a quick story. The man who planned Sept 9 had a [minor ailment which is somehow linked to his extreme radicalisation]."

But that's exactly how extremism works, from the Nazis to the Khmer Rouge, systematized hate discourse makes common people believe their proverbial toothache is the product of the behavior of others, and that the only way to avoid such behavior is to eradicate a whole class of people.

In the same way that Al-qaeda brought attention to innovations in decentralized terrorist organizational practices, Qchan shines a light on decentralized supremacist propaganda.

[Tom Servo]

In happier news, the RWNJ government of Australia is goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooone

Fucken YEETED out the door.

We will be governed by a proper left-wing government for the next three years, and hopefully for many years more.

Here's to the progressive movement!

Updates here for those who might like to follow along: https://www.abc.net.au/news/elections/federal/2022/results?filter=all&sort=az&state=all

Nice!

[MR2 Fan]

In happier news, the RWNJ government of Australia is goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooone

Fucken YEETED out the door.

We will be governed by a proper left-wing government for the next three years, and hopefully for many years more.

Here's to the progressive movement!

Updates here for those who might like to follow along: https://www.abc.net.au/news/elections/federal/2022/results?filter=all&sort=az&state=all

:up:

[Yw-slayer]

But that's exactly how extremism works, from the Nazis to the Khmer Rouge, systematized hate discourse makes common people believe their proverbial toothache is the product of the behavior of others, and that the only way to avoid such behavior is to eradicate a whole class of people.

In the same way that Al-qaeda brought attention to innovations in decentralized terrorist organizational practices, Qchan shines a light on decentralized supremacist propaganda.

If that's the point supported by the analysis then so be it. The issue is with the manner in which it is written and presented, which comes across as being a cute and "quick story". Not an analysis.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don't understand why Elon has to openly abandon the dems and join the GOP. Perhaps he just couldn't be like Billi and end up pissing both sides off because he has business interests to protect? I guess he has to try to work with the lessor devil somehow? Like with GOP in the US and the CCP in China?

Anyway, I think he's making a huge mistake there... He probably should've saved his Twitter money and buy himself a new political party?

But anyways, now that the left has been pissed off, the Elongate scandals began!

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/elon-musk-trying-figure-racist-160000453.html

From trying to receive a happy ending on his plane from a flight attendant... to becoming a replacement theory believing white supremacist...

Yeah, let's hope Elon gets ruined and poor and canceled! Hope to see Tesla and SpaceX go bankrupt and wiped out! So that we can rely on the Chinese for EVs and Russians to get into space! Well, luckily Boeing got its starliner to work... so maybe we don't have to rely on the Russians. ;)

Anyway, politics really really sucks. Really wish people could take off their politically colored lenses and just find ways to work together rather than trying to 'replace' each other.

[FaultyMario]

"A billionaire supporting a conservative party1,2? Oh my god, that is such a big fucking surprise!"

1
As Ribuffo (2011) notes, "what Americans now call conservatism much of the world calls liberalism or neoliberalism".[175] American conservatism is a broad system of political beliefs in the United States that is characterized by respect for American traditions, support for Judeo-Christian values, economic liberalism, anti-communism and a defense of Western culture. Liberty within the bounds of conformity to conservatism is a core value, with a particular emphasis on strengthening the free market, limiting the size and scope of government and opposition to high taxes and government or labor union encroachment on the entrepreneur.

2
I think it became more and more urgent in the 1970s because the capitalist class was losing power and the influence of wealth and I think they wanted to recover what they felt was rightfully theirs. They used the situation in the 1970s to launch a really conscious program. It wasn't a conspiracy in the sense of a few people underground - it was fairly upfront. It was funding of the think tanks like Manhattan Institute and all of the rest of it to produce a counter-narrative as to what the nature of the problems were--and those problems really focused on that the workers had too much power. They had to be somehow disciplined. And the big question was how to go about doing that. So there emerged then this political project to try to attack working class power. There had been attempts to do so by mobilizing immigration through the immigration reform in this country in 1965. But that didn't seem to work. So then if you couldn't bring in the workers you took capital out to where the labour was... and so you start to get this shift towards pushing towards globalization which was facilitated by some technological changes in transport.

A lot of the ideology was of course about free markets and competition and so on, and actually, of course a lot of the practice was about monopoly control and all of the rest of it. So there is the ideology. There is the notion you will find in some places which is that it was a set of public policies and public policy people decided to take things in a different direction. People got very upset about levels of debt and wanted to retire the debt and so you get the notion of austerity as a public policy.


Emphasis mine.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, it's fairly typical for rich people to favor the conservative party; however, Elon has not been the typical billionaire though. For one, his latest ventures are not favored by conservative 'people'. Most conservatives don't like EVs and thought Tesla was just sucking government funding. Fighting climate change, a cause they don't typically believe in. Similarly, conservatives don't really care about space exploration. SpaceX is also sucking up lots of government funding. Conservatives would rather money be spent on walls trapping themselves in it. (Unless they found lots of gold on the moon or mars...)

Lastly, most billionaires are into profits. Not saying Elon doesn't care about profit, but I think his focus is a bit different from other billionaires. His singular vision is to get his ass to mars! Most of his products and services are actually catered to liberals. Moving HQ to Texas for tax reasons is understandable, but to actually offend liberals this way is just not a very wise business strategy for him. It's not like he's selling oil and chicken filet...

Anyway, there'll always be a constant power struggle between the rich and the working class, similar to the power struggle between right and left. However, one thing people need to realize is that we cannot completely get rid of the other side. What'll happen to all the workers if the boss is canceled? What will happen to the bosses if there are no workers as we've experienced during the pandemic? The power struggle ought to help us find the right balance between the 2, not to 'replace' one another.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Fuck!

Another shooting.

This time a bunch of elementary school kids dead… :(

I guess Texas cops is not into safely apprehending the suspect. But then again, these shooters probably have a death wish anyways… sigh…

[Tom Servo]

14 children and one teacher dead in an elementary school shooting in Uvalde, Texas.

[FaultyMario]

Elon has not been the typical billionaire though.

The guy who was born into blood emerald money? the guy whose seed capital came from welfare subsidies? the guy who exhibits typical slave-owner behavior on his companies employees?

That guy? Or are you talking about some other guy?

[Tom Servo]

Was just reading a post from a guy the other day who found that Tesla's battery swapping stations, which it was using to get over nine figures in subsidies from the state of California as part of being environmentally friendly, were actually just diesel generators recharging the batteries.

Thread from the automotive journalist who uncovered it: https://twitter.com/Tweetermeyer/status/1527658189784854528

[Crazed_Insanity]

The guy who was born into blood emerald money? the guy whose seed capital came from welfare subsidies? the guy who exhibits typical slave-owner behavior on his companies employees?

That guy? Or are you talking about some other guy?

Yeah, talking about the same guy.

This isn't just another steel or railroad or oil tycoon.

I think it's clear he is a slave driver, I've talked to some SpaceX interns who enjoyed the gig for a while, but wouldn't want to stay there long term! :p However, he's not even your average slave driver. The guy works as hard as his slaves! Also, this intern has the free will to choose whether to work for Elon... or not! This isn't real slavery. Desiring highly conscientious employees isn't a crime. He wants employees that can get the job done. The results speak for themselves!

When is the last time somebody succeeded in starting a car company? Let alone an electric car company?

When is the last time somebody succeeded in not only landing rockets, but also made it cheaper than well established competitors?

You can complain about Elon stealing from tax subsidies all you want, but pretty sure most of us could be stealing billions of dollars from the government and still be producing absolutely nothing. That's why I'd rather Elon legally 'steal' the money necessary and get it to work.

Anyway, main differences in Elon is that I don't see him doing this just to enrich and enjoy himself. Unlike most other billionaires. Warren Buffet is another one that lives a modest life for his net worth, but Mr. Buffet produces absolutely nothing physical in return though.

I am a bit concerned lately with Elon getting way more political than necessary... and possibly distract him from getting stuff done though.

Anyway, at least for me, this world definitely would NOT be a better place without Tesla cars and SpaceX rockets. Without Elon Musk, I'm pretty sure there won't be anyone capable of creating similar EVs or rockets.

[FaultyMario]

Uh, our capitalist society is not about individuals doing things, it's about the sum of collective actions. For example, Vanguard and Blackrock own about 10% of Google, and those two companies are responsible for managing the pension funds of hundreds of thousands of people.

But hey, I will not divert your attention from all the big noises and shiny things...

[Crazed_Insanity]

But I am talking about an individual who collectively slavedrives a group of like minded folks to create fancy EVs and reusable rockets.

Are you telling me you cannot tell the difference between Elon Musk and a typical private equity fund managers?

(Who typically not only created nothing, but probably also left behind bunch of financial messes. That is the kind of capitalism which I dislike. Warren Buffet is already the best example we can hopeful, but even Warren buffet contributes nothing much to the overall GDP, right?)

[Tom Servo]

Just so happy to see Perdue, who Trump vehemently supported in GA for governor, just get absolutely fucking trounced.

[Rare White Ape]

Vanguard and Blackrock own about 10% of Google, and those two companies are responsible for managing the pension funds of hundreds of thousands of people.

Do you guys have NFP funds who's profits go back to members?

[FaultyMario]

Us? no, we're the no-benefits generation.

it might be different for our northern brethren.

[FaultyMario]

Aww Billi! that's cute, but totally wrong.

Financial services create capital. In a world where land and labor are limited, the creation of capital is paramount.

If you think the owner of Tesla is anything like the original Tesla, there's nothing i can say to you.

[Crazed_Insanity]

The problem with the original Tesla is that he lacked the know how to raise capital. Elon Musk is most likely smarter than me, but probably not quite as smart as the original Tesla, but Elon also has the skills needed to raise capital rather than relying on other investors/bankers.

Financial services creating capital investments is a great thing if the investments resulted in actual creation of something. Unfortunately, most of the money raised by private equity firms are probably used for speculative BS.

Just as crypto currencies could certainly be utilized to create something productive, but for the most part, crypto currencies, like any other fiat currencies are useless just sitting there. Their values going up and down makes absolutely no difference to this physical world if you don't cash out and spend it on something.

Tesla stocks are probably way over valued. However, thankfully, at least there are Tesla cars running around and influencing the rest of the auto makers to all invest more on EVs. Not to mention Elon gave up Tesla's intellectual property rights. Most billionaires probably won't do that, right?

The market is also full of companies like Enron, Theranos, based purely on BS. But thankfully BS companies eventually do go down and won't last long.

Point is, I do realize the importance of capital or capitalism; however, capitalism needs to be utilized to produce goods that can benefit people. If it's all about increasing capital and nothing else, then it just a cancerous tumor.

To me, Warren Buffet would be a benign tumor. Won't harm the body, but still kinda useless.

Elon's companies have more actual muscles, capable of actually moving our world to some place... better or worse...

If only the original Tesla had the same entrepreneur skills as Elon, our world probably would be a much better place.

Anyway, of all the billionaires in the world today, which one do you admire most? Let's forget about original Tesla. He died poor.

Or are you telling me all billionaires could just go to hell once they become that wealthy? I just thought Elon is a pretty unique kind of billionaire that's all. No, I don't think he's perfect like God, but if more billionaires could be more like him, I wouldn't mind. At least he tried to help whenever he can when he really doesn't have to. You know, like sending submarines to save kids or starlinks to help Ukrainians? Whether you agree with him or not, at least he is trying to help whenever he sees problems.

The only other billionaire that's more helpful than Elon is probably Jeff Bezos' ex-wife. ;)

[Tom Servo]

Just so happy to see Perdue, who Trump vehemently supported in GA for governor, just get absolutely fucking trounced.

Looks like Raffensberger also won over the candidate Trump hand-picked to try to oust him. Hoping this will be a signal to other Republicans that you don't actually have to toe the "stolen election" line to get GOP votes.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Biden narrowly defeated Trump back in 2020 in GA. So I wonder if these upsets were just due to Georgians' dislike of Trump or will this be a national trend? Hopefully a national trend.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Looks like this latest shooter broke all the stereotypes, except the quiet loner qualities. No manifestos of any kind other than telling his 'girlfriend' in germany with private texts... that he's gonna shoot his grandma and then elementary school kids. So far we just haven't seen any political, religious nor racial cause of any kind. Also no history of mental issues too.

So I guess the root causes are probably just lonely warped souls with easy access to assault weapons. Thanks to internet, it's also very easy to be copycats. I really thought Sandy Hook will be a turning point... :(

[G'day Mate]

I really thought Sandy Hook will be a turning point... :(

It's unconscionable that it wasn't. I've seen a few quotes along the lines of school shootings being a "uniquely American way to die".

[Yw-slayer]

Onion headline. Sadly.

[Tom Servo]

It's awfully weird that a week ago Republicans were telling us that teachers are groomers trying to turn your kids gay or trans, and now they want to give teachers guns and body armor.

[Rare White Ape]

Well, gays are for satan, and guns are for Jesus.

Let us pray.

[Rare White Ape]

If anyone here takes any interest in Australian politics, you should read this.

He was probably worse than Trump, but didn't have the backup to do what he wanted.

https://theshot.net.au/opinion-news/requiem-for-a-lost-country/?fbclid=IwAR0SENkcEn3tAWVJAT9EpymMUTE-SYUXthvNwQeA-LB8IVJ0P0dvvM8YWvU

[Crazed_Insanity]

I think it’s fair to say that Aussies generally have more sense than the Americans!

Also, voters can see for themselves that the antiestablishment nationalists have failed to bring about the kind of change voters wanted. Glad to see this nationalist tide receding around the world.

However, I’m not really looking forward to the ‘usual’ way of doing things, which was the reason why this crazy tide began in the 1st place. Hope all of our politicians learned their lessons and adjust their ways accordingly.

[Tom Servo]

Oh yeah, I forgot he had that whole connection to a prominent QAnon guy in Australia

[Jason]

It's awfully weird that a week ago Republicans were telling us that teachers are groomers trying to turn your kids gay or trans, and now they want to give teachers guns and body armor.

Not only that, it speaks to not trusting cops anymore as being "good guys" that will stop "bad guys"

(and frankly this isn't even touching on the idea that this is treating the symptom, not the cause of these attacks, but that's America for you)

[George]

Not only that, it speaks to not trusting cops anymore as being "good guys" that will stop "bad guys"

I really want to give a reasonable reply to this and not sound like I'm anti-police or just lashing out at an easy target because society continues to crumble so quickly with no (pleasant) end in sight.

But, it is obvious that the police, at least around here, have been having a "work slowdown" since the summer of 2020. I'm not saying I blame them - I wouldn't and couldn't do what they do and I damn sure wouldn't risk my life every day and have it all filmed with a body-cam besides.

I'm just saying their lack of involvement with the public has become very noticeable.

I almost never see patrol cars anymore, and I work three blocks from a police station near the state capitol! It's not so bad in the suburbs, but the part of Denver I visit a few times per week (and every weekday from early 2016 to March of 2020) has turned into an ugly, scary-looking place with tent cities everywhere, bums with cardboard signs on every corner, and boarded-up buildings covered with graffiti.

Just the block I work on has gone from a decent-looking residential/business neighborhood to looking pretty crappy in a short time. The building across the street used to have a hippie bar where jam bands played at night, a dry-cleaning/laundry business, offices, and a little community theatre. Now it's all closed up and covered in spray paint. I walk past it regularly to get to the FedEx office to drop off stuff and I see old clothes and empty bottles and all kinds of trash littering the doorways and sidewalks all around. It's just like all the surrounding blocks. And most of this is just since the summer of 2020.

Especially infuriating to this commuter with a 20+ mile drive each way is the complete lack of traffic law enforcement resulting in crazies at both ends of the driving spectrum seemingly outnumbering law-abiding drivers - highly aggressive, stop-sign running speeders vs. unaware slowpokes who drive ten miles an hour below the speed limit (and they run stop signs too!). No one is afraid of being pulled over anymore.

Soon I'll be leaving the office and going to the post office as I do most Friday afternoons. It is rare not to get panhandled both going and and coming out of the place on foot, and then I have to wait to get back into traffic next to a bus stop in the potholed parking lot of a liquor store that's just crawling with crazies no matter what time of day it is.

I've seen them staggering around in the street begging and/or threatening motorists, half or whom are staring at their smart-phones and can't be bothered to watch for the traffic light to turn green or even to have a license plate on the back of their cars. I have to use my horn to wake up sleepy stoners behind the wheel so often at stoplights that I feel like a New York cabbie. Seems to me, all it would take to break up this one particular traffic and pedestrian trouble spot is to have a police car slowly drive by and sometimes park for a while every couple of hours for a few days. But they don't seem to do that anymore, judging from the ever-present group of people on that block who are not just waiting for the bus.

These are just observations from my little corner of the world. I respect cops for the incredibly difficult job they have, but as a group, they seem to have retreated from being seen in public, and the public has reacted accordingly.

[Crazed_Insanity]

In my new purple neighborhood in Puyallup,WA still has lots of police presence. Even back in LA during the pandemic we still have police around my city. I think I’ve mentioned here, not sure which thread, that police dropped in on my driveway wanted to check out my RV one time… dreaming about how he wants to get one after he retires…

Anyway, my suspicion is that police probably has retreated in big cities. Why bother risking your lives catching criminals when public doesn’t appreciate you and these criminals can usually be released quickly by the courts anyways. It is probably a very demoralizing job at this point.

Even for the police at that Texas school. You are damned if you force yourself in risk getting killed by superior fire power and you’re also damned by waiting outside trying and hoping to negotiate with this guy who barricaded himself inside…

Anyway, you have to really love your job to keep on doing police work now.

That brings us to the point that if a professional police could hesitated with such a shooter, what hope would an armed teacher or a retired old veteran has?

[Tom Servo]

I feel like you're not wrong, but that there's probably more to it. I think the amount of homeless people has massively increased, which I think has a lot to do with both investment home buying and things like AirBnB, which have both drastically decreased the housing market for people who actually want to live in a home and drive housing prices through the roof. That said, that doesn't explain how I also have seen that traffic law enforcement seems almost non-existent. I'm still the kind of person who basically half-panics with an officer behind me and will behave to the letter of the law, but I watch people all around me while that happens do just the dumbest shit and the officers don't seem to care much. I had a Corvette once nearly hit me while riding in a bike lane in front of a motorcycle cop, I looked at him and held out my hand, Picard style, like "anything?" and he just shrugged.

That said, the body-cam thing feels like a natural byproduct of the whole atmosphere of looking out for their own. If you're not going to hold your fellow officers accountable for whatever reason, that's the natural outcome. The police and sheriff unions out here have an ungodly amount of sway over the local government and local elections and, except in the most egregious of cases, will do just about anything in their power to keep the bad ones in their jobs. Admittedly, that is the union's job, to protect the officers, so it's not like I can really fault them there. It's more that they, unlike most unions, have an out-of-balance level of power.

Then there's the "rules for thee and not for me" kinda thing. The latest here is probably mask mandates - the LASD literally said they didn't care and wouldn't enforce them, and LAPD officers basically almost never wear one, so of course nobody else really seems to be too worried about the mandates or breaking the rules. It's not a new thing, it's been a running joke since I first got my driver's license that if you see Crown Vic headlights behind you at night, but then you see them use a turn signal, you know it's not a cop. There's always an outlier, I saw one officer at a train station on my way back from the Science Center the other day wearing one, but he was the first one I've seen in...maybe the whole pandemic?

I know that it's only a few bad apples for any given department, but everyone seems to forget the second part of that phrase.

[neanderthal]

It's awfully weird that a week ago Republicans were telling us that teachers are groomers trying to turn your kids gay or trans, and now they want to give teachers guns and body armor.

All them "tiger moms" defending their kids against the evils of CRT at schoolboard meetings; also conspicuously silent.

Saw a tweet from a black educator that if he was teaching CRT in the classroom the cops wouldn't have waited for 90 minutes.

[neanderthal]

Not only that, it speaks to not trusting cops anymore as being "good guys" that will stop "bad guys"

(and frankly this isn't even touching on the idea that this is treating the symptom, not the cause of these attacks, but that's America for you)

Been black peoples reality for decades; the cops are not there to protect you- they're there to protect corporate interests.

[neanderthal]

All the idiots trying to foist guns on teachers ... don't trust said teachers with a curriculum.

[Tom Servo]

lulz.

https://i.imgur.com/8CtWqRE.png

[neanderthal]

I really want to give a reasonable reply to this and not sound like I'm anti-police or just lashing out at an easy target because society continues to crumble so quickly with no (pleasant) end in sight.

But, it is obvious that the police, at least around here, have been having a "work slowdown" since the summer of 2020. I'm not saying I blame them - I wouldn't and couldn't do what they do and I damn sure wouldn't risk my life every day and have it all filmed with a body-cam besides.

I'm just saying their lack of involvement with the public has become very noticeable.

I almost never see patrol cars anymore, and I work three blocks from a police station near the state capitol! It's not so bad in the suburbs, but the part of Denver I visit a few times per week (and every weekday from early 2016 to March of 2020) has turned into an ugly, scary-looking place with tent cities everywhere, bums with cardboard signs on every corner, and boarded-up buildings covered with graffiti.

Just the block I work on has gone from a decent-looking residential/business neighborhood to looking pretty crappy in a short time. The building across the street used to have a hippie bar where jam bands played at night, a dry-cleaning/laundry business, offices, and a little community theatre. Now it's all closed up and covered in spray paint. I walk past it regularly to get to the FedEx office to drop off stuff and I see old clothes and empty bottles and all kinds of trash littering the doorways and sidewalks all around. It's just like all the surrounding blocks. And most of this is just since the summer of 2020.

Especially infuriating to this commuter with a 20+ mile drive each way is the complete lack of traffic law enforcement resulting in crazies at both ends of the driving spectrum seemingly outnumbering law-abiding drivers - highly aggressive, stop-sign running speeders vs. unaware slowpokes who drive ten miles an hour below the speed limit (and they run stop signs too!). No one is afraid of being pulled over anymore.

Soon I'll be leaving the office and going to the post office as I do most Friday afternoons. It is rare not to get panhandled both going and and coming out of the place on foot, and then I have to wait to get back into traffic next to a bus stop in the potholed parking lot of a liquor store that's just crawling with crazies no matter what time of day it is.

I've seen them staggering around in the street begging and/or threatening motorists, half or whom are staring at their smart-phones and can't be bothered to watch for the traffic light to turn green or even to have a license plate on the back of their cars. I have to use my horn to wake up sleepy stoners behind the wheel so often at stoplights that I feel like a New York cabbie. Seems to me, all it would take to break up this one particular traffic and pedestrian trouble spot is to have a police car slowly drive by and sometimes park for a while every couple of hours for a few days. But they don't seem to do that anymore, judging from the ever-present group of people on that block who are not just waiting for the bus.

These are just observations from my little corner of the world. I respect cops for the incredibly difficult job they have, but as a group, they seem to have retreated from being seen in public, and the public has reacted accordingly.

Um, they are paid to run into those dangerous situations. It's literally their job. You call 911 so that the police come to "protect and serve." If they didn't want to run into those dangerous situations, they should've become an accountant.

They have to wear those body cams because they keep protecting the bad apples among them. Not because they ran into a mass shooting event. The shady shit where people like me get royally fucked because we had a tail light that was out, or didn't come to a complete stop. And then "the good guys" say nothing and do nothing, and don't include that shit in their report. Meanwhile someone just got Rodney King'd and is lying in a hospital about to get several hundred thousand in hospital bills from the hands of an over zealous cop. All for a traffic misdemeanor. That's why they have to wear the body cams. If they don't like it, tough.

As they like to say "if you have nothing to hide ..."

[Rare White Ape]

Um, they are paid to run into those dangerous situations. It's literally their job. You call 911 so that the police come to "protect and serve." If they didn't want to run into those dangerous situations, they should've become an accountant.

This sentence says a lot too.

Many cops do it simply because they get to wear the badge and uniform and look tough among the citizens. As soon as the action ramps up they melt.

Should've joined the army instead. Nah, that would require doing something.

Should have stayed in the army. Yeah, they still get to harass brown people and have the benefit of a warm shower and a soft bed at the end of a shift.

[Rikadyn]

https://i.redd.it/3hffk5xud8291.png

[neanderthal]

https://i.redd.it/3hffk5xud8291.png

Lionised by society as heros.

I liked what Beau of the Fifth column said in one of his videos recently "the way of the warrior is death." He then went on to explain that, but it boiled down to; you should be ready to stare death in the eye and say "fuck you, i'm not scared of you, i've been preparing for you my whole life."

Teachers, are heros.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I think society should have realistic expectations of police… that they are not and never will be perfect. Sometimes they can be overly aggressive and other times they could hesitate longer then they should.

Bottom line is I hope they’ll learn from their mistakes, and politicians should not blindly increase their funding due to failures. Likewise I hope we can make incremental changes to make things harder for future mass shooters. Even I agree that we can’t rely on prayers alone!

Conservatives still think its mental health? Okay, so how do we provide mental health to all Americans? Can we have more affordable healthcare now? Or you still wish to repeal that when you get a chance?

Anyway, back to police, you guys are really looking down on them, but let’s not forget an hour or so later, it was still a law enforcement who neutralized the shooter.

There are heros in every profession and every profession can screw up some times…, but once you wear a political lens, all cops are bad and all teachers are heros…

[neanderthal]

I think society should have realistic expectations of police… that they are not and never will be perfect. Sometimes they can be overly aggressive and other times they could hesitate longer then they should.

Bottom line is I hope they’ll learn from their mistakes, and politicians should not blindly increase their funding due to failures. Likewise I hope we can make incremental changes to make things harder for future mass shooters. Even I agree that we can’t rely on prayers alone!

Conservatives still think its mental health? Okay, so how do we provide mental health to all Americans? Can we have more affordable healthcare now? Or you still wish to repeal that when you get a chance?

Anyway, back to police, you guys are really looking down on them, but let’s not forget an hour or so later, it was still a law enforcement who neutralized the shooter.

There are heros in every profession and every profession can screw up some times…, but once you wear a political lens, all cops are bad and all teachers are heros…

It was a border patrol agent who got him. Not a policeman. Sure, law enforcement, but lets be clear that the police were NOT the ones who got him. They stood outside in the hallway for bloody evah!!

No one has said all cops are bad. Even I have said there are good cops and bad cops. But i've also said that it's hard to separate the good cops from the bad cops when they (good cops) won't excise the bad ones from their midst.

[neanderthal]

This Twitter thread about student debt relief voting.

https://twitter.com/MuellerSheWrote/status/1531078765589106695?t=zjJKLQQlvjEry32EFadGtQ&s=19

Got me in the feels.

[neanderthal]

This Twitter thread about student debt relief voting.

https://twitter.com/MuellerSheWrote/status/1531078765589106695?t=zjJKLQQlvjEry32EFadGtQ&s=19

Got me in the feels.

3915

Of course posting from my phone just results in shit!

It says

Democratic Party Accomplishments

* Womens right to vote (Woodrow Wilson.)
* Social SSecurity (FDR)
* Minimum wage (FDR)
* Unemployment Insurance 9FDR)
* Rural electrification act (FDR)
* FDIC bank account insurance (FDR)
* GI Bill of rights (FDR)
* Securities and Exchange Act (FDR)
* Marshall plan (Truman.)
* NATO (Truman.)
* School lunch program (Truman.)
* Water quality act of 1948 (Truman)
* Peace Corps (Kennedy.)
* First man on the moon (Kennedy)
* Civil Rights Act 1964 (LBJ.)
* Voting Rights Act (LBJ.)
* Medicare (LBJ.)
* MEdicaid (LBJ.)
* Guaranteed Pell Student Load Program (LBJ.)
* Operation Head Start (LBJ.)
* Workers Comp
* Motor Voter Act (Clinton.)
* Clinton Budget Act (Clinton.)
* Family and Medical Leave Act (Clinton.)
* Affordable Care Act (Obama.)

Now name a singe Republican accomplishment if you can

[FaultyMario]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTCXGAeLGHw

[neanderthal]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTCXGAeLGHw

I saw that on twitter this morning and followed him immediately. They've got a whole series of pranks and so on; making Ted Cruz sign a copy of the national enquirer that had trump stating his dad was responsible for Kennedys death, etc

[Rare White Ape]

No one has said all cops are bad. Even I have said there are good cops and bad cops. But i've also said that it's hard to separate the good cops from the bad cops when they (good cops) won't excise the bad ones from their midst.

If there’s one population of people that the police are good at protecting, it’s themselves. And this is where the paradox of being a “good cop” comes into play.

Someone joins the police force with the intention of being a “good cop” and witnesses incidents of misconduct among their colleagues. That person has two choices:

1. Report it, and then get bullied and hounded out of the job by colleagues and superiors
2. Keep it quiet and allow misconduct to continue in order to remain in the job

The end result of either option is that by definition, there are no good cops. ACTUAL good cops leave the job, therefore, there are no good cops.

Now, this culture may have changed since I came upon the above realisation. I fucking HOPE it has changed. But it is in evidence of having occurred within the past five years in a number of jurisdictions.

[neanderthal]

If there’s one population of people that the police are good at protecting, it’s themselves. And this is where the paradox of being a “good cop” comes into play.

Someone joins the police force with the intention of being a “good cop” and witnesses incidents of misconduct among their colleagues. That person has two choices:

1. Report it, and then get bullied and hounded out of the job by colleagues and superiors
2. Keep it quiet and allow misconduct to continue in order to remain in the job

The end result of either option is that by definition, there are no good cops. ACTUAL good cops leave the job, therefore, there are no good cops.

Now, this culture may have changed since I came upon the above realisation. I fucking HOPE it has changed. But it is in evidence of having occurred within the past five years in a number of jurisdictions.

You get no argument from me on that my friend. If you're a "good cop" tolerating bad cops in your midst, ... it really begs the question of how good you are.

It's a very grey area, that is quite black and white.

[Crazed_Insanity]

3915

Of course posting from my phone just results in shit!

It says

Democratic Party Accomplishments

* Womens right to vote (Woodrow Wilson.)
* Social SSecurity (FDR)
* Minimum wage (FDR)
* Unemployment Insurance 9FDR)
* Rural electrification act (FDR)
* FDIC bank account insurance (FDR)
* GI Bill of rights (FDR)
* Securities and Exchange Act (FDR)
* Marshall plan (Truman.)
* NATO (Truman.)
* School lunch program (Truman.)
* Water quality act of 1948 (Truman)
* Peace Corps (Kennedy.)
* First man on the moon (Kennedy)
* Civil Rights Act 1964 (LBJ.)
* Voting Rights Act (LBJ.)
* Medicare (LBJ.)
* MEdicaid (LBJ.)
* Guaranteed Pell Student Load Program (LBJ.)
* Operation Head Start (LBJ.)
* Workers Comp
* Motor Voter Act (Clinton.)
* Clinton Budget Act (Clinton.)
* Family and Medical Leave Act (Clinton.)
* Affordable Care Act (Obama.)

Now name a singe Republican accomplishment if you can

Granted, ever since Lincoln, Republican Party hasn’t been the same and going down hill…

Their singular most amazing accomplishment is their ability to hold on to power without having to accomplish much for the American people. So freaking weird. Anyway, besides that paradoxical accomplishment, I’d also credit a republican president for ending the Cold War. Reagan was probably the last GOP president who I thought looked cool. Maybe because he’s a good actor.

[FaultyMario]

If you've ever wondered what would happen if Xzibit was involved in a shootout, click here (https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/crime/shooting-incident-north-st-louis-county-grocery-store-wellston-food-market/63-d569c7f8-e6ba-4f09-9181-bd73079d7b1a).

[neanderthal]

Granted, ever since Lincoln, Republican Party hasn’t been the same and going down hill…

Their singular most amazing accomplishment is their ability to hold on to power without having to accomplish much for the American people. So freaking weird. Anyway, besides that paradoxical accomplishment, I’d also credit a republican president for ending the Cold War. Reagan was probably the last GOP president who I thought looked cool. Maybe because he’s a good actor.


Aren't you the very idiot that constantly says both parties are the same?!?!?!? Aintcha?

Yet, here you are ... <checks notes,> saying the Republicans have done nothing for the American people, as a contrast to the Democrats.

The Gordian knots you twist your mouth into to keep spinning your anti Democrat lies ...

[Crazed_Insanity]

Both are kinda the same… take min wage for example… it’s a nice idea, but BS idea if it isn’t tied to inflation. When people making min wage end up living under poverty, what difference does it make whether we have min wage law or not?

Social security is tied to inflation, but then executed so poorly that we always hear that it’s gonna go bankrupt by the time we retire…

No benefits vs unsustainable benefits…yeah, I guess it’s not exactly the same. Better something than nothing. Dem is great on paper, but reality is often more disappointing, which gave GOP, the party which accomplished nothing, the opportunity to take over sometimes…

I am critical of both parties, but I do prefer dems on paper over the GOP. I’d usually vote for dems or progressives or just stayed home. I don’t believe I’ve ever voted for GOP anybody…

I'm only critical of dems because I’m frustrated that they couldn’t do better. I see it as constructive criticisms. If you can't even take constructive criticisms and wish to believe you can do no wrong, then you are pretty much the same kinda bad as the GOP.

Obviously you know what's wrong with the Dems too. If those same words I'm quoting below came out of my mouth, you'd go ballistic.



https://youtu.be/HWzvEPIwoLI

Twenny years ago I was one of the few who were adamantly against the invasion of Iraq. I reiterated that Hans Blix didn't find ANY evidence of "weapons of mass destruction" and that there was NO justification for invading. (it's kinda fucking crazy to think that was in the early days of the internet as we know it!!!!) George W Bush with the epic Freudian slip.

I love my country but i'm also quick to criticize it where it's wrong. Not in the billi "i believe in free speech" way. WE OWE the Iraqis a fully rebuilt country. We. You. Me. We. We owe. Period. I didn't vote for that invasion, or the president that authorised it. A bunch of you didn't either, but we, collectively, through our military, fucked that country up big time. I would not be averse to paying a tax that would go to rebuilding that country. But the fuckers that profited of the invasion are the ones who really should bear the brunt of any kind of ... reparations. I don't even know if that is the right word.

And I really wish President Obama had prosecuted Bush for war crimes. I do. Didn't we use depleted uranium in some of the munitions there, and they ended up with a whole bunch of children born with deformities? Did we use the same kind of munitions in Syria? I don't know. Another fucking country we devastated although the reasons are murky. President Obama should have been man enough to NOT be goaded into being "tough on terror." Should he be prosecuted for war crimes as well. It's hard to say. I wouldn't argue against it.

It's crazy to think that fucking Trump is the only president with clean hands on the international front, in the last thirty years. Then again I shudder to think about the damage done to the climate by some of the things he rolled back. Fuck Trump.

This Ukraine thing, was not really our battle to fight and i'm glad Biden hasn't gotten us involved, although our munitions are involved, which, really, means we are involved.

Anyway, rant over.

When it comes to war crimes, the 2 parties are getting closer and closer of being the same...

[Crazed_Insanity]

I just heard Maverick's flight jacket was digitally restored with proper patches of Japanese and Taiwan flags!!!

I guess thanks to Covid lockdown and Chinese investor pulling out, Paramount has decided to not bend their knees to the CCP!

Anyway, just glad that Paramount has realized their foolishness 2 years ago. Maverick's flight jacket really doesn't mean anything politically. It was kinda annoying to see such 'censorship' because CCP finds it offensive. I just find it amazing Paramount actually decided to spend addition money to restore the patches post production.

Politics is really stupid. Just enjoy the darn fictional movie! :p

[Tom Servo]

From PragerU, that bastion of conservative wisdom.



Young people are enamored with "anti-racist" rhetoric because they think they are fighting racist systems in America. The TRUTH is they are fighting America itself and the very values the country was founded on.


https://new-cdn.mamamia.com.au/mamamia-pwa.appspot.com/cms_images/variations/596x397.3333333333333-789086803473.jpg

[2ndMoparMan]

Prager is as bad as The Discovery Institute and AiG.

[neanderthal]

From PragerU, that bastion of conservative wisdom.



https://new-cdn.mamamia.com.au/mamamia-pwa.appspot.com/cms_images/variations/596x397.3333333333333-789086803473.jpg

To me the quote says America's values are racist.


Maybe i'm reading it wrong.

[neanderthal]

Prager is as bad as The Discovery Institute and AiG.

There's not ONE right wing ... pundit/ politician/ speaker/ anything I have any kind of respect for. NOT ONE.

The writing has been on the wall for a few decades now; we've peeled the layers of Reagans presidency and found rot to the core. And nothing better going forward. Failing to strongly distance themselves from the racist elements within them, nevermind that bumblefuck Trump. Not ONE!

[Crazed_Insanity]

You were peeling the layers of Obama admin as well and would not argue against possibly prosecuting him for war crime. Please note your high standards even with somebody of your own race and party... what hope would any of the GOP politicians have? :p

Only ONE could be faultless and blameless and that would be Jesus Christ, but even he got crucified by the religious right and liberal left of his time because people thought he's offensive to them and found it necessary to shut him up.

Anyway, not really sure what PragerU was trying to say with what Swervo has quoted..., but I do get the impression that a lot of liberals think Christianity and America were based on racism or slavery... For Billi to become a Christian means that Billi is likely a white supremacist or a dumbass GOP sympathizer.

Slavery was pretty universal. Even back in China, where there was no Bible and no Africans, slavery existed. We Chinese people would exploit other poorer Chinese people to keep slavery going. Rich people need labor and poor people need food... so that's probably how slavery got started around the globe. Besides slavery, Chinese people can be 'racist' amongst ourselves based on different regions. Taiwanese look just like Chinese but they don't get along.

Anyway, my point is, slavery and racism existed since the very beginning. These problems were not due to the Bible, white men, nor America. We can wipe out all copies of the Bible, slaughter all white people and nuke the entire Western civilization as we know it... slavery and racism would continue to exist. Blaming societal ills on any group of folks is just useless.

We the people, just don't know how to treat each other nicely. Jesus was sent here to show us how. Even in the West, there's still a lot to learn.

[neanderthal]

What the absolute fuck does any of that drivel horse shit (i'm being kind!) have to do with anything I said? Cheese and rice!

You talk talk talk about Jesus all the time but i bet you don't espouse any of his words (act like.)

Jesus fed the hungry, healed the sick, was compassionate to the down trodden. He taught the masses, embraced those society scourged, improved the lives of people. He didn't preach to the Pharisees, he didn't preach to the Romans, he didn't cater to the comfortable middle class; he primarily ministered to the poor. GO FUCKING DO THAT! rather than preaching to me about Jesus.

Go fucking work in a soup kitchen, a food bank, work in a battered women's shelter, go volunteer to mentor at a group home, tutor underprivileged kids. Go and visit with elderly people at a retirement home who have not had a visitor in years. Go talk to a homeless guy at the freeway off ramp, feed him, give him money, buy him medication, tell him you care then act like it. And DO it. THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO AS A FUCKING CHRISTIAN Don't fucking talk to me. Don't preach to me. Don't fucking proselitise me. Don't pass out pamplets or put flyers under people windshield wipers. Don't do any single godamned thing with middle fucking class America.

GO MINISTER TO THE POOR, SICK, NEEDY, HUNGRY, DOWNTRODDEN, MARGINALISED, OPPRESSED. You call yourself a Christian and don't do a single fucking thing he did! You are the worst sort of "christian." You are exactly who Mohandes Ghandi was talking about when he said "I like your Christ. I do NOT like your Christians; they are so unlike your Christ." He had you, exactly fucking you- in mind when he said that. You and people like you are why I don't go to church.

I'm going to hell, directly to hell, not passing GO, not collecting $200; i'm taking the fucking short cut! Go minister to the people Jesus would have ministered to. Not bloody me.

Nobody on this forum is who Jesus would have ministered to. All of us are varying levels of comfortable.

Cheese and fucking rice!

[Tom Servo]

To me the quote says America's values are racist.


Maybe i'm reading it wrong.

You're not reading it wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's not what PragerU was trying to say when they said it.

[Crazed_Insanity]

What the absolute fuck does any of that drivel horse shit (i'm being kind!) have to do with anything I said? Cheese and rice!

You talk talk talk about Jesus all the time but i bet you don't espouse any of his words (act like.)

Jesus fed the hungry, healed the sick, was compassionate to the down trodden. He taught the masses, embraced those society scourged, improved the lives of people. He didn't preach to the Pharisees, he didn't preach to the Romans, he didn't cater to the comfortable middle class; he primarily ministered to the poor. GO FUCKING DO THAT! rather than preaching to me about Jesus.

Go fucking work in a soup kitchen, a food bank, work in a battered women's shelter, go volunteer to mentor at a group home, tutor underprivileged kids. Go and visit with elderly people at a retirement home who have not had a visitor in years. Go talk to a homeless guy at the freeway off ramp, feed him, give him money, buy him medication, tell him you care then act like it. And DO it. THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO AS A FUCKING CHRISTIAN Don't fucking talk to me. Don't preach to me. Don't fucking proselitise me. Don't pass out pamplets or put flyers under people windshield wipers. Don't do any single godamned thing with middle fucking class America.

GO MINISTER TO THE POOR, SICK, NEEDY, HUNGRY, DOWNTRODDEN, MARGINALISED, OPPRESSED. You call yourself a Christian and don't do a single fucking thing he did! You are the worst sort of "christian." You are exactly who Mohandes Ghandi was talking about when he said "I like your Christ. I do NOT like your Christians; they are so unlike your Christ." He had you, exactly fucking you- in mind when he said that. You and people like you are why I don't go to church.

I'm going to hell, directly to hell, not passing GO, not collecting $200; i'm taking the fucking short cut! Go minister to the people Jesus would have ministered to. Not bloody me.

Nobody on this forum is who Jesus would have ministered to. All of us are varying levels of comfortable.

Cheese and fucking rice!

Ministering to the poor is definitely a must, but spreading the 'good news' to all humanity around the world is a must too!

Unless perhaps you can get an out clause because your not human? Are Neanderthals human? To me, close enough. I don't want to dehumanize neanderthals... :p

Cheeses fucking rice! That's some new kind of porn I've never seen before! Sounds cool man! :D

Anyway, IMHO, it's kinda stupid to blame immigrants outside of America for American's ills. Likewise, it's also kinda stupid to blame the white christian slave owning founding fathers as if they're the problem too.

Problems requires problem solving. Not people blaming. You can blame Trump and Billi for all eternity and the same damn problems would still exist.

If the dems truly solved the problem, republicans would either be much better or be gone by now.

Imagine a min wage law tied with inflation? No need to beg Joe Manchin and the republicans to raise it!

Imagine if we can come up with better and more responsible way of funding social security, maybe it'll make affordable care act easier to pass too?

I think founding fathers solved a lot of their problems at the time... in order to pave the way to make USA much greater than all other nations in the new world. We can't deny them credit for that. If we judge them now using today's standards and cancel them, what good would that do? They are part of our history, good, bad and ugly. Let's just focus on solving today's problem... and unless you guys are ready to mass shoot all conservative americans, we also need to figure out how to work with them. Because they're not going away and you can't ignore them all.

Besides ministering to the poor and preaching the good news, Jesus also taught me to love even my enemies.

This is the only way. There's no other way to make this world a better place.

[neanderthal]

You're not reading it wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's not what PragerU was trying to say when they said it.

I had to look at it a couple of times and try to see what else it could mean, but i kept settling on that one. Thanks for relieving my mind.

[George]

Don't pass out pamplets or put flyers under people windshield wipers.

Or leave religious messages, prayer cards, or fake money instead of (or in addition to small) tips for restaurant servers on Sundays after church. When I worked in an "upscale casual" restaurant full-time in the Bible Belt in the early 2000s, everyone dreaded the Sunday after-church crowd because some of them were notoriously bad tippers...and sometimes regulars, too!

"Why should I tip more than I tithe?"

https://i.insider.com/56845877dd089545558b4876?width=750&format=jpeg&auto=webp

And this short article is about a church in the very same state where I earned my knife callus.

https://thebitchywaiter.com/2018/05/calling-a-church-out-on-their-jesus-saves-cards-that-is-not-a-tip.html

It reminds me of a (fake) prayer: "Dear Lord, protect me from your followers." :lol:

[Crazed_Insanity]

Wow. To actually tip waiters with fake money like that or with just a 'special card' is not really glorifying God in any way...

That special card includes the church's contact info, I do hope the pastor would properly educate his flock on how to use that special card in the future.

[Tom Servo]

That reminds me so much of Chick Tracts. Those were awesome when we'd get them from the weird house on Halloween.

[Rare White Ape]

What the absolute fuck does any of that horse shit have to do with anything I said?

Gotta remember you're talking to a guy who mentions racism in China but fails to mention the Uyghurs.

[MR2 Fan]

That reminds me so much of Chick Tracts. Those were awesome when we'd get them from the weird house on Halloween.

I remember getting those, didn't remember what they were called...they were...interesting

[Crazed_Insanity]

Gotta remember you're talking to a guy who mentions racism in China but fails to mention the Uyghurs.

Wow. Way to miss my point.

My point is it’s not white Christian’s’ fault to enslave Uyghurs. It’s also not white Christian’s fault that Dalai Lama needs to run away from home. Christian white men do not own exclusive right to treat people badly. Root of the problem is not because of a specific group of people. Root of the problem is humanity’s heart. Even if the Chinese Commies lost power, historically speaking, another Chinese subgroup who gained ultimate power would end up exploiting other weaker groups. We don’t need to be white and Christian to do such things. Inflated egos corrupts the heart.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I remember getting those, didn't remember what they were called...they were...interesting

Never knew that existed until Swervo pointed it out. I googled and found out that they’re based in SoCal! Gee, where have I been? Anyway, probably better that way. Based on some that I saw, even I think they’re cringe worthy.

I found most religiously inspired fictional stories to be kinda stupid, including CS Lewis’s Narnia. Lord of the Ring is probably the only exception.

[Tom Servo]

I remember getting those, didn't remember what they were called...they were...interesting

They're still floating around. (https://www.chick.com/products/category?type=tracts#&&Category=All&SortBy=A-Z&PageNumber=1&Language=English&ShowCount=12&Status=Stock) While it's technically trying to sell copies, as far as I can tell you can read any one of them by just going to the product detail page, the tracts are all scanned in and displayed on there.

[FaultyMario]

They're still floating around. (https://www.chick.com/products/category?type=tracts#&&Category=All&SortBy=A-Z&PageNumber=1&Language=English&ShowCount=12&Status=Stock)

Poor Helen, she was conned by Satan's Catholic Church!

[Fiat500]

https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1243434-dc-comics

[Yw-slayer]

Loll

[Tom Servo]

Hah, nice, I had not seen that one before

[FaultyMario]

I feel somewhat responsible for Donald Trump. (https://taibbi.substack.com/p/the-incredible-political-and-media?r=5mz1&s=w)


He did it differently than me. See, and I can’t argue with the way he did it. He took on the Republicans and defeated them first, and then took on the Democrats and defeated them. I like to say he took on the Bushes and he destroyed the Bush dynasty, then he took on the Clinton dynasty and destroyed the Clinton dynasty. Where I would’ve taken them both on at the same time and I might not have been successful doing it that way. You can’t argue with Trump’s success.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Interesting read. Yeah, Trump did single-handedly destroyed the Bush and Clinton dynasty for sure. That is quite a remarkable achievement. It's just too bad he replaced them with something much worse!

It's also unbelievable that MSNBC would fire people because of their anti-war stance.

Also didn't realize censorship was done to folks other than Bernie Sanders. It's scary that MSNBC isn't really interested in ratings, but would make decisions based purely on politics. At least you think FOX just wants ratings? Anyway, you never know what are people's hidden agendas... that's why we have so many conspiracy theories... My conspiracy theory is that some one is grabbing all of them (W, Obama, Clintons, MSNBC, etc.) by their balls and orchestrating everything. Of course I do not know who that some one is. Jeff Esptein was probably that someone's employee too. I think Chick Tract would probably call that someone Satan. However, if MS can give us a clue, that someone is likely Bill Gates or perhaps Bill Gates is just part of it...

[neanderthal]

We said the supreme court was at stake in 2016.

https://twitter.com/SonofBaldwin/status/1532693271176261635?t=YRxqN4Zc6_JFjqtz2nN3Eg&s=19

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/supreme-court-sides-arizona-death-row-inmates

Fox news also reported that same story and it didn't seem like they're all cheering about the awesome supreme court ruling...

Barry Jones is also a white old man. So this is not white supremacists ruling against a black man.

To have evidences that can prove somebody's innocence, but court refuses to consider that and insists on execution anyways is just plain fucking wrong. Yet, only 3 out of 9 justices can see that? What is the definition of justice?

It's also interesting that we don't have much mainstream media covering this...

[Tom Servo]

Matt Taibbi is responsible for a lot of things, most of them being a big dummy.

[Rare White Ape]

We said the supreme court was at stake in 2016.

https://twitter.com/SonofBaldwin/status/1532693271176261635?t=YRxqN4Zc6_JFjqtz2nN3Eg&s=19

The man at the centre if this would probably be granted asylum in another country if he sought refuge.

[FaultyMario]

Matt Taibbi is responsible for a lot of things, most of them being a big dummy.

https://c.tenor.com/lwI6PhKv6a4AAAAC/take-it-back-arnold-schwarzeegger.gif

[neanderthal]

The man at the centre if this would probably be granted asylum in another country if he sought refuge.

He'd have to get out jail and out of the country/ into an embassy.

But thanks to fucknuts like billi we have justices who can't justice.

[FaultyMario]

Billi is not a (slave-owning) founding father.

Just sayin'.

[Rare White Ape]

we have justices who can't justice.

But it's still the land of the free, right?

Freedom of religion, freedom from government oppression, freedom of speech (ESPECIALLY on Twitter!), freedom to own a gun, freedom to change your gender if you feel more comfortable that way, freedom to marry whomever you want, freedom to get an abortion.

The list goes on. What an amazing country! All that freedom, right at your fingertips!

[Crazed_Insanity]

He'd have to get out jail and out of the country/ into an embassy.

But thanks to fucknuts like billi we have justices who can't justice.

As if blaming me could help anybody?

Anyway, even Fox News isn’t really gloating about this. WaPo has an opinion piece on it and I really don’t see much of the liberal mainstream media covering about such miscarriage of Justice.

Why? Why wouldn’t the liberal medias take the opportunity to reveal to Americans that Supreme Court justices no longer care for evidences that’d prove somebody’s innocence?

Oh yeah, it’s all Trump and Billi’s fault. Let’s just blame an ex- prez who’s no longer in power and a nobody so the world will be a better place?

Seriously. I’m m feeling another conspiracy coming up.

[neanderthal]

An American SHERO!!!!

This needs to be disseminated everywhere.

https://twitter.com/CBSMornings/status/1532395462468288514?t=NGCFDo7FBL60t9AI43_p5Q&s=19

[Tom Servo]

The bigger deal to me is that it sounds like she's on probation for something related and the cops violated her first amendment rights by telling her that if she told her story to the media, that'd be a probation violation and she'd be thrown in jail.

Happy that a judge agreed that that was bullshit and instead shortened her probation.

For anyone who might still be struggling with the concept, *that* is a violation of free speech. She wanted to speak, and the platform she was speaking to wanted to air her speech, then people acting as the authority of the state threatened her with jailtime for using that speech.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Who’s struggling with that?

Whenever someone tries to suppress speech is a violation of free speech.

Liberals didn’t want to entertain the idea government was possibly involved with Buffalo shooting. Similarly, conservatives do not want to hear that their cops are afraid of AR15 rifle.

When their core values are threatened, they probably will deem it necessary to shut people up to protect their BS.

Our politics has driven our politicians/justices to be so inconsistent… that it’s okay to take away rights when it comes to unborn babies, but it’s okay to take away living babies lives when it comes to freedom to own guns and freedom to not wear masks or get vaccines.

Sad.

At the very minimum, we should let GOP increase funding for mental healthcare?

We also need them to provide funding to modify all schools, malls, theaters and places of worship to only have ONE door?

And funding to put a guard at every door?

Oh wait, that school should already have a guard but was MIA for some reason…

It’s really heart breaking to learn that there are kids in US asking parents which picture of them will their parents pick to put on TV when their own school’s shot up… :|

[2ndMoparMan]

At the very minimum the GOP should be banned.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Dems need to clean up itself 1st…, so that they can freely expose the GOP.

At the moment, if Obama tries to prosecute W for war crimes, he’ll end up prosecuting himself too.

Naturally all we can do is just verbally blame W and be mad at him and then leave it at that.

The fact that we not only cannot successfully impeach Trump nor convict him of any crime is probably due to the same reasons. Implicate him will probably end up implicate self. Dems are lesser of the 2 evils, but still evil. If you don’t repent and change, naturally nothing will change. 2 parties are heading toward the ‘same’ direction. Granted, GOP is definitely leading the charge, but dems are only pretending to go the opposite direction. It’ll be much easier to just blame Trump and Billi…

Anyway, CCP is still the most evil. No way I’d ever vote for any of them. Not like they’ll let me. :p

I’m still more concerned about that Supreme Court story Neanderthal brought up. Why liberal media isn’t bringing this miscarriage of Justice to national attention? Is there more to the story? If justices really couldn’t care less about evidences of innocence, then I think we absolutely need to impeach them.

[FaultyMario]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FUYdIA_UYAUOSNV.jpg

- Wired, July '97.

[Yw-slayer]

Lollll

[neanderthal]

Who’s struggling with that?

Whenever someone tries to suppress speech is a violation of free speech.

Liberals didn’t want to entertain the idea government was possibly involved with Buffalo shooting. Similarly, conservatives do not want to hear that their cops are afraid of AR15 rifle.

When their core values are threatened, they probably will deem it necessary to shut people up to protect their BS.

Our politics has driven our politicians/justices to be so inconsistent… that it’s okay to take away rights when it comes to unborn babies, but it’s okay to take away living babies lives when it comes to freedom to own guns and freedom to not wear masks or get vaccines.

Sad.

At the very minimum, we should let GOP increase funding for mental healthcare?

We also need them to provide funding to modify all schools, malls, theaters and places of worship to only have ONE door?

And funding to put a guard at every door?

Oh wait, that school should already have a guard but was MIA for some reason…

It’s really heart breaking to learn that there are kids in US asking parents which picture of them will their parents pick to put on TV when their own school’s shot up… :|

You stupid horsefucker! Where are the facts that support government involvement in the buffalo shooting? Where?

What's really heartbreaking (it's not) is that every day you come up with things you say that show you reaching deeper depths of stupidity. When we think "how low can this idiocy go" you prove us too conservative in our estimates.

[Tom Servo]

Oh god, is he still on that?

What's fun is that it's based on a kernel of truth but he's ignoring a huge part of it. Yes, the FBI sometimes are the ones that help potential domestic terrorists get weapons and possibly encourage them to attempt to act on their beliefs, but here's the thing - they sell them fake weapons. They sell them fake bombs. There was a really good This American Life about some of the people held at Guantanamo, whether they would have actually attempted to carry out any terrorist actions if the undercover FBI agents hadn't actively goaded them into it.

The thing is, while it can be questionable as to whether the people who end up getting arrested would have actually done anything without the FBI getting involved, there's never been a case where the FBI actively got someone to *actually commit a violent act against Americans*. That would be insane. The idea is to arrest domestic terrorists *before* they act, and they never give them actual, real, working weapons.

So it's this complete misunderstanding of the whole thing fueled by an increasing vulnerability to conspiratorial thinking, and honestly is abhorrent enough that I've actually managed not to click "View Post" since I told him to go fuck himself if he's going to try to excuse neo nazi murderers and I plan to keep it that way, especially knowing that he's still doing it.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Dudes, as a scientist, am I only allowed to hold onto a single theory? Once I adopt a single theory, I must reject all other theories and shut them all down if possible?

Shouldn’t things be evidence based?

Once the true fact/evidence is presented, then we can safely reject all theories.

No need to shut down other narratives prematurely that’s all I was saying.

Both parties can suppress free speech as long as it’s convenient for them.

We need to have consistent application of laws and not allow political ideologies to drive it.

When evidence of innocence present itself, it shouldn’t be suppressed. When evidence of BS presents itself, you shouldn’t try to silence a heroic mom. Also, when there are insufficient evidences, I just don’t believe we need to prematurely shut down various theories or religions or whatever ideas you disagree with.

Free speech should be free. If the public is so easily duped by BS, the source of problem is probably not because of the said speech.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FUYdIA_UYAUOSNV.jpg

- Wired, July '97.

That is very interesting.

Climate scientists and Bible prophecies have also predicted that such ends are near…

However, there’s also another thing that they have in common, which is humanity still can make choices to save the world and still be hopeful.

However, that means repentance or a course correction is needed. Will we make the change or will we not make the change?

[Dicknose]

If the public is so easily duped by BS, the source of problem is probably not because of the said speech.

Says the guy posting BS

Remember free speech also includes people pointing out the BS.

[neanderthal]

Dudes, as a scientist, am I only allowed to hold onto a single theory? Once I adopt a single theory, I must reject all other theories and shut them all down if possible?

Shouldn’t things be evidence based?

Once the true fact/evidence is presented, then we can safely reject all theories.

No need to shut down other narratives prematurely that’s all I was saying.

Both parties can suppress free speech as long as it’s convenient for them.

We need to have consistent application of laws and not allow political ideologies to drive it.

When evidence of innocence present itself, it shouldn’t be suppressed. When evidence of BS presents itself, you shouldn’t try to silence a heroic mom. Also, when there are insufficient evidences, I just don’t believe we need to prematurely shut down various theories or religions or whatever ideas you disagree with.

Free speech should be free. If the public is so easily duped by BS, the source of problem is probably not because of the said speech.

Stop there. You're as much a scientist as I am the Princess of Monaco.

Scientists follow the evidence and deduce their conclusions from the facts. You couldn't tell a fact from a fiction with a computer, an encyclopedia, a team of fact checkers, and a whole goddamn library. If a giant ogre of a fact bit you on the hand you'd complain about Democratic attempts to rid the world of harmful pesticides. If we pointed out to you that the fact biting you on the hand had nothing to do with the Democratic party you'd tell us something about the Chinese Communist party, Jesus, or how free speech means we have to listen to/ tolerate vile thoughts and opinions by nazis.

I've seen outright lies that were more of a scientist than you are. I've heard, with my very own toes, nonexistent things that are more of a scientist than you. I take a dump every morning that's more of a scientist than you. I've tasted sounds that were more of a scientist than you.

If the previous paragraph doesn't make any sense to you, then you get an idea of what we see and have to deal with/ interpret every time you type something on this board.

You are the last person to be talking about "the public being duped by BS" when you couldn't trust the lady in 2016 because of some emails. Emails which, still to this day, no one can tell us what was in them. And to this day, despite the nonexistence of data supporting your position, as unlike a scientist would, you continue to hold that position.

Trying to talk to us about Americans who were "so easily duped." Go look in the mirror and you'll see one- and here's a hint; you won't see a scientist!

[Crazed_Insanity]

Says the guy posting BS

Remember free speech also includes people pointing out the BS.

What the fuck does that mean?

Do you see me excluding anybody? Shutting anyone down, ignoring/censoring anybody?

What have I forgotten?

You gonna accuse me of denying womens rights and gay marriage rights? And also accuse me of white supremacy and slave owning and launching the crusades? Hello? All Christians don’t all look alike, okay? Don’t be such a faithist!

I know what’s free speech. No need to remind me of things that I didn’t forget.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Stop there. You're as much a scientist as I am the Princess of Monaco.

Scientists follow the evidence and deduce their conclusions from the facts. You couldn't tell a fact from a fiction with a computer, an encyclopedia, a team of fact checkers, and a whole goddamn library. If a giant ogre of a fact bit you on the hand you'd complain about Democratic attempts to rid the world of harmful pesticides. If we pointed out to you that the fact biting you on the hand had nothing to do with the Democratic party you'd tell us something about the Chinese Communist party, Jesus, or how free speech means we have to listen to/ tolerate vile thoughts and opinions by nazis.

I've seen outright lies that were more of a scientist than you are. I've heard, with my very own toes, nonexistent things that are more of a scientist than you. I take a dump every morning that's more of a scientist than you. I've tasted sounds that were more of a scientist than you.

If the previous paragraph doesn't make any sense to you, then you get an idea of what we see and have to deal with/ interpret every time you type something on this board.

You are the last person to be talking about "the public being duped by BS" when you couldn't trust the lady in 2016 because of some emails. Emails which, still to this day, no one can tell us what was in them. And to this day, despite the nonexistence of data supporting your position, as unlike a scientist would, you continue to hold that position.

Trying to talk to us about Americans who were "so easily duped." Go look in the mirror and you'll see one- and here's a hint; you won't see a scientist!

If Obama could be prosecuted for war crime, you still think Hillary is an angel?

I trusted neither so I voted for neither.

You can’t bully me into anything. You can stop trying! :p

I guess you’re also right that I got my job and do my job by faith and thru prayers only. I’m just so clueless about science! :p

Look man, I know you’re frustrated, but taking it out on me won’t fix anything. Biden won. Dems have the majority and Billi is still fucking things up for ya! Why is Billi so powerful? You’re giving Billi way too much credit.

[neanderthal]

If Obama could be prosecuted for war crime, you still think Hillary is an angel?

I trusted neither so I voted for neither.

You can’t bully me into anything. You can stop trying! :p

I guess you’re also right that I got my job and do my job by faith and thru prayers only. I’m just so clueless about science! :p

Look man, I know you’re frustrated, but taking it out on me won’t fix anything. Biden won. Dems have the majority and Billi is still fucking things up for ya! Why is Billi so powerful? You’re giving Billi way too much credit.

See?!?!?!? Segue to Obama, because that's exactly what we were talking about. :blahblah:

[Rare White Ape]

Seems one person here keeps ignoring the 'reasonable' part of 'beyond all reasonable doubt'.

[Crazed_Insanity]

See?!?!?!? Segue to Obama, because that's exactly what we were talking about. :blahblah:

You’re the one who mentioned possibly prosecute him for war crimes.

I voted for Obama. If he could be that bad, naturally Hillary can only be worse! That’s why no trump nor Hillary for me. I think we’ve beaten this dead horse enough times. We won’t change your mind and you won’t change my mind. Let’s just agree to disagree.

[Tom Servo]

Woodward and Bernstein wrote an essay for WaPo on the parallels between Watergate and today. It's pretty good.

Woodward and Bernstein thought Nixon defined corruption. Then came Trump. (https://wapo.st/3thxsGO)

[Crazed_Insanity]

The fact that trump was more corrupt and posed a greater danger to our nation and yet after being impeached twice, lost an election once, we are currently still unable to stop him on his track from running again…

Of course Neanderthal would blame this on Billi. If Billi wasn’t here, maybe trump could end like Nixon did… however, I think the real culprit is probably not due to dumber voters, but because of a more corrupt overall government…

[neanderthal]

You all seeing the "arm the teachers" everywhere? Ark the nurses, arm the doctor's?!?!?

Did you see "arm the cashier's" or arm the black folk after New York? :erm:

[Rikadyn]

Well Huey Newton promoted arming black folk

[Rare White Ape]

Well okay then.

https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/crime/shooting-incident-north-st-louis-county-grocery-store-wellston-food-market/63-d569c7f8-e6ba-4f09-9181-bd73079d7b1a?fbclid=IwAR1JF-6xfKIvZNv2tHpSk2BmswYGpc-_yL8iMulg1hGiualOk9KqQ5404ic

https://scontent.fool1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/285702841_1404268243411545_556062178173083095_n.jp g?_nc_cat=109&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=_oot6Zc3jAcAX_CVcBv&_nc_ht=scontent.fool1-1.fna&oh=00_AT_45Inl0kikvNlJWOGPv1F8U4Q2peLB5ruwbhW_uMS_ Dw&oe=62A3935B

[FaultyMario]

How does this work?, do you lick first and then wait?, do you need a parking lot?

https://mma.prnewswire.com/media/1833177/USPS_Nancy_Reagan_Stamp.jpg

[Dicknose]

What the fuck does that mean?

I know what’s free speech. No need to remind me of things that I didn’t forget.

That you repeat BS even after people point out just how bad it is.
You argue that you can hold onto something until there is proof that it is wrong. While that is good in theory there is unlikely to be 100% certainty in most things - that doesn't mean you can treat the 98% likely as equal to the 2% likely. Which is what you seem to love to do. "2 sides" doesn't mean they are worth the same amount of respect or attention.

You keep sprouting it with "but I can hold a theory until its proven wrong"
Let the bullshit go and if it has merit it will come back.

Yes you have free speech - but use it wisely because using it on crap devalues your speech.

[Rare White Ape]

Well put DN.

Now let’s see if it bounces off again.

[MR2 Fan]

I realized something.... Florida (where I live, ugh) Governor Ron Desantis....reminds me of Director Krennic from Rogue One. ...completely ruthless, mean-spirited, envious of someone who was in a higher position than him, so he tries to do even more insane things.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I have to agree Desantis looks way more annoying that Trump and W.


That you repeat BS even after people point out just how bad it is.
You argue that you can hold onto something until there is proof that it is wrong. While that is good in theory there is unlikely to be 100% certainty in most things - that doesn't mean you can treat the 98% likely as equal to the 2% likely. Which is what you seem to love to do. "2 sides" doesn't mean they are worth the same amount of respect or attention.

You keep sprouting it with "but I can hold a theory until its proven wrong"
Let the bullshit go and if it has merit it will come back.

Yes you have free speech - but use it wisely because using it on crap devalues your speech.

Isn't it obvious that good and bad are relative terms? Liberals and conservatives cannot agree on truth, fact, and reality... let alone good and bad. You don't believe in absolute morality, right? So how can you be so sure that your 'good' is really 'good'?

That's the main reason for freedom of speech. I'm never the one promoting the FBI staged the Buffalo shooting conspiracy. Just saying that I wouldn't be surprised if that were the actual truth. Similarly, I wouldn't be surprised that cops were afraid of the mass shooter at Texas... and these officials at various locations may have their own interests to protect and therefore wish to shut certain narratives up. That's what I'm against.

Given the lack of solid evidences, I can only deduce that Covid19 was probably funded by US, carried out in China because we can't do such research on US soils. So both US and China have their interests to protect and would like everyone to believe mother nature did it. Even if that is the truth, I find it super pathetic that we've spent so much money on coronavirus research... and somehow we're still unable to see this coming and to be able to stop it in time. Anyway, I just thought Dr. Fauci's attempt to shut the lab leak theory down right away without evidence was more political than scientific.

Speaking of other kinds of BS that's unprovable... religion. Freedom of religion and freedom of speech is kinda similar. When you can't prove anything, why not let people believe whatever they want? Why do we need to control others' beliefs if they're not hurting anybody? If somebody wish to believe earth is flat and he's not hurting anybody, you have a problem with that? Boys can believe they're girls and girls can believe they're boys and yet if I believe in Jesus Christ, then I'm a hateful BSer? Why? Can we not have double standards?

As long as they are not hurting others, let people believe whatever they want. Hopefully they've chosen wisely. If someday they realized they chose poorly, then hopefully they'll repent and not make the same mistake twice.

[Tom Servo]

That you repeat BS even after people point out just how bad it is.
You argue that you can hold onto something until there is proof that it is wrong. While that is good in theory there is unlikely to be 100% certainty in most things - that doesn't mean you can treat the 98% likely as equal to the 2% likely. Which is what you seem to love to do. "2 sides" doesn't mean they are worth the same amount of respect or attention.

You keep sprouting it with "but I can hold a theory until its proven wrong"
Let the bullshit go and if it has merit it will come back.

Yes you have free speech - but use it wisely because using it on crap devalues your speech.

He's said before that when people push back against his ideas, it just makes him dig in his heels further. He's purposely created a feedback loop that amplifies the worst thoughts. The worse the idea is, the more pushback it'll get, and the more he'll gravitate towards it. He has intentionally put himself in a place where his worst thoughts get the most traction.

This time off has let me realize what an unserious person he is and he just thrives on angering people. It's been a pretty blissful few weeks.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Yeah, I think you are way too serious about me keeping an 'opened mind'.

Believing in Jesus can anger a lot of people too. I really don't care what other people think. I need to make my own choices because I'm ultimately responsible for my own life.

With that said, I want to be clear again that I don't know if FBI staged anything or not. I'd like investigations to continue just as the Texas shooting. Find the truth! Don't take offense too much/too quickly with whatever theories. If we can prove them wrong or find the real truth, then naturally all the ridiculous theories will be off the table. Even if truth cannot be found, just agree to disagree. I wouldn't bother getting too upset at people who disagree with me.

[neanderthal]

Yeah, I think you are way too serious about me keeping an 'opened mind'.

Believing in Jesus can anger a lot of people too. I really don't care what other people think. I need to make my own choices because I'm ultimately responsible for my own life.

With that said, I want to be clear again that I don't know if FBI staged anything or not. I'd like investigations to continue just as the Texas shooting. Find the truth! Don't take offense too much/too quickly with whatever theories. If we can prove them wrong or find the real truth, then naturally all the ridiculous theories will be off the table. Even if truth cannot be found, just agree to disagree. I wouldn't bother getting too upset at people who disagree with me.

This moronic drivel explains how, despite ZERO proof of anything substantial in the 40 years of smears, fearmongering, and outright falsehoods against Hillary Clinton, you believe the GQP propaganda against her.

TL-DR you're a top class fucking idiot.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don’t need to listen to GQP. Obama portrayed Hillary as the establishment during the primary and I agreed! However he disappointed me by becoming and endorsing Hillary. When I felt cheated, I usually won’t support cheaters. (Not to mention I felt Bernie was cheated)

I also didn’t want trump.

So that’s that.

Morons get to vote too. I’d suggest you not get too angry by moronic idiots.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Anyway, enough about Billi, heard a moving speech by Mathew McConaughey at the WH today. A Christian gun owning Hollywood celeb born in Uvalde. I wonder if he could help move the needle a bit in DC… so that political leaders will maybe do a bit more than just thoughts and prayers…?

[neanderthal]

I don’t need to listen to GQP.

Then you're gonna have to explain how you believe all those things about Hillary that were all false, but spouted endlessly by the republiQans.


Obama portrayed Hillary as the establishment during the primary and I agreed! However he disappointed me by becoming and endorsing Hillary. When I felt cheated, I usually won’t support cheaters. (Not to mention I felt Bernie was cheated)

I also didn’t want trump.

So that’s that.

Morons get to vote too. I’d suggest you not get too angry by moronic idiots.

You idiots keep saying Bernie was cheated. Do you know how to count? Because Hillary got more votes than he did, and that's how the system works.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Look, we've been thru this a gazillion times. Do we really need to continue to look at the past? If you must, remember how Obama attacked Hillary during the primary? During the 2016 primary, Hillary was already portrayed as the establishment, and Obama pretended to be more progressive. Obama won me over. The seed of distrust against Hillary was sowed then. Actually, it is kinda well established that Hillary wanted to be a president for years. Being ambitious is nice, but she just gave me the vibe of wanting to be one too much. I prefer a reluctant leader rather than somebody who wants to be a leader so bad!

This is also why Trump cannot be allowed to be president again. He not only wants to be president, but also a dictator! Hope tomorrow's hearing will seal his fate once and for all.

Regarding Bernie, I'm just gonna let that one go. Yeah, both Trump and Biden won fair and square back in 2016 and 2020. I can agree Bernie wasn't cheated by election fraud, but there were definitely behind the scene 'manipulations' going on.

[FaultyMario]

I know what’s free speech. No need to remind me of things that I didn’t forget.

A friendly reminder of what speech is:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwo-U9g88is

Just imagine if her speech was free.

[neanderthal]

Look, we've been thru this a gazillion times. Do we really need to continue to look at the past? If you must, remember how Obama attacked Hillary during the primary? During the 2016 primary, Hillary was already portrayed as the establishment, and Obama pretended to be more progressive. Obama won me over. The seed of distrust against Hillary was sowed then. Actually, it is kinda well established that Hillary wanted to be a president for years. Being ambitious is nice, but she just gave me the vibe of wanting to be one too much. I prefer a reluctant leader rather than somebody who wants to be a leader so bad!

You've oft repeated the lies of the RepubliQans so your "i only listened to what Obama said about it;" yeah ... that dog don't hunt.


This is also why Trump cannot be allowed to be president again. He not only wants to be president, but also a dictator! Hope tomorrow's hearing will seal his fate once and for all.

Regarding Bernie, I'm just gonna let that one go. Yeah, both Trump and Biden won fair and square back in 2016 and 2020. I can agree Bernie wasn't cheated by election fraud, but there were definitely behind the scene 'manipulations' going on.


You can behind the scenes shenanigans all you like but the votes are what are counted. Pretending you've accepted it while still holding on to your fantasy lie.

[2ndMoparMan]

Tonight will be entertaining TV.

[MR2 Fan]

Michigan leading GOP Governor candidate Ryan Kelley ARRESTED today...he was at the Capitol on Jan 6th

https://www.npr.org/2022/06/09/1103925150/michigan-candidate-for-governor-ryan-kelley-arrested-by-fbi-for-jan-6-involvemen?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[Tom Servo]

Heh

https://i.imgur.com/vJcNeHg.jpg

[neanderthal]

An effort to defund Faux News of advertising gets underway. (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/09/1103690822/group-aiming-to-defund-disinformation-tries-to-drain-fox-news-of-online-advertis)


Bravo ladies, and godspeed!

[Tom Servo]

From the SPLC:


Over 3/4ths of people who wrongly think the 2020 presidential election was “fraudulent, rigged and illegitimate” also somewhat agree with "great replacement" lies.

The violence on January 6 and in Buffalo last month are part of the same problem.


https://www.splcenter.org/news/2022/06/01/poll-finds-support-great-replacement-hard-right-ideas

[Rare White Ape]

I’d be willing to bet that all of the people mentioned would have an “open mind” because the discussion isn’t fully settled yet and their free speech is Very Important.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Free speech is definitely still important and I hope we will have an open and shut case unlike the previous impeachments…

I really was hoping to get trump legally thru courts because I’m not confident congress will be able to do much.

I’ll have an opened mind. Maybe congress will pleasantly surprise me.

[Crazed_Insanity]

A friendly reminder of what speech is:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwo-U9g88is

Just imagine if her speech was free.

For some reason my mobile phone can't see youtube videos on this forum anymore. Just saw this now on my laptop...

Anyway, when I'm promoting 'free speech', why is it that every one of you think I'm promoting the GOP version of free speech? Are you reminding me or reminding others with this youtube video?

Is it because as a Christian, I must be a republican Trump supporter?

Or if I don't stand with the Dems, then I must stand with the GOP?

Just for the record, I'm not happy with GOP suppressing free speech when they do it as well.

Free speech ought to be free. It may sound offensive, we don't have to agree with it nor believe it..., but just let people speak rather than forcibly shut them up... or pressure people enough that they don't dare speak freely...

I want to live in a free society that's all.

Anyway, just wondering what's the purpose of this friendly reminder?

Do you think I forgot something?

[Tom Servo]

I don't love Liz Cheney by any means, but man, she gave me goosebumps during the Jan. 6th hearing. I'm just watching it now, about half an hour in.

[Tom Servo]

Holy shit, that video.

[FaultyMario]

Holy shit, that video.

What?, what!?


What you guys? what?

[Tom Servo]

Oops, yeah, assumed context with Liz Cheney would be enough to know I was talking about the video they showed during the insurrection hearings last night.

Guardian has it on their YouTube.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdnNIQQOANk

[Rare White Ape]

Ehhh Trump still lost.

Has he been given his Twitter account back yet?

[FaultyMario]

Ex-president jailed as leader of ‘coup’. A court has found the former president guilty of orchestrating a coup during a political crisis, was sentenced to 10 years in prison. (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jun/11/bolivian-ex-president-jeanine-anez-jailed-as-leader-of-coup)

The similarities are remarkable, and I hope the processes remain similar.

[2ndMoparMan]

It won't. He's white and has money.

[Tom Servo]

Lots of "March for our Lives" protests along with lots of fascist counter protests. So far haven't heard of too much violence, but at a "Pride in the Park" event in Idaho, Patriot Front showed up ready to start roughing people up. Then they all got arrested.

Turns out there was an informant with the group who let the cops know they were showing up to the event with a stockpile of weapons in a U-Haul and "conspiring to riot."

[Rare White Ape]

Turns out there was an informant with the group who let the cops know they were showing up to the event with a stockpile of weapons in a U-Haul and "conspiring to riot."

Fuck yes! Hahaha!

[Leon]

Nice!

[neanderthal]

AOC will not commit to supporting Joe Biden on the next elections.

"Progressives,"right?

3919

Attaching link because my phone doesn't play nicely with forums.

https://twitter.com/JusticeDemWatch/status/1536015264546004993?t=74CsldaqiUlEqpjFl9mGqg&s=19

[Tom Servo]

Didn't watch the video, but was that committing to support him if he's the presumptive nominee or committing not to support a primary challenger? I wouldn't particularly have a problem with the latter, I didn't support him in the last primary either.

[MR2 Fan]

Do we have actual tweets from the justicedems account and not copy/pasted with different fonts used, etc? because that seems fishy.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Progressives have always been painted as out of touch and nobody likes anyways. So let’s just blame everything on the progressives and Billi…

AOC is committed to maintain liberal majority in congress, not committed to get any ONE person elected.

What is more important here? Democratic Party or Joe Biden?

[neanderthal]

Do we have actual tweets from the justicedems account and not copy/pasted with different fonts used, etc? because that seems fishy.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/young-turk-online-news-host-attempting-hostile-takeover/story?id=46466100

Starting at 24:00 minutes on the video. 34:10 for the lead up to the direct quote, which is at 34:28

35:30 "does it have to be hostile."
Cenk: Yes.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I don’t understand why must we preserve the pragmatic way of allowing Wall Street to control our politicians. Is the current way helping to kick GQP’s ass?

I thought he made a good case for hostile takeover… to restore democrats’ true name.

[neanderthal]

He made a good case for exactly why we scorn the progressives/ justice democrats; they're not our allies.

[Crazed_Insanity]

If dems are not influenced by wall st, or to truly represent the people, there’d be no need for Bernie and AOC.

It’s certainly nice to have wall st as your ally. When GQP rules, it’s also good to blame progressives and Billi.

[neanderthal]

If dems are not influenced by wall st, or to truly represent the people, there’d be no need for Bernie and AOC.

It’s certainly nice to have wall st as your ally. When GQP rules, it’s also good to blame progressives and Billi.

Bernie Sanders is the original Donald trump; scamming small donors out of their money in the perfect that he's going to change the world.
He's only going to the bathroom to scope out that new beach house he wants to buy in private on his phone.

[Crazed_Insanity]

You're giving Bernie Sanders too much credit. He won't be a very good reality TV celebrity for sure! :p

Also, do you think Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton are only interested in buying beach houses with their money?

Look, dems could take corporate money if they really need the money, I don't believe money is the root of evil. Only the love for money that can be problematic. If dems can take wall st money and still truly represent the will of the people, I'd be okay abandoning that anti-charismatic grumpy old man and I also think that barmaid from NY could just stay working bars too.

Do you honestly not see the corruption within the dems? Only the GQP and progressives are corrupt? Also, dems are only unable to do what they promised to do because of GQP and the progressives?

Well, I suppose you're right. If America also has a 1 party system like China, dems will probably look very much like the CCP. In the People's Republic of China, they don't really care much about the people either.

It's good that our government is setup to check and balance each other. Nobody's perfect, but at least nobody has absolute power...

Well, who knows what agencies like NSA or CIA are up to...

[neanderthal]

Money wins elections, dummy.

[G'day Mate]

These committee hearings are fun. Looking forward to finding out which members of congress sought pardons.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Money wins elections, dummy.

Money for sure helps, but will only take you so far… isn’t it obvious wall st prefers conservatives more and are only stringing the democrats along?

I just think dems really ought to be more powerful than they are now if dems truly do the will of the people. Panhandling from wall st obviously isn’t taking the dems very far.

Dems need to learn to rely on people. If the uncharismatic berni can raise enough money, so can any dem! No need to rely on wall st!

[Tom Servo]

Things are actually looking up here in LA. It'll be a runoff for mayor, but our local more progressive candidate has taken the lead over our pseudo-democrat billionaire real estate guy and a long entrenched city councilmember that we cyclists call "Roadkill Gil Cedillo" after he moved to block every single bit of infrastructure improvement proposed in his district has just lost the lead to a progressive candidate.

There may be hope yet.

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/poll-half-of-americans-now-predict-us-may-cease-to-be-a-democracy-someday-090028564.html

Wow, there's a bipartisan agreement that we Americans are losing faith in our democracy... more than half of us believe democracy is probably on its way out! :| For the record, I'm not that pessimistic yet.

I personally thought the Jan6 Trump failure was a testament of the strength of our democracy, but I guess most Americans see otherwise. Liberals are now seeing assholes rising up trying to overthrow the government and the conservatives are now seeing liberals trying to steal elections in multiple ways by allowing people without legit IDs from all over the world to be able to vote... (This kinda reminded me that perhaps we need to tie gun and voter registration together using the same standard...)

It's also interesting that this hearing is most watched by liberals, ignored by conservatives.

This is really not the best way to go. We probably shouldn't give Donald Trump the spotlight during prime time... just like we shouldn't give attention to mass shooters. This reality TV star will for sure leverage it one way or another.

If this partisan hearing successfully put away Trump, conservatives will be mad and their negative emotions will probably help create another asshole worse than Trump. If the hearing failed just as the impeachments, then it'll vindicate him and he'll probably win 2024 for sure.

I really wish they could just find a non-partisan way which Trump broke the law and put him away that way. Or at least disqualify him for all future political offices. Really shouldn't be that hard to find...

[2ndMoparMan]

We're not a democracy. we're a representiave republic.

[Crazed_Insanity]

No wonder the Republicans continue to beat out Democrats!

No wonder neither party listens to the will of the people because they don't have to represent the people.

[2ndMoparMan]

Pretty much.

[Dicknose]

We're not a democracy. we're a representiave republic.

But still a democratic representative...

How is the US system fundamentally any different from the many other countries that have democratically elected representatives and a constitutional limit on the govt??
Sure there are differences in the style of branches/houses of govt, their powers and who can resolve serious issues like dismissing a govt or leader.
But the US is pretty similar to most other western countries. And a lot different to 1 party democracies!

[Crazed_Insanity]

https://youtu.be/doExrsei79w

Bill Clinton talks about gun safety and democracy…

I don’t like his wife, but slick Willy is still pretty slick! If only that he could control his Willy better, he could’ve done a lot more and be one of the great modern day presidents! Too bad he had to the distracted to fight off Ken Starr at the later stage of his career…

Anyway, hopefully, like he said, Americans will really step back from the brink of whatever… whether it’s democracy or climate change… our children are counting on us.

[FaultyMario]

Julian Assange is one more of the casualties from the brutal and unjustified war on Iraq.

[Crazed_Insanity]

I see casualties as innocent passive victims living in Iraq… if you’re Assange or Snowden, you’re not really casualties, right? For sure they are not passive and actively tried to correct wrongs by leaking.

I wish congress would give them public hearings…

Speaking of hearings, it now looks like this is just going to be impeachment #3. Not even the purple states were swayed.

I wonder if they’ll try impeachment #4 and keep on making the Trump name more relevant and appealing come 2024.

[neanderthal]

Mike fucking Pence is going to end up the hero of all this for <checks notes> ... doing exactly what he was supposed to do.

[Crazed_Insanity]

His Christian faith is probably not very good when it comes to policy making, but worked out very well and saved our democracy on Jan 6th. The man at least has impeccable integrity. Thank God!

[2ndMoparMan]

His Christian faith is probably not very good when it comes to policy making, but worked out very well and saved our democracy on Jan 6th. The man at least has impeccable integrity. Thank God!

Shame he's a science denying lunatic as well.

[Crazed_Insanity]

Nobody’s perfect. Just saying he’s instrumental at denying Trump the lunatic.

Even Neanderthal thought he’s a hero. You don’t really need to be that scientific to be a hero. :p

[neanderthal]

His Christian faith is probably not very good when it comes to policy making, but worked out very well and saved our democracy on Jan 6th. The man at least has impeccable integrity. Thank God!

He won't consort with women if his wife isn't present, but yeah, lets pretend he's not a dick

[Crazed_Insanity]

I didn’t hear much about his dick from the hearing, but he certainly has the balls to stand up against Trump even when faced with the possibility of being hanged!

[neanderthal]

Tell me this tweet doesn't sound exactly like billi.

https://twitter.com/DougJBalloon/status/1538704462549745665?t=MRJrNYSj9QnIadR9ryUt8g&s=19