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Thread: The anti-vax thread

  1. #11
    Senior Member G'day Mate's Avatar
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    Only if the vaccine is 100% effective ... which it often isn't

  2. #12
    What fresh hell is this? overpowered's Avatar
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    I read a better description for this specific issue but I can't remember the name of it and I've been having trouble with searches. The gist was the more you show people facts and logic, the more determined they are to disbelieve the facts and logic. It comes up in pretty much all science denial scenarios.

    The Dunning-Kruger effect seems to come up a lot with programmers. I've had to deal with a lot of terribly incompetent programmers who thought they were awesome. If you write a 3000 line doGet() method for a Java servlet, you are not awesome. You don't even know basic object oriented design.
    Last edited by overpowered; February 1st, 2015 at 09:59 PM.

  3. #13
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    I dont think it is helped by people being told "dont be sheep" and "think for yourself"
    This helps reinforce that you need to do your own thinking. But combine that with the Dunning-Kruger and you get people who not only are ignorant, unaware, but are being told that they are doing the right thing by using their own (limited) knowledge.

    As much as you should think for yourself, its also important to realise that on very technical topics we should rely on others who have trained/studied for years.
    Thinking for yourself is good. But you cant just will yourself to be an expert.

    To raise another issue - why does this seem to be a bigger issue in some countries rather than others?
    Why do Germans appreciate technical training and knowledge more than Australia, which is probably still more than the US?
    Its not about religion - Angela Merkel is religious, but also a PhD in Chemistry and from the germans Ive spoken to, they acknowledge that her PhD in science as an important fact in her ability to lead.

  4. #14
    Consultant KillerB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G'day Mate View Post
    Only if the vaccine is 100% effective ... which it often isn't
    Actually the measles vaccine is nearly 100% effective. The measles virus doesn't appear to mutate very often - its genetic makeup is very stable.

    Contrast this with the flu vaccine, which tries to account for many different strains that mutate quite quickly.

  5. #15
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    Honestly, I think what it comes down to, at least in the US, is the fact that it seems like there are constantly studies coming out that contradict earlier findings, specifically in relation to health issues.

    I think people have grown suspect of trusting any health related scientific advice because all too often results of studies seem to be overturned by new studies later on.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sad, little man View Post
    I think people have grown suspect of trusting any health related scientific advice because all too often results of studies seem to be overturned by new studies later on.
    I would really like to believe that. I know that applies to me. But I seriously doubt most people have the presence of mind to do anything but exhibit knee-jerk reactions to whatever is in their face. The number of completely idiotic things people say grows daily, and a significant number of them originate from the media or, worse, the media ten years ago. I think most people develop an opinion and stick to it, never ever thinking they should re-evaluate it.

    It's difficult not being able to just rubber stamp dilemmas that face you and that's why people do it. "I did it this way yesterday, I'll do it again today" saves time and effort. But personally I have a hard time with that - I feel that more often than not there is new information to be incorporated into a process and it's worth learning about. Stuff takes me longer as a result, but it's the way I roll.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Fogelhund's Avatar
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  8. #18
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    I agree with SLM and TSG. For me, the best example comes is "recommended eating habits".

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by overpowered View Post
    I read a better description for this specific issue but I can't remember the name of it and I've been having trouble with searches. The gist was the more you show people facts and logic, the more determined they are to disbelieve the facts and logic. It comes up in pretty much all science denial scenarios.
    What you're looking for there is called the backfire effect.

  10. #20
    What fresh hell is this? overpowered's Avatar
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